Wooden floor sanding project

[overlander matt]

Did a small section of caulking upstairs yesterday afternoon. It takes a while to know how many strands are needed for a particular size gap. Anything under say half a mm will hopefully fill with wax.



I'll have a go with some paint on the cotton to see how it blends in. The shellac didn't make too much difference to the colour.

It is going to take a long time to complete but I do notice the floor feels more solid in the small sections that I have done. Surprisingly so. I'll have a go at a area that has the most movement next.

Alas the floor downstairs and the staircase has already been primed so I'll have to take extra care in colouring the caulk there.

 

[lizziecupcakes]

It looks great and I can imagine it will take a long time to do, but hopefully worth it. It’s a great outcome if it’s already feeling solid.

The gaps in my floor are various sizes so i’ll have to figure out what to do.

Do you have suspended floors? I’m really curious to know if it has helped with any draught.

 

[overlander matt]

I'm sure it's not just wishful thinking that there's an improvement in the general springiness of the floor. I have also secured the odd loose board! I'm really trying to pack the caulking tight. I should get quicker once I have an idea for how many strands to use. The cotton bail has 6 or 7 strands which fits a wide 4mm gap ok. You can cut off or twist on extras as the gap narrows or widens. The majority of my gaps are taking 2-3 strands.

The next challenge will be getting it to blend in with the surrounding boards. I've tried a tester pot of brown emulsion but I suspect it will be a bit light. However, after shellac and there will probably be a fair bit of wax, it might be ok - just a bit soon to comment...

On a section near the window it certainly stops the draughts! I've yet to try the suspended floor downstairs but it should make a significant difference.

 

[Cubist]

I'm sure it's not just wishful thinking that there's an improvement in the general springiness of the floor.

Really packing the cotton in, while avoiding pushing it all the way through, will produce some outward pressure on the boards and the floors structure in general will become stiffer. However, there is a risk that the small amount of vertical movement remaining may eventually push the cotton out of place. The lacquer will help to prevent this as will any wax filler you might also use but turning the corners of the boards with the cotton will reduce this risk even further.

 

[lizziecupcakes]

I'm sure it's not just wishful thinking that there's an improvement in the general springiness of the floor.

On a section near the window it certainly stops the draughts! I've yet to try the suspended floor downstairs but it should make a significant difference.

Those are excellent results so far @overlander matt. I’m sure you’ll be proud of the work and feel the benefits for a very very long time.

My bedroom ceiling is now plastered, part blown wall sorted too. I can’t wait to strip the wallpaper, line and paint. I will have a proper bedroom by the new year!

Then, back to the floor scraping. Your project has been motivating- I cant wait to work on mine!

 

[lizziecupcakes]

However, there is a risk that the small amount of vertical movement remaining may eventually push the cotton out of place. The lacquer will help to prevent this as will any wax filler

@overlander matt @Cubist I plan to stain and varnish my floors. I don’t think i will have vertical movement problems (or maybe I will), but will varnish help with keeping ths cotton in place? I’m not sure if I should use lacquer instead.

I have pine flooring that will be sanded first. I’m not sure what natural colour that will come out, but I want a golden oak colour for my flooring so I was going to stain it.

 

[overlander matt]

I've had to divert away from the floor to an ensuite bathroom tiling project ready for guests coming at Christmas. I'm probably one third of the way through caulking the flooring joints. In terms of the floor movement, the caulking has made a major improvement. I'm still trying to figure out the right depth to push the caulk below the surface of the floor. My biggest fear is that it will work its way out over time. I'm hoping some paint and primer will help with this as I really don't want to be repeating the caulking process again.

Lizziecupcakes, you might be surprised by the effect of the caulking on movement! I wish you well with your flooring project there. Originally, I was quoted around £900 for a couple of guys to come in and 'do' the floor a few weeks ago. I've subsequently embarked on a much bigger project and probably spent at least £450 on materials to do the job. That said, the appearance of the floor downstairs has been very rewarding and still needs caulking and waxing. I'm still not sure how the boards and the gaps will look after the waxing is applied. I'm hoping it will fill the smaller gaps and smooth over the cotton caulking. It's first time for floor waxing for me.

More updates to follow once the ensuite has progressed to have a functioning toilet...

