More pestilence -OT

[JoceAndChris]

I have rats living under the hen house, and a very sick cockerel. (He is my second-in-command lame cockerel, who I bought from a breeder with even less sense and experience than me who sold him as a girl. I have mentioned before that Eustacia had to be rechristened Eustace- and a useless Eustace he's turned out to be, though I've grown fond of him. )

What to do about the rats? Any products, do's or don'ts?

And what to do about the cockerel? Jaqy has incredibly generously offered to come here with a guillotine - at what point do I just say that's it for you Eustace-bye bye? This is the worst thing, even worse than the fox attack.

If I let him go on, and it's something contagious, they could all get it and die. If I kill him, I will have to live with the fact that Nature, and his youth, may have lead him to recover...

The hen forum is no help on this occasion,the consensus being that even a sick unwanted cockerel deserves the attention of the vet with ensuing fees for blood tests, drips, overnight hospitalisation etc...Even I am not so chicken crazy to think that makes any kind of sense.

Anyone want a really ill cockerel? Or any pet rats?

 

[skier-hughes]

There is now a rat poison that only effects rats and mice, so can be eaten by hens, dogs etc. but I can't remember the name of it. Your local agricultural supplies should be able to help, or maybe google.
Oncew your cockerel has grown up and got better and starts to lly down the law with the other cockerel you may then end up witha cockerel fight, which is not nice to watch and terrible to come home to, so I'd dispatch now, save him from the pain.

 

[robgil]

isnt the poor fella insured?

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Would there be any point in isolating him for a day or two to see if he recovers? I really don't know anything about chooks, but maybe a little bit of grace would help to assuage your conscience. Then, if all else fails you've given him a chance.

 

[JoceAndChris]

No, he isn't insured!

I guess you'd insure a really valuable bird (some chickens are completely unique in their colouring and breed and can be worth £1000s), but not a fairly run-of-the-mill Blue Orpington.

Thanks so much for the advice about poison Graham, I'll drive over there now and see what they have.

I haven't used poison before - despite all my threats to I find it hard.

As for Harrowby killing off Eustace, yes, you're right. Orpingtons were the famous breed for fighting, being extremely large, and blood-thirsty when roused. At the moment the two seem close, and fond of one another, but then they're just boys, and won't reach puberty until next summer.

Joss, thanks for your suggestion, I'm not sure there's much incentive to isolate him. If he's contagious, then he probably has been so for the last two weeks. He isn't being bullied, and Bathsheba is always snuggled right next to him clucking her deepest sympathy- she loves him. So I'd have to separate the two of them together. I'll just see how it goes.

 

[Pford75]

Joce,

On the rats...despite trying various poisons and even shooting some, I can voich that the most effective solution was managing the feed correctly.

Do not use any cooked foods
Only feed in the morning, not in the evening (rats come out at night for any leftovers)
If you are feeding too much and there is food left at the end of the day, reduce the feed levels

This will have a much bigger impact than any poisons etc. in controlling the rat population

 

[JoceAndChris]

OK. There are at least 3 things I'm doing wrong then, from your post. We'd better clean up our act and get an indoor hanging feeder I think. Poor things don't even want to go outside anymore anyway.

 

[worms]

Joce,

You don't mention the clinical signs on the sick chook. Just off-colour? Scouring? Sneezing? or what? Have they been vaccinated against anything? You might want to get on top of the problem just in case Eustace is just ahead of the flock in going down with it. Since I think you said they are not laying (and you clearly are not inclined to be eating them!) then you might be able to give them an in-feed treatment - but only if you can work out what you are trying to treat.

And you want to get on top of the rat issue as well! Get that cat off the bunnies and on to the rats!

 

[JoceAndChris]

Thankyou for your kind concern. Eustace is moping, apathetic, off his food, pale in the comb and the wattle, and has stopped saying "co-o-o-o-ck!" (which he was managing quite nicely 2 weeks ago). On top of his earlier lameness a wing has now flopped down and is almost dragging on the ground. He walks with difficulty, and most of the time he just stands still with his eyes perpetually closing.

Last weekend he was worse. He didn't eat at all, was completely passive in my arms, and stained his bed with green bile from the cloaca. Then he appeared to rally and drank about a 1/2 litre of water. This week he has appeared less digestively challenged but thinner and frailer.

I do not think he is running a temperature as under wing is not overly hot. His crop is half-full currently, and there have been no wounds or lesions, or any red mite infestations. All lungs clear and good - their bedding is dust extracted wood shavings, cleaned daily.

These birds have not been vaccinated and only wormed with Diatom - a natural product. They aren't laying, and are too young for reproduction (I hope). The Orpington is not really an edible variety, they are purely pets.

This week they've had apple cider vinegar added to their water as a tonic.

Meanwhile the cat is just glued to the electric blanket all day and night...

 

[Tom]

Jaqy has incredibly generously offered to come here with a guillotine

I hasten to add that I offered to go down with the despatcher if the cockerel was suffering and Joce thought he should be despatched, as I wasn't sure that Joce would feel comfortable doing it herself. I don't want you all thinking I'm some manic chicken killer!!! :shock:

Joce, I haven't heard of using vinegar as a tonic for chickens. I do have a bottle of Poultry Tonic, if you'd like some, though.

Good luck with him

 

[Moo]

re that useless cat - a dog would keep your place vermin-free and, if properly introduced, would get on with the chickens and the cat very amicably. But of course, saddled as you are with a dog-phobic* husband.....




