Hurrah, we're listed!

[JoceAndChris]

Nice posts there from AMc and Gareth.

Have a look at Country Life! And the houses in the upper price brackets in country areas on Rightmove- you'll see a strong trend that the £700,000 + houses are listed buildings. I think there's a cachet, a snob value, a seal of approval to being listed: lets's face it- the best buildings in the UK are listed. The middle classes might bemoan having to replicate fenestration or keep the bread oven that gets in the way of the planned Aga but secretly they absolutely love it I'm sure. Else why would they buy a listed building? Under the grumbling is a marked respect for the history that goes with period property ownership, and I guess from psychological perspective a feeling of buying into tradition, rootedness, Britishness, stabilty, order, a sense of belonging. I see it as very similar to grumbling about strict school uniforms or tax bills- we might love to hate them but also feel that their loss would lead to chaos.

We bought this place for just 350k. It was a working class home through most of the 20th C, was not in good decorative order, and was not marketed by the top agents. With the extra land we've bought, a complete redeccy and listed status, which is in itself a passport into marketing it from more expensive agents and then appealing to, and targeting, London commuters (as Chris is) it gets an extra 100k according to agents we've spoken to. This could have a positive effect when it comes to changing the mortgage. That all sounds like I want to sell but actually my motivation is 98% romantic and 2% financial. I emailed the previous owner last night, and he said "I'm so glad you and Chris bought that place. Now it will stay unspoilt forever." No price can be put on that feeling.

Lovely garden Joss- you've worked very hard, don't let the weather defeat you!

 

[Flyfisher]

Most of the property programs on TV seem to tell horror stories about disputes with CO's and how much more expensive everything is with a listed building,

Of course, because such programmes are mostly for entertainment rather than education and horror stories are always entertaining, especially from the comfort of a newly-built house. There's little entertainment value in explaining how the CO can provide a wealth of free expert advice and consultancy or how planning consent is also free or how alterations were VAT-free until the last budget - so quite a bit less expensive in some respects.

 

[JoceAndChris]

 

[dans]

An old property with character that is not listed is unusual and attractive to buyers. A listing status does put people off. I forget how many times people have said to me that "you're so lucky it isn't listed" and "I would never buy a listed house"!

I used to believe that it would make no difference to me whether it was listed or not, as all the alterations I am making are sympathetic and in-keeping. I now realise that the things I have done to the house would have taken far longer to get approved and far more expensive and inpractical to perform. Our repairs on the timber frame would have been more time consuming and we would have had to spend weeks repairing the very dry and dead wattle n daub panels, whilst instead we've been practical about the frame working with a structural engineer and we've upgraded the insulation system on the house making it easier to live with and kinder on the oak frame...

Currently, the only thing that we've done to the house that would have benefitted from being listed was that we wouldn't have to install trickle vents in our windows!

Congrats to you though, as it's a lively thing to know that your house is important enough to be listed and preserved!

 

[dans]

I meant "a lovely thing"!

 

[JoceAndChris]

It sounds like you're doing a job to be proud of Dans, and I guess it does depend a lot on the house.
(but more on the needs of the buyer - some just need to be able to create their home from scratch!)

I really couldn't rest in my old age or even grave if I sell at 70 years and new owners knock through into open plan living, or whip out the fireplaces for more efficient wood burners, or take out the draughty old sashes for upvc, or put on a tile roof, or, or...

I know Richard (the previous owner) feels the same- he took two years and refusals of a few offers( one to develop the property into professional kennels) to find a buyer who'd respect it. He didn't list the property as like you he was worried about putting people off- but what he didn't realise is that there are proper hard core conservationists like me.

People have the maddest impulses and aren't to be trusted when it comes to developing period properties. Even my joiner, who's actually a real craftsman and appreciates old buildings, came to me with the serious suggestion of knocking out the polygonal bay at the front and extending that bay to create a 30 foot conservatory. I didn't know what to say, I must have turned scarlet with suppressed rage at the very idea of it. People lack architectural awareness, they see houses as blank canvases for their own taste - which is a very problematic attitude when it comes to old buildings.

Some pics anyway -lots of lovely new faces on here who mightn't have seen the old threads -any excuse to get them out :wink: !

eedham/UnfencedfieldJune2011004.jpg[/IMG]

 

[jocelyn plummer]

It's good to look back through those pictures Joss, makes it all seem well worth the effort doesn't it.
Garden is coming along too!

 

[JoceAndChris]

Well it's certainly been a tough year for gardening but it hasn't stopped me - here's the recent pics

Need something that isn't too twee for that shaped square over the drain in the clipped box hedging - but what? A cannon? A statue?

Roses were lovely for about 2 weeks!

Experimenting with shapes and trying to create rose archway which leads to a good viewpoint

Inspired by you Joss I changed the front door colour and invested in pompom trees. How's your front door doing?