 

[Cubist]

but will varnish help with keeping ths cotton in place? I’m not sure if I should use lacquer instead.

The thinning/transport agents used in varnish or lacquer for that matter will penetrate and permeate the cotton - provided its not throughly repelled by any colouring/staining agent used beforehand - and will provide a weak bond between the cotton and the boards. The key to success though is ensuring that the cotton is installed with a tight fit between the boards - it must resist your efforts to gently pull it out as you progress along every run.

I have pine flooring that will be sanded first. I’m not sure what natural colour that will come out, but I want a golden oak colour for my flooring so I was going to stain it.

Pine, as Toby Newell and others have asserted before, is one of the most difficult timbers to colour using a dye or stain because the natural oils in the wood can operate as an impermeable barrier in some parts of a planks surface while other parts will happily accept it - thus leaving a patchy finish. Not being a pro myself I would adopt a strategy of using a colouring agent for the cotton to roughly match that of the surrounding sanded planks and apply this ahead of any attempts to stain or dye the floorboards OR alternatively you might consider using a colour matched filler to cover the cotton and sand off any excess you might leave on the surface of the boards. However, you might also consider using a coloured varnish for the final finish as this might allow you to omit the staining step altogether?

I'm still trying to figure out the right depth to push the caulk below the surface of the floor

Given that your boards are PSE I would aim for no more than half the available depth of the boards if possible whilst ensuring that you leave no more that a millimetre or two between the surface of the cotton and that of the neighbouring boards for the fillers/wax after colouring the cotton.

 

[overlander matt]

A month seems to have passed by since I was last active on the wooden floors here. In the interim, an ensuite bathroom has been tiled and a toilet fitted but as with most projects, the finishing touches are still outstanding...

Back to the wooden floors and I have completed 80% of the landing floor with the cotton caulking. The floor is certainly sturdier with less spring in it than before. The section remaining has smaller gaps but I am questioning the right approach to take... It's pretty difficult to caulk the smaller gaps and I'm wondering at what point I'm wasting my time. I've normally persevered with gaps that will accommodate a couple of strands of the caulk but at what point do I say 'enough'! At what point does the wax fill the joint sufficiently?

I've attached a couple of photos for general interest. The floor was sealed with the shellac before I carried out the caulking just to keep it more presentable over Christmas. Thanks for any suggestions Steve.

 

[lizziecupcakes]

Your floors looks so beautiful! Well done
I can't want to see the finished product. Also, I really like your black rad at the end of the landing.
May I ask where you purchased it from?

 

[overlander matt]

Your floors looks so beautiful! Well done
I can't want to see the finished product. Also, I really like your black rad at the end of the landing.
May I ask where you purchased it from?

Hi Lizzie. Hope you are making progress there!

The floors are looking better here and I'm amazed at how the landing floor lacquer had whitened the appearance of the floor. It now looks so much richer with just a single coat of shellac primer. Hoping for great things to come with the wax in due course... The cotton caulking has not been much fun following the diamond shapes in the floor here but nearly done upstairs and we have a carpet coming soon for the stairs.

As for the radiators, they have come from the Cast Iron Radiator Centre near Tamworth. We've installed them all over the house and give a bit of a period feel - well better than the white panels that were here before.

 

[Cubist]

Hi Matt,
Congratulations on/for all the progress, diversions included. Those floors are a real testament to your character as well as their inherent quality - they will be magnificent. Besides the tools I've previously mentioned I will sometimes use an old and dull putty knife or narrow 30mm paint scraper (equally dull) to push the cotton into sub 1mm gaps. Typically though I will stop trying when the blade itself starts to drag between the timbers and threatens to jamb. A hard colour matched wax will usually fill any remaining gaps and this of course would be refreshed whenever a new wax coat is applied to the floor - you won't notice any minor drop out in the future unless you're down on hands and knees. I'm sure you're looking forward to finishing this project, if only to avoid the chiropractors office in the future, Im certainly looking forward to seeing the finished product. More strength to your elbows... knees, hips, et al.
Cheers,
Steve

 

[overlander matt]

Thanks for your encouragement Steve. I blame you wholeheartedly for this project but will be thankful to you when it's finished! I should be finished with the caulking by the weekend and then I'll paint the caulking. The cat has taken an interest in trying to pull it out from the wider joints so I'll be pleased to have it sealed!

