Retrospective Planning when buying. Help!

[andrew gayton]

I just had a thought about this.

No time to get the law books out before the weekend, but while Listed Building Consent enforcment is not time constrained, the garage would have only required planning permission impacting on the setting of a listed buiding. As such is this covered by the four year rule and exempt from enforcment?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Garnett

correct.

 

[PuppyD]

I just had a thought about this.

No time to get the law books out before the weekend, but while Listed Building Consent enforcment is not time constrained, the garage would have only required planning permission impacting on the setting of a listed buiding. As such is this covered by the four year rule and exempt from enforcment?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Garnett

correct.

well now im really confused this is what my solicitor said ....

I have looked at the estate agent particulars and note that the building is a listed building. Erecting structures, including garages, within the curtilage of a listed building without listed building consent is not only a breach of planning requirements and leaves the owner of the property open to enforcement action by the local authority but it is also a criminal offence which transfers to the current owners of the property. The issue regarding the lack of planning permission for the garage must therefore be checked and rectified by the seller prior to completion. They can contact the Local Authority to obtain retrospective consent which is what we would ask them to do or at least obtain confirmation that no enforcement proceedings will be taken as a result of the lack of planning permissions. As the property is listed to ensure that you are fully protected such consent or confirmation regarding enforcement action is necessary.

 

[PuppyD]

I just had a thought about this.

No time to get the law books out before the weekend, but while Listed Building Consent enforcment is not time constrained, the garage would have only required planning permission impacting on the setting of a listed buiding. As such is this covered by the four year rule and exempt from enforcment?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Garnett

correct.

well now im really confused this is what my solicitor said ....

I have looked at the estate agent particulars and note that the building is a listed building. Erecting structures, including garages, within the curtilage of a listed building without listed building consent is not only a breach of planning requirements and leaves the owner of the property open to enforcement action by the local authority but it is also a criminal offence which transfers to the current owners of the property. The issue regarding the lack of planning permission for the garage must therefore be checked and rectified by the seller prior to completion. They can contact the Local Authority to obtain retrospective consent which is what we would ask them to do or at least obtain confirmation that no enforcement proceedings will be taken as a result of the lack of planning permissions. As the property is listed to ensure that you are fully protected such consent or confirmation regarding enforcement action is necessary.

ohhh i guess actually she is saying that the planning office could just say its ok?

 

[PuppyD]

Sounds sensible to me. There is the potential for the buyer to get upset, after all he bought the house and lived there with no problems, but you sound a rational and considerate person that would be able to handle this.

i might suggest it next week, he came out to the house when we had builders out to look at the flooring. He doesn't live in it and hasn't for a good few years so hopefully will be interested in talking directly to us. After all he is paying fir a mortgage on an empty house (previously rented) and he is retired so im sure he wants to progress. (Hopefully)

obviously the vendor is now not answering his phone, but its all ok the new EA we have sorting our file is quote "well versed in planning applications" so its all ok :?

 

[Gareth Hughes]

I just had a thought about this.

No time to get the law books out before the weekend, but while Listed Building Consent enforcment is not time constrained, the garage would have only required planning permission impacting on the setting of a listed buiding. As such is this covered by the four year rule and exempt from enforcment?

Any thoughts appreciated.

Garnett

correct.

well now im really confused this is what my solicitor said ....

I have looked at the estate agent particulars and note that the building is a listed building. Erecting structures, including garages, within the curtilage of a listed building without listed building consent is not only a breach of planning requirements and leaves the owner of the property open to enforcement action by the local authority but it is also a criminal offence which transfers to the current owners of the property. The issue regarding the lack of planning permission for the garage must therefore be checked and rectified by the seller prior to completion. They can contact the Local Authority to obtain retrospective consent which is what we would ask them to do or at least obtain confirmation that no enforcement proceedings will be taken as a result of the lack of planning permissions. As the property is listed to ensure that you are fully protected such consent or confirmation regarding enforcement action is necessary.

Garnett and Andrew are right, your solicitor is wrong. Works to a listed building require Listed Building Consent, erecting structures in the curtilage of a listed building is not works to the building, so doesn't. However, since erecting structures in the curtilage of a listed building is not permitted Development, it does require Planning Permission. There is no time limit for enforcement over breaches of Listed Building Consent, but there is a time limit for enforcement over Planning Permission and that applies even where the only reason that PP was required is that the "offending" structure is within the curtilage of a listed building.

 

[Gareth Hughes]

Incidentally, I'm not sure I'd be happy using a solicitor whose idea of checking up is

I have looked at the estate agent particulars

 

[PuppyD]

Garnett and Andrew are right, your solicitor is wrong. Works to a listed building require Listed Building Consent, erecting structures in the curtilage of a listed building is not works to the building, so doesn't. However, since erecting structures in the curtilage of a listed building is not permitted Development, it does require Planning Permission. There is no time limit for enforcement over breaches of Listed Building Consent, but there is a time limit for enforcement over Planning Permission and that applies even where the only reason that PP was required is that the "offending" structure is within the curtilage of a listed building.

...and the plot thickens. Gareth please don't take this the wrong way, but your knowledge is based on? I do believe my solicitor is bulking together the two issues with have with the property. The garage having no planning permission and the fire place no listed consents so she might just think she is simplifying things for my constant questions. Definitely food for thought. Surely the vendor should just contact the planning office book an appointment take photos and they will just tell him whether he needs to apply or not? And then just apply for works to chimney for listed consents? Or am I making out its simple?

 

[Gareth Hughes]

My knowledge is based on my past ten years as a local authority conservation officer.
Preceded by ten years as an architect chiefly concerned with historic building matters.

However, I would say that in my experience, planning officers and even CO's can't always be trusted to know what the rules are themselves.

 

[PuppyD]

My knowledge is based on my past ten years as a local authority conservation officer.
Preceded by ten years as an architect chiefly concerned with historic building matters.

However, I would say that in my experience, planning officers and even CO's can't always be trusted to know what the rules are themselves.

The CO just skirted around the subject doesnt do house visits and just said we need to go and discuss with a planning officer, so thats my next step.

We are with south cambs you dont want to transfer??

 

[PuppyD]

Just been told that the vendor needs to apply for Lawful Development for the garage, not retrospective planning, do I tell my solicitor they got it wrong? Or are they the same?