Boilers

[fluffytail10]

Hello everyone,
our plumber has told us that our oil combi boiler is on it's last legs and need replacing. He has suggested an external boiler as our kitchen is so small. Has anyone got experience of these? and what type of boiler should we get? At the moment we have 8 radiators and solar hot water so we have both a cold and hot water tank. The oil fired combi boiler we have is rubbish, we never got water from it hot enough for a bath, and the water comes out at a trickle.

So what would you recommend?



Here is a picture of the house,I'm not sure where an external boiler would fit.

thanks

 

[Feltwell]

My mother-in-law has oil fired heating with a boiler in an external brick built shed, what was once the coal shed. I can't help much with the type of boiler as this is an old setup - my father-in-law installed it in about 1970 and it's still working. It can't be the most efficient of setups though as the shed is always toasty and warm when the boiler is running, it clearly loses quite a bit of heat.

 

[Baron de Gynes]

Ours is an outdoor combi boiler. It was made by Grant (it's a Vortex Outdoor Combi Module 36 or something) and seems to be okay.

Now.

It wasn't installed correctly by the original company (way before we moved in) and it was only when it died a death in the hardest winter since 1947 that 'our' plumber looked at it and FINISHED the installation. Muppets.

It sits outside in a relatively sheltered spot and chugs away quite happily. I've never had experience of Oil before, but it doesn't seem to be any problem. The only thing is that when it falters (which doesn't happen... *touch wood*) is that you have o pop outside in your carpet slippers and tend to its every whim. I cut quite a dash in my velvet smoking jacket, I can tell you.

 

[madworthy]

Try having a look on the Which website they have a good review on oil boilers.
I had been planing on a combi, having had good service from gas combies. BUT having read the reviews and some of the technical specs I'm going for a system boiler, but an indoor one. That law dictates that it will need fettling when it's raining and night.

 

[Onetap]

You'd get more expert advice on a plumbing & central heating forum. Try this one;
http://www.diynot.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=7&sid=122b8207b4016511832e850cb1d9293f

Combi boilers have their place and that place is in flats or houses where there is no room for a stored hot water cylinder. The problems are that all the components are shoe-horned into a very compact casing and the repair and maintenance costs are greater if/when something goes wrong. They use plate heat exchangers, to heat the domestic hot water, which are great but with conditions attached, the main one being that they will clog up in hard water areas. Combi's are a quick, profitable fix for plumbers and they are missold more than PPI insurance.

 

[tobydog]

We have a relatively new Firebird C26 combi condensing bolier in a room off our hallway. We had a perfect place for it outside on the other side of the hallway wall but we're glad we went indoors. The room is just big enough for the boiler and the washing machine. As Feltwell said, the heat given off by boilers (even modern and efficient ones like ours) is considerable and simply lost to the elements outside. We actually use this heat to our advantage an use the room for clothes drying. There is a small fan in there which is just right for taking the moist air out at the same rate the heat is generated (luck rather than judgment!).

 

[Lime]

Hello everyone,
our plumber has told us that our oil combi boiler is on it's last legs and need replacing.

I'd ask another plumber's opinion before ripping out the one you've got.
The hot water problem you have experienced may be beyond your plumber's skill hence the "last legs" comment.
... It is a very common "opinion" of many plumbers and a nice earner for them too.
I've lost count of the number of people who have said to me that they wish they'd never been talked into changing their boiler.

 

[vicky whitworth]

Hi, we have an oil combi boiler. We love the combi arrangement. It heats seven radiators and a towel rail and a big Victorian bath producing hot water on demand. We had our emersion heater and tank taken out because it never gave us enough hot water and we gained the space where the tank is. Our boiler is indoors in our scullery which it keeps toasty and we use as a drying room.

What we hate is the make of boiler WARMFLOW. Never, ever buy a WARMFLOW boiler. It has been breaking down ever since it was first installed (buy a proper plumber). The customer service given to us by WARMFLOW even when it was still in guarantee was dreadful. Their own staff said the boiler was knackered and should be replaced but WARMFLOW wouldn't do it and then shouted at the man who'd come to repair it down the phone while in my house. The man nearly cried. I have repeated told WARMFLOW that I would always tell people their boilers are rubbish. But they don't care so as far as I'm concerned they don't deserve anyone's business. We are thinking of having it replaced. It went in in 2009. It has broken down (and sometimes flooded) more than half a dozen times. We'd have a Grant next. Vicky

 

[FamilyWiggs]

Thanks Vicky - very useful. It's easy to get a duff example of any piece of machinery and understandable, but if the customer service stinks, then that's worse as you can't overcome the duff kit.

