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JoceAndChris
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Work is for money.
Great, another PPUK outing! Anymore?
Great, another PPUK outing! Anymore?
Nigel Watts
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Some wallpapers from the hall of my 1840 house:
The first and probably original layer found behind paneling - characteristic fake stone block. Second layer was similar.
Third layer (the ochre coloured one) and the fourth (the pink one).
Sample of layer three - a "sanitary paper" with cracked glaze effect.
Samples of layer four
Layer five. This appears to have been varnished. Some unvarnished areas were found which had much fresher colours.
There were at least four more layers on top of these. In the hall some of the layers (four and five?) had different but matching patterns below and above dado level even though there is no dado rail. I think I look some photos of these but can find them just now.
The first and probably original layer found behind paneling - characteristic fake stone block. Second layer was similar.
Third layer (the ochre coloured one) and the fourth (the pink one).
Sample of layer three - a "sanitary paper" with cracked glaze effect.
Samples of layer four
Layer five. This appears to have been varnished. Some unvarnished areas were found which had much fresher colours.
There were at least four more layers on top of these. In the hall some of the layers (four and five?) had different but matching patterns below and above dado level even though there is no dado rail. I think I look some photos of these but can find them just now.
Nigel Watts
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My previous house in Islington, which I bought from the journalist Charles Moore, was built in about 1850.
Much of its original fake stone block scheme in the hall had survived underneath later layers:
These photos have yellowed a bit. The cornice in the first one was more grey and less green.
I was decorating the hall at the time my first son was born so was under a tight deadline to finish it. I chose a striped paper of a very similar colour:
Much of its original fake stone block scheme in the hall had survived underneath later layers:
These photos have yellowed a bit. The cornice in the first one was more grey and less green.
I was decorating the hall at the time my first son was born so was under a tight deadline to finish it. I chose a striped paper of a very similar colour:
Michelle
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Ooh, that's fascinating, particularly the fake stone block. Did you photograph and then remove the stone block paper, or did you paper over it? I find this situation so tricky... With our house, my boyfriend says I'm trying to live in a museum.
Penners
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Those scraps of wallpaper from your 1840 house are fascinating, Nigel. Particularly Layer 5, which seems to incorporate roses, rosebuds and McCain Oven Chips.
JoceAndChris
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Hehehe - I like the rose and oven chip one. What a wonderful find for you Nigel. The fake stone block paper is fab, if I could have found something like that I'd have been tempted, but there's nothing like that available as far as I can see (and I must have looked at every wallpaper in the world now!)
Your last house- gorgeous too!
Your last house- gorgeous too!
JoceAndChris
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Miss Michelle said:
The hoity toity response to that is that not every one is in a position to celebrate and enjoy our built heritage in the way that period property owners can! And then set him to work building a display cabinet for all of the historic treasures you unearth!
I used to think sand smooth, strip back, get a nice finish - but my feelings have shifted and I now think paint/paper over the top, if it's not entirely smooth - well, that's all part of the house's history.
Of course that doesn't apply if the paint is causing damp, or if the paint has clogged intricate mouldings.
Nigel Watts
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In my previous house I think I papered over the old paper. In my current one it was all stripped. The underlying plasterwork needed quite a bit of work and I had hired decorators to do the work.
The stone block paper is not as simple as it looks. I think it had been hung in horizontal layers with the edges printed with the lines. Whether the veining was printed or painted on later is not clear, and the whole thing appears to have been finished with a tinted oil-based glaze.
The stone block paper is not as simple as it looks. I think it had been hung in horizontal layers with the edges printed with the lines. Whether the veining was printed or painted on later is not clear, and the whole thing appears to have been finished with a tinted oil-based glaze.
Flyfisher
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The stone block paper/painting is certainly a work of art but it seems an odd choice for that type of house - a sort of internal stone-cladding.
Was the 'stone look' particularly fashionable in years gone by?
Was the 'stone look' particularly fashionable in years gone by?
JoceAndChris
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Yes it was! (though I'm sure Nigel can expand a lot more than I can)
Here's a excerpt fom the VnA article referenced earlier in this thread:
"Papers imitating marbling and woodgrain were produced throughout the 18th and 19th centuries and were popular for halls and passageways. As J.C. Loudon explained (in his 'Encyclopaedia', first published in 1833), for entrance lobbies and staircases one of the best designs was a paper 'simply marked with lines in imitation of hewn stone' because if it was damaged a piece the size of one of the stones could be renewed without the repair being obvious.