*We've never really been told exactly why he's so anti-dog. Is it an allergy? Or did he have a traumatic experience in his cradle?

 

[Flyfisher]

Sorry to hear of your chicken woes Joce. I'd second Pford's suggestions about carefully managing feedstuffs, although we put out cooked food for our hens (boiled up potato skins and other veg peelings, that sort of thing) and it doesn't seem to be a particular problem. Rats are incredibly adaptable creatures and will take full advantage of any food lying about. Although we don't have our own cats there at least two visiting ones that hunt their way through the undergrowth so perhaps they are doing us a good turn keeping down the vermin. I think you should switch off that electric blanket and kick your cat out at night! Alternatively, if you could find a local gamekeeper I'm sure he'd know someone with terriers who might be willing to help.

It's a shame that Eustace is so ill; perhaps, sadly, Jaqy has the right idea. As Skier says there may only be more upset to come if you end up with two fighting cockerels.

 

[Nigel Watts]

Paul Bocuse has a fascinating recipe for Coq au Vin. I will spare you the gory details but suffice it to say that it has an unusual way of thickening the sauce which does rather require home slaughtering (and specifically calls for a cock, not a hen). I think Fearnley-Whatshisname would approve. Joce I assume you are rearing the chickens for meat as well as eggs?

 

[JoceAndChris]

Thank you for the thought Nigel but I really can't eat them- in fact they've almost turned me veggie, the naughty things.

*We've never really been told exactly why he's so anti-dog. Is it an allergy? Or did he have a traumatic experience in his cradle?

Who knows? How do you explain phobia? It's certainly not an allergy, or linked to any tangible experience.

Rats are incredibly adaptable creatures and will take full advantage of any food lying about.

I am amazed at their cleverness. The electric fence went up about two weeks ago now. "That'll sort you" I thought. But oh no, "we understand electric fences" was squeaked, "we'll just dig through and tunnel under, and never get a single shock!" - they're cleverer than me! I've been shocked loads! And that rat tunnel happened the very same night a lovely grown up bunny fried himself on the wire, trying to find his way out.

Farming life is NOT easy and I'm glad, sort of, to have been spared 90 odd acres or whatever it was.

 

[Jon Maine]

I found this lurking on another of your posts, is this how he looks now or just may do shortly....

http://www.periodproperty.co.uk/forum/download/file.php?id=1349

 

[fjpdesigns]

I agree with Pford75 about managing the feeding to cut down on the rat population, although if you've got chickens you sure as hell will have rats, and for every one you see there will be another ten unseen.
A few years ago a neighbour used poison around her chicken huts and the first we knew was when we got a horrendous smell from the attic. To start with I thought something had got into the thatch and died . It took a few days to track down the culprit, a rather fly blown maggoty half eaten adult rat in amongst a roll of insulation. . It didn't half stink out the bedroom my parents were staying in. That's the trouble with using poison, you never know where the rats are going to end up when they die.
A couple of years later we found three mummified rats under the attic floorboards.
Forget poison, an air rifle is much more fun.

 

[judrop]

Joce SO VERY sorry to hear about your Eustace, we keep a few chooks ,but are no experts, however Pford is right about the feed and the rat problem.Apple Cider vinegar is great for helping to keep them stay fit, and free of worms, but to be sure Flubenvet is the best remedy for worms, I also use Poultry spice, garlic and bio yoghurt, ( not necessarily together)and spinach as suppliments.When you buy from a breeder, they have normally innoculated them before they sell on, and ex batts have to be innoculated by law( Newcastle disease etc)
One of our ex batts BB, died in October and we could not decide what caused it, the final decision was that she was just worn out with all the laying, still she had a little sunshine and fun before her demise.
Jaqy is your best bet with her wonderful flock and she will know more about the male of the species, as we dont have any, beautiful though they are.
I know how dificult the vet decision can be as they can be expensive, and sometimes an autopsy is required if the fowl doesnt make it, to make sure it isnt a "notifiable" illness , which might be spread to other flocks, NOT so easy this chook keeping !
Anyway enough blather , I do wish you all the very best, and please do let us know how you get on. Love Ju XX

 

[worms]

Joce,

Hopefully the beast is on the mend, if it is now eating and drinking again. If I were you I would follow Judrop's advice and get a proper wormer - diatomite might be useful for external parasites, but I would take a bit of convincing about its usefulness for worms beyond a marginal effect on the moisture levels of the litter.

 

[JoceAndChris]

I found this lurking on another of your posts, is this how he looks now or just may do shortly....

http://www.periodproperty.co.uk/forum/download/file.php?id=1349

:evil: :evil: :evil: Why do men always tell me to eat my pets? How could you look into these soulful eyes and take that life?!

Thank you so much for all the KIND posts, consolation and advice.

NOT so easy this chook keeping !

It really isn't judrop, in fact it's constant warfare against some thing or another.

a rather fly blown maggoty half eaten adult rat in amongst a roll of insulation.

Dear oh dear, but I know just what you mean!

 

[LadyArowana]

Maybe he read your "which oven for Christmas ?" thread and had a panic attack ? he should be much better by Boxing Day!
The feline member of the household is clearly not performing up to expectations and should have access to the electric blanket terminated immediately. Dogs are much easier to motivate and some of the terrier breeds even come with a ratcatching prog factory installed. Something like a mini Schnauzer would do a great job and if you bought it some suitable clothes not even the most canine phobic man could possibly complain ( the same genes that make men tell girls to eat their pets also make them incapable of admitting terror at a small cuddly animal in a silly outfit ).