I've never waxed a floor previously. I believe it is a matter of applying in thin layers and buffing off. Is it worth getting hold of a machine for this?

Looking forward to posting some updated photos soon and then going downstairs and doing it all again!

Cheers,

Matt

 

[fernicarry]

I used Fiddes wax and it was dead easy to do by hand. Its quite soft so just applied with a rag and buffed off after 5 or 10 minutes with another rag. Solvent based so stinks for a while afterwards and the floor was a bit of a slippery death trap for a couple of weeks.. Lovely satin sheen.

 

[overlander matt]

Thanks Alan. Sounds easy enough!

 

[mardinor]

Tip on waxing a floor from scratch: you need less than you think. Too much wax looks dull. Less wax, more polishing. Buy or hire a polishing machine.
Best tip was from Toby (but you already have it covered): apply shellac sealer before wax

The good news is that once done, normal foot traffic (wearing socks) is sufficient to keep the wax buffed and shiny.

 

[Cubist]

I blame you wholeheartedly for this project but will be thankful to you when it's finished!

Bugger - but then I was only the messenger, no one has a monopoly on knowledge thank goodness and I can hide behind all those boat builders and the like that came before me. Ho hum, I hope that you find no future reason for a vendetta and, more importantly, no future steward of your home does either.

Personally I always avoid liquid waxes unless they are for the final application of a multi coat wax finish. As you have already applied a shellac/lacquer most of the surface 'pores' of the grain structure will have already been filled to produce a hard gloss finish. Your most important objective at this stage is to fill the remaining gaps between the boards and above the caulking cotton bed to bring these to the same surface level as the surrounding boards. A hard wax is the best for this purpose as you want it to be reasonably durable while maintaining some of its inherent flexibility. Hard waxes - think shoe polish - are best applied either with a fine wire wool pad or better still in your case a good clean brush of the type you would use for your shoes. Generously load the brush and repeatedly apply the wax at right angles to the grain and across the gaps in the boards to fill them - don't be tempted to leave more than a light film of wax over the surface of the boards. Leave the wax to harden for say 24 hours if you can and again use a clean shoe polishing brush to buff the wax to a sheen and remove any streaks or smears - again working mostly at right angles to the board gaps to avoid eroding the wax fill above the cotton.

Personally I would not use any kind of machinery if I could avoid it except perhaps the kind of rotating fleecy polishing machine @mardinor mentions - and definitely not one equipped with brushes.

Nuff said and good luck.
Steve

 

[overlander matt]

Thank you for the guidance on this... I already have a large tin of wax ready to go but given the gap filling, I'm happy to revisit the wax choice as I'll no doubt be building up the gaps over a number of applications. Out of interest, what would be a good hard wax to go for and would it need to be coloured?

I've been painting the caulking today. A little more to do then onto the finishing next week! I'm looking forward to having this finished. The problem is the floor is likely to make the rest of the area look a bit scruffy.

Thanks again Steve and Mardinor.

 

[Cubist]

For similar jobs I favour the Briwax Wax Polish products which come in a range of colours including a 'Clear' version that may be the most suitable for your needs, particularly if you're happy with the paint colour used on the caulking and do not want to dull the shellac/lacquer finish you have too much. The range includes the usual suspects in terms of Tudor and Light oak et al which would allow you to perhaps highlight the gaps and provide a stronger contrast to the boards. This paste form also allows you to avoid repeated applications of the wax to build up the surface layer above the caulking, it can usually be done in one application and a little tweaking in places - a lot less elbow grease is needed.

The problem is the floor is likely to make the rest of the area look a bit scruffy.

Tell me about it - before Christmas I started re-decorating our kitchen, long overdue, and when I finished it realised the oak counter-tops needed some TLC that I'd thought could be avoided. More than a few unhappy hours cabinet scraping, removing scratches and dings together with a few water bleached spots, later and it's finished but..... I'm reluctant to let anyone else but me in there. So I'm now chief cook and bottle washer - Buggeration!

Cheers, Steve

 

[a twig]

Just FYI Briwax specifically says on the tin “This product is not recommended for use in areas where it will come into contact with water.”