Despite these practical advantages such papers were frowned upon by the tastemakers of the later 19th century, including Robert Edis, Eastlake and Oscar Wilde, because they objected to the sham of imitating one material in another."
This bit on wallpaper is interesting in "Georgian House Style", by Ingrid Cranfield:
"In the second half of the eighteenth century, archaeological correctness led to the widespread adoption of the colours of ancient Rome and Greece, notably terracotta red. Marbling and graining became fashionable again...
While the first English paper employed only black and white, the use of distmper colours thickened with glue, followed in the 1850s by oil colours, made a variety of designs possible: imitation plasterwork, damask or leather geometric shapes, marbling, flowers, archtectural motifs such as pillars and arches, urns and niches or simple stripes..."
It appears they had a great variety to choose from, maybe even more than we do as architectural papers appear to have fallen completely out of fashion.
These are the only affordable modern ones I could find - yuk.
http://www.creativewallcovering.com/wallpaper-4.html
It's the "vinyl-coated" that really gets me down!
Here's a excerpt fom the VnA article referenced earlier in this thread:
"Papers imitating marbling and woodgrain were produced throughout the 18th and 19th centuries and were popular for halls and passageways. As J.C. Loudon explained (in his 'Encyclopaedia', first published in 1833), for entrance lobbies and staircases one of the best designs was a paper 'simply marked with lines in imitation of hewn stone' because if it was damaged a piece the size of one of the stones could be renewed without the repair being obvious.
Despite these practical advantages such papers were frowned upon by the tastemakers of the later 19th century, including Robert Edis, Eastlake and Oscar Wilde, because they objected to the sham of imitating one material in another."
This bit on wallpaper is interesting in "Georgian House Style", by Ingrid Cranfield:
"In the second half of the eighteenth century, archaeological correctness led to the widespread adoption of the colours of ancient Rome and Greece, notably terracotta red. Marbling and graining became fashionable again...
While the first English paper employed only black and white, the use of distmper colours thickened with glue, followed in the 1850s by oil colours, made a variety of designs possible: imitation plasterwork, damask or leather geometric shapes, marbling, flowers, archtectural motifs such as pillars and arches, urns and niches or simple stripes..."
It appears they had a great variety to choose from, maybe even more than we do as architectural papers appear to have fallen completely out of fashion.
These are the only affordable modern ones I could find - yuk.
http://www.creativewallcovering.com/wallpaper-4.html
It's the "vinyl-coated" that really gets me down!
Flyfisher
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Interesting. Thanks for those extracts, although I'm not entirely sure what "archaeological correctness" has to do with decorating brick-built Georgian houses - it just sounds like a way of retrospectively justifying the fashion of marbling and graining.
This is the most exciting wallpaper find at our place. Perhaps an early example of archaeological correctness in homage to stone-built houses and to decoratively disguise the original timber-frame construction? Or, a 1960s bodge using old rolls of naff wallpaper stuck pattern-side directly onto plasterboard and then painted white. I'm no expert, but I have my suspicions. :lol:
This is the most exciting wallpaper find at our place. Perhaps an early example of archaeological correctness in homage to stone-built houses and to decoratively disguise the original timber-frame construction? Or, a 1960s bodge using old rolls of naff wallpaper stuck pattern-side directly onto plasterboard and then painted white. I'm no expert, but I have my suspicions. :lol:
JoceAndChris
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:lol: How something so romantically lovely can be so perverted in 200 years...
The archaelogical correctness, as I'm sure you know, refers to the Georgian mania for referencing classical antiquity, so nothing retrospective about that analysis. It appears that they wanted their houses to look as much like an archaeological digging site as possible. The earth colours- Pompeian red, dusty yellow - abound, the papers are full of columns and ruins, and fashionable shelves would be littered with Roman artefacts.
Cheap looking bare wood was of course despised and made to look more expensively in keeping with such noble classicism by effects of graining. Or just painted off-white.