Georgie, nearly grown up and a proud Dad

Earl of Harrowby very tame these days

 

[dans]

Lovely house, fantastic pictures! Very lucky! Some great views! Thanks for sharing!

 

[vicky whitworth]

It says in the property pages of The Times today that being listed adds 34% to the value of the property.

You can insist on not having trickle vents in non-listed buildings if you can show you have adequate alternative sources of ventilation. I loathe trickle vents, refused to have them in a kitchen and bathroom extension to the cottage and put in cast iron ventilation grids instead. It went through building control fine.

Great news Joce. You put the effort in - you deserve the champagne.
Vicky

 

[angrybird]

It was lovely to see your pics it really is a truly beautiful house and its great to think it will be preserved for future generations to come.
It makes me so angry to see beautiful houses razed to the ground for the sake of new build "shoe boxes" and don't get me started on UPVC :evil: and laminate flooring !!! We are trying to replace the ugly UPVC windows with handmade windows, very laborious but so satisfying when we take a horrid plastic window out and replace it with a bespoke window lovingly handmade by Mr Angrybird.
Would it be unladylike to stamp on the old PVC window frames ? i'm sure it would make me feel much better :twisted:

keep up the good work,your garden is looking superb xxxx

 

[Keithj]

A beautiful house, Joce, and congrats on getting it listed. So it should be!

angrybird: be careful about what you wish for with UPVC! If it was listed with UPVC windows, some COs will insist on retaining UPVC. You'd hope that they would all see the point, but I've heard a couple of sad stories...

 

[JoceAndChris]

Thank you so much for the lovely comments dans, Vicky, angrybird and Keith. The old house route is the easiest, and I think all of us do a stirling job keeping these places going and spreading enthusiasm for our built heritage.

Angry bird - careful stamping on the upvc, it probably bites when it's provoked. Good luck with your timber window replacement, that sounds like a real labour of live but so worthwhile.

Vicky - glad you made them see sense over the vents. And fascinating to hear that the Times put such a figure on listing. 8)

 

[Gareth Hughes]

If you had two houses, next to each other in identical condition, one listed the other not then I would expect the unlisted property to be slightly more desirable to property developers and those with a fondness for "knocking through", extending and "improving".

In practice very few houses are listed next to an identical sibling which isn't also protected - one of the general reasons of a listing being to protect a unique building or a street of houses with particular merit etc. So the case of comparison never really arrives. One of the problems with mortages and insurance on unusual period homes is that "comparables" are few and far between so the price tends to be a suck it and see process.

It's rare, but it happens. The house on the right is listed, the one on the left isn't. I think this says it all
(apologies for reviving a very old thread, I've been in a reminiscent mood this evening)

 

[88v8]

Dear o dear. Was it not listed because it was already too far gone?

Ivor

 

[paulb33]

Dear o dear. Was it not listed because it was already too far gone?

Ivor

That shouldn't be an excuse in this case. Regardless of what state its in, surely it should have been listed too. It being so integral to the integrity other house.

As previously mentioned, our house was listed 'because' uPVC was installed.

 

[malcolm]

It could still be listed surely. Modern additions tend to have a limited lifetime and when they need to be replaced the owners could be required to go back to whatever the current conservation trend might be. Can't imagine it would be cheap to replicate the cast iron to match the listed side though - that's really specialist stuff these days.

I'm quite lucky to have a poorly maintained place that hasn't 'benefited' from uPVC. Won't get to benefit much from repairs either if building regs have their way.

 

[CliffordPope]

Hopefully by then everyone will have realised how truly rubbish UPVC really is.

More likely uPVC will be a reason for listing in itself. There will be specialist firms preserving old examples of genuine uPVC, and a dwindling number of skilled installers still working.

COs will be making a fuss about the use of cheap imported uPVC from Poland or Kazakstan.

 

[a twig]

Can't imagine it would be cheap to replicate the cast iron to match the listed side though - that's really specialist stuff these days.

That it ain't, a custom iron fire grate (13" x 5") to replace the existing victorian one that had gone walkies set me back nearly £300 a couple of years back! I dread to think what all that would cost!

 

[LadyArowana]

Can't imagine it would be cheap to replicate the cast iron to match the listed side though - that's really specialist stuff these days.

That it ain't, a custom iron fire grate (13" x 5") to replace the existing victorian one that had gone walkies set me back nearly £300 a couple of years back! I dread to think what all that would cost!

I know. I would like to put the balconette back on our house, and I'm thinking '000's. Of course it would require LBC, but we are the only one in the terrace ( all listed ) that has lost it, or continues to be without. My neighbour has what we believe is an original, and there are some different patterns. I think it spoils the symmetry of the run as ours looks a little bit like a missing tooth in the lovely smile, but that's just my opinion and the CO may feel differently.