Scaffolding on the road Woes for reroofing

[agbagb]

Moral support and any advice more than welcome...
The re-roofing of our Whitby cottage was due to start next week. We've just had a call from the local builder we've got on the job who's coordinating with the local scaffolder. It seems like there's a new bloke at the council that isn't aware of the street we're on. So far we've heard back that we'll need road closures and loads of forms, fees and a twelve week delay ......
All resulting in a Minor Panic..
Details: The roof is in serious need of repairs, to the extent that a full re-roof is the only sensible option. The road in front is 4m wide, no pavement, one way, further down the street its only about 2.7m wide wall to wall.
The scafolder had sugested bridging across from the retaining wall opposite the house but they say (council man) it need to be 5.03m above the road, the eves are only 3.6m.
Option 2. a narrow 0.6m scaffold has been rejected by the "man" even though this will leave a 3.4m ish highway (wider than parts of the rest of the street).

Anyone any ideas off how to tackle the council. Bearing in mind the roof might start loosing pantiles on pedestrians heads if the frost, snow and wind takes it's toll. I've already had to secure some tiles, with copper clips from the inside on to replacement bits of slats.

I'm a bit stuck as I know the repairs / replacement needs doing but the council seems to want to cover some other rear end. As well as wanting to get a good hat on the cottage for winter so I can start work on the rest of it, I'm worried about liabilities.

Wine and kitcats aren't helping... much, should I eat / drink more?

PS. The Other Half is itching to get on, but stuggling with duplicate IP address or sumit, so she's got my login. Hopefully her posts will be prefaced with "Other Half" to avoid confusion. oh and she spells beter.

 

[middi]

The only people that can help you overcome the problem is the scaffold company. They should be fully aware of the health and safety implications regarding public safety or their workers.
As you find yourself in the unfortunate situation where in order to attend to roof repairs the scaffold has to intrude on a public highway, the council has no choise but to ensure public safety therefore detailled plans of scaffolding erection plans will be required.
Scaffold companies are aware of these implications and advance planning regarding scaffold erection should be sought by the contractor or the owner of the building.
I don't think the planning department gives a "toot" ,in the meantime, if some loose roof tiles should come down and kill a couple of pedestrians, they will not be held to account . On a serious note, it would be advisable to erect a tile guard parapet at the eaves of the building if your building is " overhanging" a highway ( once the roof has been repaired ).
There are not many short cuts you can take, the council/highways authority need to be informed.
( make sure you have an abundant supply of " booze and coffee" :wink: )

Middi

P.S. Tell the OH that it is a well known fact to the "men" of the restoration fraternity despair obout their OH insistance to measure the curtains whilst you are in the process of still digging foundations. ( sorry about the miss girls, I have already ducked :wink: )

 

[Pford75]

Sadly I don't think there will be any short cuts. The reality of the situation is that it sounds like you do require agreement from Highways before installing your scaffold, but that the previous council incumbent took a less literal approach to interpreting the rules.

Whilst I can appreciate it is frustrating to delay your roof work, I can understand the councils perspective. If your scaffold overhangs the highway (even by a narrow 60cm), there is a risk of collision. Will your scaffold be permanently lit etc?

It might not be much encouragement, but at least you have a builder/scaffolder who is doing things the right way.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

:shock: :shock: commiserations! The scaffolder/builder should be able to deal with it. However, hot line and foot if necessary to the council will not go amiss! Good Luck!

 

[CliffordPope]

We had a good illustration last week of what happens if proper procedures are not followed.

Our company van rounded a bend, and there without any warning was scaffolding in the street, projecting overhead at about 6" below van roof height. Fortunately the only damage was the van panel ripped open, but it could have brought the scaffolding down.
There was no warning, no signs, no cones, no tape on the scaffolding. It seems the scaffolders had simply set it up without any thought for anyone else, and with no consultation or permission.

 

[agbagb]

Hi All,
And a big thanks, Ive calmed down a bit now. It's not often I get stressed but that could be because I don't often have to employ others or have to deal with officialdom.
I've spoken to the scaffolder today. He's told me it's not a new fellow at the council, he's actually quite resonable and does know the area well. So for my half cocked asspertions. It does seem like there has been some new or tightening up of the regs.
It might be possible to reduce the 12 weeks and the council will hopefully take in to account the urgency of the repairs. We might not have to have a full road closure for the duration of the works but will need a height restriction in place.
So it looks like I just dropped unlucky with it all. The scaffolder, from previous experience had assumed the normal scaffolding licence would apply (a seven day procedure). We live and learn.

Middi, I was meaning the OH was itching to get on the forum, something I positively encourage as a diversionary activity from measuring up for curtains, picking paint, carpets and furniture. (owch, didn't duck in time).

Clifford, it sounds like the scaffolders responsible could be in 5k fine.

