New lintel/flat roof issues

[Lacan07]

Sorry to hear this, sometimes it never rains but it pours, and rain is the worst enemy of an old house.

I agree with Feltwell, £2900 sounds a bit rich. I had 2 double joists put in above my kitchen (after I had previously removed a chimney) plus a new soil pipe installed into the mains outside and that came in at just under £1400 (2 days work). It was meant to be kind of mates rates as my nephew worked for him but I'm not convinced he knocked that much off tbh. He was a quality builder though, very clever guy and very experienced. I'd get as many builders round to quote as you can. I wouldn't worry to much about the shoddy builders, they won't touch this with a barge pole I reckon. Only someone with experience would take it on, ask them whether they'd expect building control to be involved and whether a structural engineer is required. Colin advised me to get building control involved.

I get the animosity toward structural engineers, its a bit like building surveyors, you kind of think you're wasting your money. I got dicked about by a SE when i needed to remove a non structural wall, he insisted I erect a wind post and nobody knew why. After 8 months of back and forth and no builders willing to take on his baffling instructions he mysteriously left the firm and his replacement immediately emailed me saying a wind post wasn't necessary. Not very dodgy at all then!!

 

[Lacan07]

I can't really advise on roofs however, other than to say they always seem to be waaaay overpriced to me. I share an Oast house with my neighbour (a young builder) and got a quote once to re-slate the roof, it came in at 30K and my neighbour just laughed. He ended up doing it himself.

 

[Cassie]

Hmm, maybe he just doesn’t want the job-from what you’ve said Lacan it does seem a bit steep! I don’t have enough experience of SEs to make an informed decision- the guy coming round did the structural survey on the house before we bought it and actually seemed very helpful and knowledgeable.
Good advice re builders- I’ll get a few in and see what they say, and indeed whether I ever hear from them again (seems to be a recurring problem, people come round to look at something and never get back to me. Luckily I’ve now found both a reliable electrician and plumber!)

 

[Cassie]

I can't really advise on roofs however, other than to say they always seem to be waaaay overpriced to me. I share an Oast house with my neighbour (a young builder) and got a quote once to re-slate the roof, it came in at 30K and my neighbour just laughed. He ended up doing it himself.

Blimey, for that I think I’d do it myself too

 

[stuart45]

A.point load is when something like another beam is sitting directly on top of the lintel, so it could be taking the weight of another wall at that point.
It could also be floor joists.

 

[Lacan07]

Hmm, maybe he just doesn’t want the job-from what you’ve said Lacan it does seem a bit steep! I don’t have enough experience of SEs to make an informed decision- the guy coming round did the structural survey on the house before we bought it and actually seemed very helpful and knowledgeable.
Good advice re builders- I’ll get a few in and see what they say, and indeed whether I ever hear from them again (seems to be a recurring problem, people come round to look at something and never get back to me. Luckily I’ve now found both a reliable electrician and plumber!)

Dealing with tradesmen isn't easy for sure and i'm no expert but fortunately there's enough of them around so hopefully you find someone suitable.

That's what I was saying really, its not for you to decide on a structural engineer, I would let the builder determine if that's necessary and getting building control involved isn't necessarily a bad thing either as they'll make sure its all done properly and above board.

 

[Cassie]

A.point load is when something like another beam is sitting directly on top of the lintel, so it could be taking the weight of another wall at that point.
It could also be floor joists.

Ah thank you. Immediately above it is about 18” of brick, then the ceiling. The joists for the upper floor run perpendicular to the lintel, so they will be in the wall above, but not immediately above

 

[Cassie]

Dealing with tradesmen isn't easy for sure and i'm no expert but fortunately there's enough of them around so hopefully you find someone suitable.

That's what I was saying really, its not for you to decide on a structural engineer, I would let the builder determine if that's necessary and getting building control involved isn't necessarily a bad thing either as they'll make sure its all done properly and above board.

Thank you, that’s helpful! I’ll certainly ask any prospective builders about buildings control-if they run a mile, then they’ve shown their colours!

 

[Cassie]

In case anyone is interested/has had similar problems, the structural engineer came and it’s actually good news, or at least not as bad as I thought He said what I thought was a lintel was actually a former for a brick arch above which is doing most of the work-yay! Won’t fall on my head! However, due to settlement over the years, the timber may have taken on some structural purpose, and therefore needs replacing. More good news is that he doesn’t think it needs propping, as probably only the front half is shot-that can be removed leaving the good bit in to hold anything up that might drop while a new lintel, placed either on concrete pads or new bricks is inserted. Even if it all needs to come out, the arch should hold most of it up So, for me, getting his advice was worthwhile! (Haven’t had the bill yet though )

 

[stuart45]

Glad to hear the good news. Relieving arches used to be built over the top of lintels, the brick infill was the tympanum.

 

[Cassie]

Another new term Stuart, thank you-I’ve learned loads from you all

 

[a twig]

Excellent news - onwards and staying upwards!