Well warned...makes mental note to self not to buy Warmflow in future. 8)

 

[fluffytail10]

Thank you all for that. I had wondered about heat-loss outside and I'll try to get it put inside - the current one is in the corner of the kitchen so there is a space already there - though I had hoped for a bit more space inside. I think the one we have is very old so I wouldn't be surprised if it does need replacing. As I said it is useless and never heats up the water, plus it only comes out as a trickle when it finally does get going - hence the installation of the solar panels.

I have searched the Which site and various others but to be honest I'm not really sure I understand all the jargon, so was just looking for a few good names and ones to avoid.

It's wet days like these when I really fancy a bath and there's no hot water to be got, even for ready money!

thank you so much for your help.

 

[Keithj]

The critical thing with boilers is to find an honest and competent plumber.

We had one in Essex (until he retired). The large firm in town took over his clients, and immediately told us that we needed a new boiler, which would mean a new hot water system (pumped rather than gravity fed) and would cost around £10k (for a 5-bedroom house). The old plumber was still in town, and told me to ignore the advice. We did.

The oil-fired boiler here in Suffolk wasn't producing much heat or hot water, although it seemed to use plenty of oil. The churchwardens (bless 'em) gave me the details of the "village plumber" and arranged for him to call. We're now toasty warm, and can have a hot bath when we want. He has told us that the boiler isn't in the first flush of youth, but if not maltreated will probably see us out. I don't know how he makes a living with the prices he charges, but he seems happy enough.

The problem, we have been told repeatedly, is that Law requires all new boilers to be "condensing". Basically, as I understand it, that means they are about 5% more efficient, are laden with electronics and stuff to go wrong, and have an average life expectancy of 8 years (where the old ones would do 30 - 40 years). I wouldn't be surprised if the cost of replacing the whole thing every 8 years wasn't more expensive than the 5% efficiency improvement.

We now also have an almost inexhaustible supply of logs to burn on the open fire or in the log burner (there is some good in Leylandii - when you cut them down) so oil costs are much reduced anyway.

 

[FamilyWiggs]

We now also have an almost inexhaustible supply of logs to burn on the open fire or in the log burner (there is some good in Leylandii - when you cut them down) so oil costs are much reduced anyway.

Oh no, leyladii are pure evil. Burning lots of them coats your chimbly with gunge.

 

[kaz]

Please can someone provide advice:

My grade II property is in Essex. A couple of years ago I moved to Sussex to be closer to the oldies, but was worried I might not settle here, so kept my Essex home and rented it out. A few months back the tenants said the boiler no longer works... a company came to repair, but said the oil burner is now knackered and needs replacing. My questions are:

The existing oil boiler is housed in a cupboard on an inside wall in the kitchen... the outlet is via an original chimney breast. The requirements are that replacement boilers need to be fitted to an outside wall... is this correct (this includes listed properties)? I do have a pantry on an external wall which could house a boiler, but resiting is going to be expensive.

Reading the previous posts, I see that Grant boilers have been recommended... I've never had to deal with anything like this before and am worried about being ripped off. What do I do next (a company is trying to source an appropriate boiler and this seems to be taking some time... what on earth could be the hold up?).

The tenants have moved out (no heating) and I'm massively concerned about the cold bring damp into the property.

 

[Flyfisher]

Does "the oil burner is now knackered and needs replacing" mean that the entire boiler needs to be replaced? Is it not possible to just replace the 'oil burner' part(s) ?

 

[kaz]

Thanks for the reply. They were hoping it would just be a case of replacing parts, but the fan had wedged itself into the motor which meant that they couldn't physically remove the motor.

 

[Flyfisher]

I probably shoudn't comment about that as I'm certainly no boiler expert, but I would be questioning whether a jammed fan/motor is really a good reason for having to buy and fit a brand new boiler.

Can the fan/motor really not be removed in some way? Even if they are destroyed in the process, a new fan/motor must surely be a lot cheaper than a completely new boiler.

Sorry for not being more helpful, but I would be seeking a second opinion.

 

[DJH]

I agree with Flyfisher on this one.

External boilers are common in Ireland, in fact oil boilers are seldom fitted inside dwellings mainly because there isn't room in older properties and there is also the perception that they can smell of oil which can be given off when the boiler fires up in a down draught situation or from oil line fittings which can be prone to weeping especially near the burner if it has a tendency to vibrate at all.

Grant boilers seem to be the most popular but they do have a tendency to smoke a bit from the flue if they are not serviced both regularly and properly! It is important when a boiler is fitted externally or situated in an unheated outhouse for it to have a frost thermostat fitted so that in freezing conditions it will fire up in order to avoid frost damage.

 

[robgil]

Have you considered calor gas? Cheaper, cleaner more efficient boilers, and with the price of oil constantly rising it might work out cheaper to run as well.

 

[kaz]

Lol... I'm guessing boilers aren't the most interesting topic!

 

[Moo]

Whatever makes you think that? This thread is already on its second page, and probably has quite a bit of mileage left in it, knowing PPUKers.