All in all it illustrates that we all need need professionals for some jobs but even when we do get the chequebook out, it doesn't guarentee smooth progress. If it's the only major hickcough I should count myself lucky.

Cheers

 

[angrybird]

P.S. Tell the OH that it is a well known fact to the "men" of the restoration fraternity despair obout their OH insistance to measure the curtains whilst you are in the process of still digging foundations. ( sorry about the miss girls, I have already ducked

Ahh middi that made me giggle thats exactly what I do! no need to duck I freely admit it !!!
Mr Angry is muttering in agreement "too bl**dy right :lol: he's no need to duck i'll give him pedigree chum for tea :twisted:

 

[Schoolmarm]

Not in my house, I hate frippery and am only interested in building, demolishing, mending and taking stuff to the tip. I need a female to help me with frippery when the time comes to do finishing touches.

 

[billybuntus]

What are the rules on having a 'mobile' type scaffold erected then taken down or moved overnight.

A lot of hassle I know but when needs must. If the roofers got a crack on they could at least have tyvek to cover the roof before the council get wind?

 

[agbagb]

Billy, I did did come across some mention of mobile scaffold towers somewhere in the regs and advice, but didn't absorb all the details because the builder wouldn't be able to do the full re-roof safely or efficiently from it. Whatever's there it needs to catch him and materials / debris if they fall / slide off. It would need coning of and someone at the bottom keeping the public away. Like you say, they also do take some putting up and dismantling and to comply with H & S , public liabilities, insurance etc. he would probably want to be qualified (eg. PASMA certified) to prove competance.
Having said that yes there is provision in the regs for their use as long as they are dismantled after use but should still have a licence from the council, so possibly an option for smaller jobs.

 

[Zebra]

a well known fact to the "men" of the restoration fraternity despair obout their OH insistance to measure the curtains whilst you are in the process of still digging foundations. ( sorry about the miss girls, I have already ducked :wink: )

Curtains? Are those the bits of rubble sack that you nail to the new timber frame you just built?

 

[agbagb]

Update - The traffic order will cost us around £1000 or more. So we're on to plan B. The builder has agreed to work off a 2 board scaffold only 600mm wide. But the council is worried that HVG's will be dropped in by helicopters (They can't get up from the entrance to road). Rather than wait for a lift back out they might try and drive past the scaffolding.
Apparently as the road hasn't got a width restriction order on it, anything that can squeeze through the gap at the bottom of the street might fatten up as it comes up the street and will need an extra 100mm to get past the scaffolding. I shall be measuring the road the at the weekend and hopefully we can comply.


Meanwhile the OT has picked and fitted the curtains

 

[Sonyaclegg]

Very fetching. And lovely stone work. Hope your measuring goes to plan

 

[middi]

Well, at least you have learned something really helpfull if you ever want to move again.

( buy a detached little old cottage surrounded by a few acres of land with it's own drive )

Middi

 

[agbagb]

Well, at least you have learned something really helpfull if you ever want to move again.

( buy a detached little old cottage surrounded by a few acres of land with it's own drive )

Or maybe period prehistoric, a cozy cave 'oh for the simple life'. Come to think of it was seriously considering a ROC nuclear bunker a few years back. hmm. :idea:

 

[Feltwell]

anything that can squeeze through the gap at the bottom of the street might fatten up as it comes up the street

It's not unknown you know, these councils have to think of every eventuality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=6-DQqdB-UcY

Meanwhile the OT has picked and fitted the curtains

I'm loving the duct tape and the blue plastic, silver and blue go so well together. The use of plastic adds a fantastic modern touch to your old building, really highlighting the the juxtaposition between the smooth synthetic nature of the plastic and the natural texture of the old stone. The use of the piece of white board in an asymmetric fashion goes against convention and provides an interesting twist.

* That's it - my quota for talking b@ll@cks has been exceeded already for this weekend

 

[worms]

anything that can squeeze through the gap at the bottom of the street might fatten up as it comes up the street

It's not unknown you know, these councils have to think of every eventuality.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=6-DQqdB-UcY

Pah! That one's a pussy in comparison to our travelling cinema!

 

[Feltwell]

Very impressive, but built in France? The auld alliance maybe!

What a job if you're a truck driver though - travelling around that beautiful part of the country. I'm jealous.

 

[worms]

What a job if you're a truck driver though - travelling around that beautiful part of the country. I'm jealous.

I do about 10,000 miles of work related travel in the Highlands each year and I never tire of it. The best part, though, is listening to the road reports on the radio and hearing all the traffic problems in the South!

 

[Feltwell]

I'm jealous Worms. Years ago I did a stint at a firm in Grangemouth ( a place that I defy anyone to call attractive) and they sent me out for a couple of weeks in winter visiting customers all over the north of Scotland. It wasn't like work, it was pure pleasure. I've never had a "jolly" since that was as good.

Now I do 20k miles year just driving up and down the motorway to work