Would someone like to rescue this house?

[vicky whitworth]

Oh gosh, I know how tense these situations are and how emotions run so high. I too have felt angered and frustrated and upset over conservation issues (see post on Chardstock village school) and can hear from your posts how important these issues are for you both. It's so easy to misinterprete what people are trying to say and convey on a forum but it seems to me we are a small community of like-minded people who maybe have slightly differing points of view but compared with most people I think we are all trying to go in the same direction. Vicky

 

[Nemesis]

No Vicky, you don't really know the inside story. I know the amount of time and effort put into this, over years, and I feel simply appalled that yet again those without any idea make snide remarks.

http://www.savebritainsheritage.org

Not an organisation which has much cash, or indeed many paid staff, but which has driven forward so much regarding conservation over decades, and I am proud and humble to have been part of that history. So I do know, more than I can assure you many others, what the true situation is. Castle House is a building we all love and want a future for, and so much work has gone into this. As with so much else. But only so many hours in a day...

 

[vicky whitworth]

I'm not sure I really want to get involved in this. And you're right I don't know anything about Castle House so I fully accept I have no right to have an opinion about it. But I do have a right to express an opinion about trying to work together towards a common cause and I can't see that Bea did anything other than express an opinion which was hardly in intemperate language. I think I too may back out of this web site, which is a huge shame as I have gained so much and so valued people's advice and views. Good bye. And thank you to those who have helped me so much. Vicky

 

[Nemesis]

Well, no you don't know. And this isn't the first time we have had this whingeing, and I'm not sure what it was intended to achieve. Everything possible which could be done has been done, and at no public expense either. Far from it. Maybe the Strummerville Foundation would like to chip in too, and the problems with the Heritage Lottery Fund, that's only the start.

So no, I take few prisoners these days. Conservation at the sharp end is a hard and bloody business, as maybe you will find out. Few are championing the buildings. In the meanwhile, you maybe would like to give some of your cash to the new scaffolding, now that the local authority problems which caused the lack of it have been sorted out. For myself, I still live in a partial wreck, so much of my time, emotions, expertise and finances having been given up to SAVE over the years. That's, by the way, as with so many of us, unpaid. Because I care.

http://www.vam.ac.uk/images/image/26455-popup.html

 

[Flyfisher]

Caring is one thing but alienating people who share the same interest, albeit perhaps not so fervently, is surely counter-productive and more likely to drive people away from helping out than encouraging them to get more involved.

 

[skier-hughes]

and so far, as bea2 has pointed out, those who "care" have actually done very little productively, maybe time to stop the words and start the actual actions that will save these buildings that are so loved.

 

[Moo]

Bea2 seems to be someone who, like the rest of us, cares about old buildings. I expect that, again like the rest of us, she wouldn't claim that she knows absolutely everything about an issue and would respond to any information that might help fill in some of the gaps.
But all she got was an outburst of angry defensiveness to no purpose at all, other than letting off steam, and I'm not sure what it was intended to achieve

This is supposed to be a forum, where information is shared and discussions take place. It is not (and should not be used as) a battlefield.

 

[Nemesis]

Well, as I seem to be the only one with the full information, but I note those usual suspects with the long knives are, as ever, happy to spout and try to stir things up (no doubt feeling terribly childishly pleased with themselves) without having the information, I point out that we have had this conversation before, despite the poster having registered under a different name, and I'm not at all sure what the purpose of it is. I look out onto a Grade I building at the highest category of risk on EH's register - no-one is even attempting to rescue it. On the other hand, people have been working tirelessly to find a future for Castle House, despite all manner of demoralising setbacks and broken promises, and if anyone local thinks they can form a BPT and seek the large pot of cash needed to repair it and give it a long term future, then I am sure arrangements can be made to pass it on to them. In the meanwhile, now that the scaffolding problem seems to be being sorted, as it's difficult to have scaffolding if you have no land available on which to stand it, new scaffolding will be erected as soon as is practical.

In the meanwhile, fat donations would be well received.

 

[Moo]

Well, as I seem to be the only one with the full information, but I note those usual suspects with the long knives are, as ever, happy to spout and try to stir things up (no doubt feeling terribly childishly pleased with themselves) without having the information, I point out that we have had this conversation before, despite the poster having registered under a different name, and I'm not at all sure what the purpose of it is.

I rest my case.

 

[Nemesis]

Myabe you should have kept out of it.

But Bea tells me she knows all about it anyhow.

 

[Moo]

Myabe you should have kept out of it.

Why?

 

[Nemesis]

I'm going now Moo, to make a cup of tea. I have a form to fill in from those nice people at the DWP to claim my pension. I'm almost, if not quite, at the age where I think you can stop telling me how to behave.

Then I can become an interfering old bat. Only a few more months to go.

 

[Micky]

Why wait......

 

[Nemesis]

Indeed, why. Maybe I'm just easing myself in gently.