 

[Zebra]

Everything is daunting at first Cassie.... taking things one step at a time I've found to be the way to go, rather than looking too much at the big picture which is intimidating, and as a lone female (although a little taller than you, although I'm not sure that's an advantage ) I also tackled worrying structural issues without getting the professionals in. (Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, just hoping to reassure you that even out of our depth, we can still swim, with the pp forum here manning the support raft...)
So, one step at a time....accros, supports, how, where from, what's underneath, that's the first thing. I would also tend towards concrete, especially if there's any risk of damp. I'm sure it's possible to find specs for what a concrete lintel can support, although as malcolm says, anything is better than what you have.
If you do get professional builders in, will the job be notifiable to building control? That could add complication and expense.

 

[Cubist]

Everything is daunting at first Cassie.... taking things one step at a time I've found to be the way to go, rather than looking too much at the big picture which is intimidating, and as a lone female (although a little taller than you, although I'm not sure that's an advantage ) I also tackled worrying structural issues without getting the professionals in. (Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, just hoping to reassure you that even out of our depth, we can still swim, with the pp forum here manning the support raft...)
So, one step at a time....accros, supports, how, where from, what's underneath, that's the first thing. I would also tend towards concrete, especially if there's any risk of damp. I'm sure it's possible to find specs for what a concrete lintel can support, although as malcolm says, anything is better than what you have.
If you do get professional builders in, will the job be notifiable to building control? That could add complication and expense.

Anyone else thinking its kinda weird and maybe a little disturbing getting advice on how to eat an elephant from a Zebra?

 

[Cassie]

Excellent news - onwards and staying upwards!

hopefully

Anyone else thinking its kinda weird and maybe a little disturbing getting advice on how to eat an elephant from a Zebra?

 

[Cassie]

Everything is daunting at first Cassie.... taking things one step at a time I've found to be the way to go, rather than looking too much at the big picture which is intimidating, and as a lone female (although a little taller than you, although I'm not sure that's an advantage ) I also tackled worrying structural issues without getting the professionals in. (Not meaning to blow my own trumpet, just hoping to reassure you that even out of our depth, we can still swim, with the pp forum here manning the support raft...)
So, one step at a time....accros, supports, how, where from, what's underneath, that's the first thing. I would also tend towards concrete, especially if there's any risk of damp. I'm sure it's possible to find specs for what a concrete lintel can support, although as malcolm says, anything is better than what you have.
If you do get professional builders in, will the job be notifiable to building control? That could add complication and expense.

Thank you Zebra-it’s good to hear I’m not alone, and you’re right about the life raft, enormously reassuring! I’ve asked for a couple more quotes from general builders in the first instance, and depending on how that goes, I’ll figure out what to do. I do have 4 sons that are all strong and tall, so I’ve got manpower available (the price being car repairs and beer money-still substantially cheaper than a builder I’ll wager!) If I get a builder in, I’ll certainly be taking notes-there’s another lintel that needs replacing at ground level which might be a better bet for a first solo attempt. I’ll have a read around how to do it, including support but I’ll almost certainly be bothering you all with more questions!!

 

[Feltwell]

Having visited Zebra's place a number of years ago when it was mid-chaos, I can certainly vouch for her bravery and tenacity! At the time it was at a point which most people would call uninhabitable. Seeing the later pictures of her house, it underwent a remarkable transformation - mostly just from her solo hard work I believe.

 

[Cassie]

Zebra is clearly a badass, whereas I am just a div-but a div willing to learn!

 

[Cassie]

Kind folks, I’m at a dead end here. I’ve been looking at it a lot (the most important part of any job, preferably with a cup of tea and an upturned bucket to sit on!) I cannot see how I can safely prop the stuff above the lintel. On one side there’s wooden steps (bouncy) on a suspended timber floor, with a load bearing wall underneath, so can’t be supported from the ground. On the other (hall) side, 18” of brick until the fancy cornice. Neither acrows, needles or no-more-props seem viable. I have to bite the bullet and get someone in. Only the first guy (around 2900 quid) has said he’s prepared to have a go. Others have looked, teeth-sucked and not got back to me. I think I’m going to have to go with the sole quoter, who has full insurance This pretty much wipes out the bank account, so I’m going to be forced to tackle the roof myself, at least as a temporary fix. The porch is a really good advert for stripping off the cement inside. When I first took of the cement, the whole wall floor to ceiling was saturated. After quite a short time, it dried. Now when it rains, only the top bit gets wet and then dries out again! I’ll definitely have a lot of questions about how to tackle the roof-it’s a bit daunting

 

[Feltwell]

The surface moisture has dried, but the full wall thickness won't have yet. Rough guide I've heard quoted is a month for every inch of wall thickness. Of course exposing the brick, taking off impermeable finishes and fixing the leak are all conditions of that.

Getting someone experienced in sounds like a good move in this case.