Which shellac sealant?

[JoceAndChris]

Oooh I dunno, what if I'm told my floor looks nothing like any floor that ever was in the history of the cottage and I've created an insipid pastiche? :wink: :lol:

 

[Gareth Hughes]

You haven't chucked the old boards away and replaced them with routed plywood, though, have you?

 

[Tom]

Aha! Maybe she has and she daren't share the secret :wink:

Jaqy

 

[JoceAndChris]

Ooh those B & Q boards come up a treat, lovely bright tiger-fur colour, no nasty wormholes or hob nailed boot marks from the soldiers billeted there in the war.

 

[Tom]

:lol: :lol: I don't think anyone's going to believe that!! :lol: :lol:

Jaqy

 

[JoceAndChris]

OK- here we go.

Here it is before cleaning:

Before cleaning again:

After cleaning. Dad's feet, felled with exhaustion!

And then with only one coat of the Liberon Floor sealer (whcih contains oil, but is not the same as Linseed Oil) and no buffing yet:

 

[yamin]

Wow! What a change, thats beautiful! Hope you revived your dad :?

 

[JoceAndChris]

Thanks for nice comment- the colour's a bit wet in this still so it'll be interesting to see how it mellows and softens.

Floor restoration seems to make the single most difference to the appearance o the room IMO. Loved your flagstones too, can't wait to have a go at mine.

Dad's having a day off - and I hope, though doubt, is having a good rest before the onslaught of waxing.

 

[Flyfisher]

Wow indeed. Just the cleaned up floor looks pretty good to me (most of our floorboards look like your first photo) so your results are very encouraging. Thanks!

 

[JoceAndChris]

No, thanks to you lot for keeping me going at this- 2 weeks ago I was all set to schlop over the F & B on this floor.

 

[FamilyWiggs]

Wonderful Joce, just wonderful.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Well done, the floor looks fantastic.

 

[JoceAndChris]

Thanks so much for the encouragement, will post pics of the final finished floor, and room, in about a week. There have been so many threads about this room: wiring, lighting, cornice, sill repair, fireplace, floor, paint, lime plastering - not to mention rebuilding 18th C shutter sections, making curtains, and sourcing furniture - it's been around 8 months now of working on this room whilst living in the hideous, cramped bedroom next door -just can't wait for it to be over. One thing's for sure, there would have been some very bad decisions made were it not for PPUK!

 

[rebeccac]

About the Maldon Mud race ; I actually won a cup very many years ago (1976 or so) but I digress,we bought shellac flakes on ebay and then after much difficulty found what Italians call Meths! Alcohol etilico if anyone wants to know!

We have used the shellac diluted with meths to make a thin varnish that we paint over some stained stones and plaster effected by a fire.e tried cow manure but it was no good as 1. it stunk and 2. it was completly useless.

Anyway ebay seems to be the best place to get it although with the current postal strikes it may be some time coming?

 

[Toby Newell]

No, no, no, no, no (voice of Vicar of Dibly old guy)

No! Traffic wax is, as far as I know it, a horrible parafin/silicone modern wax which should never go NEAR your bare wood!!! People get confused when I talk about Bona Traffic floor lacquer, completely different! Traffic wax is one of the worst things you can put on your floor! You will never be able to refinish it in anything else. Traffic wax is a commercial product used for treating high foot traffic and heavy use floors by use of a 17" spray buffing machine.

Shellac will NOT flake off and will soak into the wood IF you have prepared it properly! If you don't remove all of the old wax it won't adhere! Shellac is THE most unreactive and stable finish you can buy. Proof, floor seal and floor barrier seal... shellac, seals in contamination, knotting compound, seals in resin... shellac. If your shellac flakes off, your floor needs a serious clean/sand before you try again.