I tried out Sudbury yellow yesterday, which FnB claim is "an interpretation of... John Fowler's wall colour for the staircase at Sudbury Hall, Debyshire" It's an intense, mustardy, earthy shade. I'm currently very interested in reproducing this ( but it's proving difficult to convince Chris)
http://www.printrooms.com/whatisaprintroom.html
I think it's a fascinating concept, and could be created more cheaply than that site offers by using (black and white) antique prints off FleaBay, and either stencilling the borders or printing them out with good quality paper. The images are covered with a glaze to protect them. Just think of the fun of choosing prints of buildings, for example, with which you had a personal connection, or drawings of local scenes.
Of course really to get the proper authentic print room look I need to go off on the Grand Tour of Europe at once and return with my trunk full of collected prints of its crumbling glory!
Flyfisher said:
The archaelogical correctness, as I'm sure you know, refers to the Georgian mania for referencing classical antiquity, so nothing retrospective about that analysis. It appears that they wanted their houses to look as much like an archaeological digging site as possible. The earth colours- Pompeian red, dusty yellow - abound, the papers are full of columns and ruins, and fashionable shelves would be littered with Roman artefacts.
Cheap looking bare wood was of course despised and made to look more expensively in keeping with such noble classicism by effects of graining. Or just painted off-white.
I tried out Sudbury yellow yesterday, which FnB claim is "an interpretation of... John Fowler's wall colour for the staircase at Sudbury Hall, Debyshire" It's an intense, mustardy, earthy shade. I'm currently very interested in reproducing this ( but it's proving difficult to convince Chris)
http://www.printrooms.com/whatisaprintroom.html
I think it's a fascinating concept, and could be created more cheaply than that site offers by using (black and white) antique prints off FleaBay, and either stencilling the borders or printing them out with good quality paper. The images are covered with a glaze to protect them. Just think of the fun of choosing prints of buildings, for example, with which you had a personal connection, or drawings of local scenes.
Of course really to get the proper authentic print room look I need to go off on the Grand Tour of Europe at once and return with my trunk full of collected prints of its crumbling glory!
Flyfisher
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Don't be too sure.JoceAndChris said:
These discussions, fascinating though they are, are making me realise my woeful lack of historical stylistic knowledge. So I'm learning loads but am feeling a bit daunted about choosing an eventual decorative style. At least I can put off any serious decisions until next year, probably.
Perhaps a Grand Tour is the answer. :wink:
Nigel Watts
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This is coming up at auction tomorrow:
http://www.bloomsburyauctions.com/detail/709/205.0
as is this:
http://www.bloomsburyauctions.com/detail/709/203.0
So tempting! But I shall try to resist.
http://www.bloomsburyauctions.com/detail/709/205.0
as is this:
http://www.bloomsburyauctions.com/detail/709/203.0
So tempting! But I shall try to resist.
JoceAndChris
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Aaaaagh-Nigel- if you buy those I'll be too jealous to speak to you again!
Well, I think you'll have to go for an eclectic, lovely mix- same as your house. You aren't constrained, as I am, by the rigid purity of having your architecture and internal structures chiefly Georgian.
Also you aren't as uptight! :lol: :wink:
Flyfisher said:
Well, I think you'll have to go for an eclectic, lovely mix- same as your house. You aren't constrained, as I am, by the rigid purity of having your architecture and internal structures chiefly Georgian.
Also you aren't as uptight! :lol: :wink:
JoceAndChris
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:lol: very true!!
Although certain Ppukers do their damndest to egg me on - you know who you are!! :wink:
Although certain Ppukers do their damndest to egg me on - you know who you are!! :wink:
A bit more about St. Helen, Ranworth...JoceAndChris said:
http://www.norfolkchurches.co.uk/ranworth/ranworth.htm
The red and green flower patterns are obscured by pews but a peek gives you an amazing idea of the vibrancy of colour.
I'm not a bit fan of churches in general but it is well worth a visit, to view the the Ranworth Antiphoner and Cantor's desk as well as the screen. I'm looking forward to them finishing repairs to the tower so I can finally get up there.
If you're out this way then I can also recommend my local for a very hearty and delicious lunch. It's a pleasant mile and a half walk though you may have trouble climbing the tower if you go for 3 courses first!
http://www.theshipsouthwalsham.co.uk/