Kitchen Design

[malcolm]

I'm not best qualified to design a kitchen as I don't normally operate them, but need to figure out where the electrics are going to go.

I'm trying to figure out a layout in a 3m x 5m room with 3 doors and a window. I'll probably go modern and conventional and not expensive in design and have been messing around with the online kitchen design programs to get an idea how it will fit together. I'm supposed to incorporate a huge expensive ugly american freezer that she bought.

The door to the left looking in is the main entrance. To the left at the far end is the door to the snug/diner, and to the far right is the door to the utility room/ outside.

I am nervous that the work surface is in the wrong place. I like a sink under the window, but the obvious place for working would the the large surface at the near corner in the photo.

Anyone any thoughts on how the layout ought to work or any ideas generally? The work surface beside the fridge would be redundant because of the way the doors open. Perhaps some tall cupboards beside the fridge with gothic arches to distract the eye might be better.

 

[JBean]

Malcolm,

You have my sympathy! We spent weeks trying to design a kitchen when we had just moved into our Edwardian house. The one we inherited just didn't work for us, and I foolishly thought we could quickly and easily replace it. We wasted masses of time with graph paper and online programmes, and eventually and reluctantly I paid for 3 hours advice from a designer. It was the best £100 I have ever spent! She was able to suggest a much better layout - and also offered all sorts of other tips and ideas for improving the way the kitchen could work. It was all done quickly via email and phone. We were more than happy with the result.

I can pass on her details if you're interested. But I don't think she'll like your American fridge-freezer...

 

[MikeG]

Don't do that latter one! Putting that huge fridge in the middle of that short wall gives you two un-usably small bits of worktop, and this is to be avoided like the plague. Try to have long runs of worktop if you can. If you don't need the worktop, however, you could build full height units either side of the fridge.

Don't forget that those American fridges need a water supply.

 

[livias]

I I have never understood why people put sinks under Windows. While you are at the sink you are either washing up or washing veggies not looking out the window. I spend little time at the sink , being a great fan of that modern invention the dishwasher. In my opinion the area in front of the window is best as the main work surface with good light for preparing food and looking for inspiration outside. I spend much more time there than at the sink.

I would put the fridge at the far end of the room and perhaps fill up all that wall with cupboards. You can never have too many cupboards. And that means that you can avoid wall cupboards in the rest of the kitchen to give it a open feel and let in maximum light if you just have the one window

I like doing kitchen design so will have a think ...

 

[malcolm]

Good ideas there. I've just checked the measurements of the kitchen and it is a bit longer than I remembered which solves the lack of workspace (it's 3m x 6m). Boxing in the far end with some sort of cupboard panelling would help lose the fridge. We have some lowish status Edwardian panelling upstairs we could copy.

 

[Bogart]

Always easiest if the cooker/range can be on an exterior wall ducting is then a doddle.

 

[Feltwell]

Boxing in the far end with some sort of cupboard panelling would help lose the fridge. We have some lowish status Edwardian panelling upstairs we could copy.

Nice idea, but if you do this make sure the fridge freezer is a standard size - otherwise when it eventually dies it will be a massive pain in the arris to replace. Also make sure there's enough ventilation round it.

Big built in cupboards are a great idea anyway. We have an original one in our kitchen, in the space next to the chimney breast, it's incredibly useful.

I take it persuading SWMBO that you don't need the Donald Trump of fridges in the house isn't an option? Integrated fridges and freezers come in standard sizes, are easy enough to replace if they die and are expressly designed to be hidden............A run of full height cupboards across that end would look great and be very practical, with some hiding a full height integrated fridge and freezer.

I agree with earlier comment on the sink - no need for it to be under the window really, with the advent of dishwashers we spend much less time at them anyway. In my house the sink is not under the window, definitely happier with our main bit of worktop being there instead.

 

[malcolm]

I'm not completely certain the fridge will go through the kitchen door. It certainly looks tight to get it down the corridor and around the corner. Maybe I should cut some cardboard to shape and give it a try. I was not completely happy when the monstrosity turned up unannounced.

A concealed fridge at that end could be fun, and I do like the idea of filling that wall with cupboards/pantry and reducing the long thin aspect of the room. It should provide a lot of storage and makes the doors at that end look better positioned, and will be helpful with the borrowed light at that end of the room if the panelling is painted a light colour.

The drainage area for the sink should definitely not be in front of the window. The view is better from the right side of the window so maybe the sink on the left, allowing some space to dump groceries at the end of the work surface if the utility room ever becomes a useful entrance.

Ducting for the extractor will be fun. We have 3 inches to play with below the ceiling joists and a proposed straight ceiling, so a squished duct could be the answer. Otherwise we will be bothering brickwork beside the window arch.

 

[Hobden]

I'm not completely certain the fridge will go through the kitchen door. It certainly looks tight to get it down the corridor and around the corner. Maybe I should cut some cardboard to shape and give it a try.

A variant of the moving sofa problem then! See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moving_sofa_problem ... If you solve it, let the mathematicians know :wink:

 

[parkview094]

How spooky! We're in the process of planning a layout for a kitchen of almost identical size! ~5.5m x 3.16m



We were hoping to try and get a small table and chairs into the room, so our current thinking is an american fridge Freezer on the left hand wall with high units on either side to form a 'bank'. This is the inspiration I found on rightmove



Our neighbour has high-level units on the wall opposite the window. I worry if we did the same, that particular run of units may feel a little 'stranded'...

 

[parkview094]

I'm supposed to incorporate a huge expensive ugly american freezer that she bought.

Is your American fridge/freezer 90 or 120 wide? From your pictures, looks to be 120?