 

[plumbers mate]

It's well known that old bats like old properties.
Keeping scaffolding up round a building is very expensive and if the money to do the rest of the work is not forthcoming, then that scaffolding cost could well save another equally worthy building where, by some miracle, the money is available.
It would take Indiano Jones to find any HLF money at the moment. All going to the London Olympics - it would be as cheap to get to Paris for most people now but no, London has to get the rest of the UK to pay for it's ego trip with money that could be used to protect our heritage rather than demolishing it for a short lived scheme.
That's my rant over.

 

[Nemesis]

The scaffolding is going back up - and a roof covering - there's been some difficulty, caused by nothing to do with the SAVE Trust, or any financial or other mismanagement. I do know at times anyone making enquiries to the local authority gets some very odd responses. For what it's worth, SAVE took this on in a back to back CPO from the local authority, as a rescue of last resort. Myabe they'd like it back again and can find the cash to rescue it from their own funds? It's all very difficult, it's listed II* and EH has to be involved too because of that. It's an important structure historically because of the experimental cement, but it's also making it very, very expensive to do anything with. Finally I think EH is coming up with a bit of cash, which it promised at the outset but its funding was then cut by central government, which threw things rather. The place otherwise would by now I suspect have collapsed totally. It was never going to be an easy one. It won't be a rapid one, either. If anyone has the odd million or two to throw at it, and a viable re-use which hasn't yet been explored, then do pipe up now.

I agree with every word you say about the Olympics and the lottery. Funding is now in very, very short supply. Vivat will be struggling, as are many other BPT's. Lottery funding comes with many strings too, and small projects such as this one fail to tick the boxes.

http://www.bdonline.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=426&storycode=3117504

In the meantime of course, there have been, amongst other things the rescue of Dumfries House, the ongoing defence of the people versus the Pathfinders, the Smithfield Inquiry... a few small things which have taken up more time and resources.

 

[skier-hughes]

It would take Indiano Jones to find any HLF money at the moment. All going to the London Olympics

Not so, we've secured £45k for a school community extension among several other local projects.

 

[Nemesis]

Heritage Lottery funding is increasingly hard to come by, and for some fragile historic buildings, it's not the answer.

I additionally point out Plumber's Mate is heavily involved with funding issues regarding two very important historic sites requiring vast pots of cash, so does have some idea of that which she speaks.

These applications were turned down:

• Sir John Soane’s Museum development project, Sir John Soane’s Museum – grant request £3.34million
• Newbridge Institute and Memo restoration project, Celynen Collieries Institute and Memorial Hall – grant request £3.17million
• How Motoring Transformed the Nation, National Motor Museum – grant request £2.9million
• The Guildhall Project, King Edward VI School – grant request £3.6million
• The Music Hall redevelopment, Shrewsbury & Atcham Borough Council – grant request £2.62million
• New for Old, Lancashire Record Office – grant request £4.63million
• Wentworth Castle and Stainborough Park, Wentworth Castle and Stainborough Park Heritage Trust – grant request £4.83million
• Your Paintings, The Public Catalogue Foundation – grant request £3.5million
• Living The Poor Life, The National Archives – grant request £644,000
• Facing Out, The National Portrait Gallery – grant request £418,000

Carole Souter, commented ‘This was an extremely competitive round with funding five times over-subscribed, as a result, there were a number of strong applications which we simply did not have the money to support.”

One which did receive some funding:

Vital funding for Llanelli’s landmark building

Grade I listed Llanelly House is an exemplary early 18th-century Georgian town house; it is also one of Llanelli's most important historic buildings. The house was originally built in 1714 by Thomas Stepney, the MP for Carmarthenshire at the time. John Wesley, the early leader of the Methodist movement, stayed at the house several times during his many visits to the town. The building was also the Welsh finalist in the first series of BBC Two’s ‘Restoration’ programme in 2003.

HLF’s £3.4million grant and £146,000 of development funding will support extensive repair and restoration work to the House. This will help transform it into a Community Heritage Centre with exhibition space, a café/restaurant and a dedicated space for community groups to use.

It's never rapid and finding other 'match' funding is always hard.

'Community' use is not suitable for all buildings.

 

[skier-hughes]

I was just pointing out that not all the lottery money is going to the Olympics as she stated and that you don't have to be Indiana Jones to get it, as I've been involved in several locally lottery funded projects.

 

[Nemesis]

I think that was a little tongue in cheek, although a great deal of truth in it. Vast sums of it are being diverted to the Olympics.

There are different pots of funding, too. However, the rigid requirements to get HLF (and other types of lottery funding) mean that some projects are simply not suitable, and getting together a 'jigsaw' of funders is a very, very hard task indeed.

http://www.hlf.org.uk/English/HowToApply/OurGrantGivingProgrammes/HeritageGrants/isitrightforyou.htm