tools , budget or ex rental?

[Flyfisher]

I bought an Irwin Hilmor pipe bender in the end. It looks like a yellow version of MdB's photo. £40, so possibly a bit over-the-odds, but cheap enough for the work I'll get out of it.

However. Does anyone have tips for using the damn thing?! I don't mean how to bend copper tube; I quickly mastered that aspect of things, and a very good, smooth job it does too. The tricky bit, I'm finding, is to place the bend precisely where I want it and, therefore, minimise the mount of cutting to length required.

Still, the end result looks better than lots of elbows, which is how I previously gained what little plumbing experience I have.

 

[MdB]

I bought a £33 SDS from B&Q last week. Seems to do the job though at the moment it has only been used for mixing plaster.

 

[Feltwell]

There is a bit of a knack to pipe benders! As you say, bending the pipe is easy, bending it in the right place by the right amount is not!

The bend will start from roughly where the clamp piece goes over the tube - and, on most pipe benders, you'll find some lines cast onto them that the handles line up with once you've reached a variety of commonly used angles, such a 45 and 90 degrees.

Some people mark with a pencil on the copper where the clamp is positioned - so if you do get it wrong and need to bend the tube a little more, you put it back in the bender precisely where it was. I've usually found you can estimate it closely enough though.

Other than that - I'd just live with the fact that you'll get more offcuts than a pro plumber, that's my technique! :lol: Put the bend a little further along the pipe than you need, then cut the excess off the straight bit after you've finished the bend.

One other tip - a "Pipeslice" is much much easier than the type of pipe cutter where you have to turn a knob to exert pressure on the cutting wheel. A pipeslice is much quicker and is physically much smaller, so works in more confined spaces - plus you use it with 1 hand. One of these:-

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/29457/Hand-Tools/Plumbing-Tools/Pipe-Cutters/Autocut-Pipe-Cutter-15mm

Only drawback is, they only work with 1 size of pipe.

 

[MdB]

However. Does anyone have tips for using the damn thing?!

Practise and a few experiments. The first few I marked where I wanted the bend and then noted where it actually ended up so I could adjust afterwards. It is also not worth trying to put a bend in too close to the end of the pipe as it will squish it so it won't fit into a solder joint.

 

[Flyfisher]

I don't really mind a few offcuts (and the pipeslice tip is a good one and I already have a couple in the toolbox) but the tricky bit is where I need a bend at one end followed by a straight length and then another bend. The length between the bends has to be fairly accurate whereas the 'ends' can be trimmed to fit.

But I've been pencil-marking the tube, figuring out bend radii and managed to almost plumb a washing machine this evening, so not too bad (I say 'almost' because I decided not to tee into the main cold supply until tomorrow as I don't fancy working into the night if I have a leak problem!).

 

[middi]

Practice makes good.

The pencil marking of the tube lined up with a corresponding on the tool is the best way( as suggested ) to get accurate bends. Once you have mastered where the bend "falls", say at 90 deg, it is just a question of making allowance for the pipe dia. and the fixing bracket to get the correct distance .

For very accurate and neat bends around corner walls the less experienced will use a soldered joint if two or more bends are required.

Just keep practicing. ( and remember that copper is expensive !! )

 

[chuckey]

Re. pipebenders, the "hook" that holds the end of the pipe kinks it on mine. Also I cut my 15mm ali former into 2/3 else it would foul when bending a second bend tight and in the opposite direction to a first bend to produce an "S" shape.
Frank

 

[Andrew Bodenham]

I don't really mind a few offcuts (and the pipeslice tip is a good one and I already have a couple in the toolbox) but the tricky bit is where I need a bend at one end followed by a straight length and then another bend. The length between the bends has to be fairly accurate whereas the 'ends' can be trimmed to fit.

When I converted to pipebenders I wasted lots of pipe trying to do complex multiple bends. Now I take a more pragmatic approach - after making the bends in separate pieces of pipe I position them, cut to length and use a coupling in the straight legs. Not quite as satisfying as doing the whole thing in one piece, but a much higher success rate.

As for alignment I have made a couple of marks on the fixed former of the bender to indicate where the bend will start. I also keep an offcut bend in my plumbing box which I can offer up to establish the start points of bends when laying out.

I'm not keen on pipeslices - I find that they deform the pipe end inward too much compared with a gently wound-in pipe cutter, leaving quite a bit of de-burring to be done.

All the offcuts, however small, go in the scrap box. Clean copper gets a pleasingly good rate down at the scrappies.

 

[Flyfisher]

I entirely agree that pragmatism is very sensible, it's just that I'm sometimes too stubborn to admit defeat.
I did manage to get this S-bend right though - first time as well. Honest!

Fair comment on pipeslices, but they are sometimes the only option when cutting into existing pipework (apart from a hacksaw I suppose).

 

[worms]

I'm not keen on pipeslices - I find that they deform the pipe end inward too much compared with a gently wound-in pipe cutter, leaving quite a bit of de-burring to be done.

Sorry to ask the naive question, but why is burring a problem? Surely as long as the pipe is clean a couple of mm back where the olive grips it or the solder ring is, that is all that matters?

 

[MdB]

One of the best combinations you can get is a cordless drill and an impact driver. Once you've used an impact driver you'll never want to use any other sort of cordless drill/driver; it'll put a four-inch screw into oak one-handed, and will drive screws in or whip them out without burring the heads. I use Makita, but deWalt, Hitachi and Bosch all make them now. Obviously it's not a tool to be used in place of a cabinet maker's turnscrew, but in the right place it's an absolute godsend.

Well, following Gervase's advice, I treated myself to a cordless impact driver, and all I can say is.....

Wow! What a piece of kit. Absolutely fantastic.

...

Mine was the Ryobi one in Screwfix. I did see that B&Q do a cheapie own brand one for £50 - but that's Ni-Cad, which I try to avoid these days (the batteries die long before the tool does).

Sorry to drag up an old thread but I thought I would add that I have just gone and bought the £50 Bee&Queue impact driver and after a days use it looks good for my needs and really does put screws in with a punch. The battery life isn't great but with two batteries and a one hour charge, I don't see this as being a problem. It isn't a driver for people using it daily in a professional capacity but for my DIY work it is great.

 

[Feltwell]

I am a total convert to cordless impact drivers - they really are the mutts nuts. So much easier to drive screws in with, and much less likely to cam out and round the head when compared to an ordinary cordless drill/driver. If you haven't got one, put it on your Christmas list!

My cordless drill died, so in the end I went mad and treated myself to a Makita Drill/Driver and Impact Driver twin pack set, with NiMH batteries - not cheap at £300 but it will get a lot of use, and I always find that NiCd batteries on all the cheaper tools die long before the actual tool does.

£50 for a B&Q cheapie sounds good though - cheap ones haven't been available until very recently. I guess like a lot of power tools, they start off at prices for trade users only and then filter down to DIY as they grow in popularity and the budget manufacturers take note.

I need to find a cheap wall chaser now - my old one has just packed up, it looks terminal