 

[parkview094]

Here's what a local kitchen specialist came up with for us..





We're also currently thinking of high-level ovens on the same wall with the hob in the chimney on the RH wall... so I'm sure more iterations will follow

 

[JBean]

Just to agree with Feltwell's point about big built-in cupboards. We had a row of five (well, four and a half) put along one wall of our kitchen. The fridge and freezer are hidden behind the last two on the right.


We would have preferred an original one (of course!) but quite like these, even if they are just modern painted oak.

 

[mims&pip]

I have to say that if a large fridge freezer has to be incorporated into the kitchen, I would much rather see it (or not!) behind a range of built-in cupboards such as that posted by JBean We have a (rather ancient at about 19 years old :wink: ) Smeg fridge freezer and I even find that a bit too obvious for my sensibilities!!!

Regarding positioning the sink beneath a window, I'm with Livias on this one. At two of our previous houses we've opted to place the sink on a windowless wall and liked the fact we could have a plate rack directly above it. The only reason we chose not to do this at our last house was that being an extension with just a double-height window in the vaulted-ceilinged, newly extended end, we felt we needed to add a casement window on the sink run wall to let in additional light......I'm not a fan of velux Windows which is what our architect had initially proposed :roll:

Whilst it's a modern phenomenon and probably not for the more 'purist' period kitchen designers amongst us, I also prefer to have mainly drawers in the kitchens we put in, finding them far more user-friendly

Mims x

 

[Pennyviz]

Be careful with the American style fridge freezer, we had at my old place. Sadly the kitchen here is too small to accommodate it so it is sitting in the shed. However, I do remember there being an issue with the depth and the way the doors hinged open, they may be making them more user friendly now.

 

[Abi Cott]

Placing the fridge freezer directly to the left of the main entrance is a very bad idea. It will mean that the room feels much smaller as it will block your field of view as you enter the room. Placing it on the end wall with large storage cupboards on either side would be aesthetically pleasing, and I think if I were designing this room for a client that is probably where I would place it. With large larder cabinets to either side (possibly with pull out wirework) the storage provided would obviate the need for very many wall units, which can also help to make a room look larger than it actually is.

Placing the range cooker to the left (as shown on the image) would then be your only option due to building regulations regarding the placement of hobs. If you are lowering the ceiling you could use the rectangular ventilation ducting

which comes in a variety of sizes depending on your choice of extractor hood, but most hoods will run on either 2" x 4" or 2.5" x 5".

Unless you are planning on using some form of solid surface worktop (granite/wood/resin) avoid those angled corner base units, the significantly increase the required depth of the worktop and can lead to unnecessary expense. Stick to the L-shape corner base, or the reach-round corner.

The sink doesn't really need to go under a window, although it is conventional, consider placing it on the end wall next to the door to the snug. This will place your primary preparation space behind you as you work at the cooker and provide good lighting for the prep space. I would particularly advocate this if there is going to be a dishwasher.

On either side of the range cooker consider draw packs rather than cupboards, particularly if you have space for pan draws. I would also place wall units either side of the cooker hood for storage of oils and spices.

One appliance you have yet to consider which is possibly the most used one in the kitchen is the kettle. If you are planning the electrics it will be important to know where this should be placed. Based on the design I have outlined I would suggest between the utility room door and the window would be a good location giving a central location between the milk and the water source.

Many of the large sheds offer a free design service, I would recommend taking advantage of this. Some charge for a home visit (though not the one I work at) and to be honest I think if you are planning on fitting the kitchen yourself that booking an in-store design based on your own measurements would be advantageous. Measure the room starting in one corner and measure all four walls. Include the width and location of doors and windows (measure doors to the outside of the architrave) it is also helpful if you can provide a ceiling height and window sill height.

Hope this helps

Abi

 

[Abi Cott]

Oops double post

 

[malcolm]

Thanks for all the ideas. The freezer is massive unfortunately - I only have 700mm space for cupboards behind the door opening to the snug so the freezer may need to stick out. I'll try to protect the design to hide a more sensibly sized freezer in the future should the big ugly one expire for any reason. I'll look up space requirements. I could step the cupboards out in the middle I suppose. I can worry about that much later - just need to work out where the services need to go at the moment, but can see the advantage in having a plan.

The sink used to be on the surface in the foreground. To some extent it can go anywhere, but I'll need to settle on a position before the sockets go in to avoid bad feng shui (they don't like the electrics water thing). I'm sold on the sink away from the window idea, but want to leave some space to drop groceries at the ends of the work surfaces near the entrance doors. Should that be a real worry? I'm happy with the cooker position so can set up the gas pipes, and those flat ducts will allow me to extract to the sensible wall.

The kettle at the moment is in another room. It does break conversation when I walk to the barn to get milk. I like a coffee making area outside the kitchen but the process could be made more efficient by moving the kettle to the kitchen.

I always seem to leave planning until the last minute. Hopefully the trades will be having a quiet time before Christmas and can move my pipes around.

 

[Abi Cott]

Having the f/f proud of the surrounding units can be a good thing, as someone else mentioned the hingeing of the doors can be problematic. Some hinge within the width of the carcase like a kitchen cupboard door hinge, but some require up to 50mm clearance to enable the door to open fully. If the door doesn't open past 90° you can't pull the drawers out. It might be worth unwrapping the beast and giving the doors a swing.

 

[malcolm]

A very good point. The trays won't come out unless the doors are opened way past 90 degrees. My kitchen will be blessed by the elegant facade of a huge fridge. Super. At least it won't be blessed by the side view of the fridge. A bit of plaster appeared on the walls today. Gas man commeth tomorrow so the oven won't move around too far from it's current location in the plan.