I would seal in with standard 2 and a half pound cut (see my article for details) special pale polish, pale transparent polish or shellac floor seal. Basically any shellac that has been heavily dewaxed. You only need one or two coats, then wax BY HAND! there is no machine that can wax for you! The company that 'waxed' the floor, like 99% of all flooring companies have absolutely no idea what they are doing. Mind you, not their fault, how many of their Great Grandfathers were finishing wood 100 years ago? Wax oil and oil finishes are MODERN CHEAP products and NOT traditional, they were never ever used and are sold to be used by unskilled people for low cost.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Toby, I have the greatest of respect for your expertise, knowledge and experience with wood finishes, however, I must defend my, and maybe that of others, usage of traffic wax . When faced with many original wooden floors to look after, I asked a few questions in houses that are open to the public ( naming no names). at the time, some 20 years or so ago, Traffic Wax was suggested as a good option, for, as you point out, heavy traffic areas, which ours were . Applied by hand from a tin and buffed with a small floor polisher twice a year suited our domestic situation very well and has done no harm. Maybe there is a difference between the manufactureres I used ( not advertising of course) Johnsons TW. I also used it on a brand new oak floor which now survives all manner of toys and claws.

Sometimes, those of us who balance careers, children, grandchildren etc amongst restoring a house just have to compromise, be budget conscious, quick, practical and get the job done with minimum damage to our listed and period properties.

Given the choice I am sure that some of us would be quite happy to melt beeswax, turps,and essential oils etc, employ a Tweeney to bring the house to a rich glowing finish on a daily basis. I wish---

 

[Gareth Hughes]

Given the choice I am sure that some of us would be quite happy to melt beeswax, turps,and essential oils etc, employ a Tweeney to bring the house to a rich glowing finish on a daily basis.

Nowadays you've got to be careful to keep the Tweeny in a good mood, though, or she might bring your house to another sort of glowing finish, expensive rahter than rich.:shock:

 

[Tom]

Wax oil and oil finishes are MODERN CHEAP products and NOT traditional, they were never ever used and are sold to be used by unskilled people for low cost.

Toby, are you saying that Linseed Oil is not a traditional product? I've just bought 10L for my floors :shock: Should I not be using it?

Jaqy

 

[JoceAndChris]

"Oil finishes in general are low build, low penetration and have low to medium durability. They can look very attractive but contrary to popular belief have poor water resistance on non-oily woods. Widely misrepresented as having greater strength and water resistant properties they need to be maintained regularly at least every year, preferably every few months. Apart from their totally natural appearance (although the wood does darken considerably over time) their main benefit is that they are very easy to apply and can be "spot repaired" if partly damaged without renewing the whole surface. Uses are as for shellac but remember, it will require regular recoating. Polyurethane oil varnishes are fairly easy to apply and applied clear over previously stained and sealed wood with careful sanding can look good. Use many thin coats, apply with good soft brush, "lay off" in direction of grain (feather the top of the coat out) and watch for drips. Only really used by professionals for exterior work, but probably one of the easiest finishes to apply properly for the amateur. Apply thinly as possible, if your arm is not aching you are not going thin enough! Use a decent quality clean brush. It is possible to get a decent finish with PU it just takes time."

Toby Newell, Definitive Guide to Wood Finishing

I think Toby will say that oil on its own is not really a professional job, he's very keen on sanding, sealing and waxing in a multi layered process. Some of his floors have 10 coats of wax.

Agree with Joss that it can all be too much - I'm shattered and as you know was contemplating my own mortality and impermanence last night, I lay this maudlin state directly at the door of Too Much Waxing, and not being a professional French Polisher!

 

[Tom]

So, Joce, you're saying that Toby recommends something allong the lines of 2 or 3 coats of Oil and then several coats of Wax...BUT...having tried this, you're not recommendint it because it's difficult to obtain / retain a good finish. Have I understood that correctly?

This is a job I'm dreading because there seems to be so much conflicting advice :shock: Just when I think I've got my head around it (which I thought I had) it all gets thrown into a cocked hat :roll: Out of all the work we've done on this house, the dread of getting this wrong has only been surpassed by that caused by the Limecrete / UFH floor (and if you do some digging, you'll probably find that I drove people nuts asking the same questions over and over until I was convinced I was doing the right thing!! :lol: )

I know I'm asking for the impossible but I could really do with someone saying 'Look, this is what you need to do' :?

Jaqy