Making the garden dog proof

[tobydog]

Joce - now I'm home I can see the pictures of your garden. At work certain pictures get chopped off. Very nice and I agree that you could lose a fence in there somewhere. I reckon you could also find a friendly blacksmith to make you a gate to fill the gap in the holly hedge.

I hope my defence of the dog wasn't too insensitive. I just didn't want the post to go down the route of demonising the dog.

I have to say though that when you refer to 'defend, chase, kill, eat, fight and mate', these are characteristics you see all too often in humans let alone dogs. Maybe they are often referred to man's best friend for a reason.

 

[Feltwell]

Tobydog beat me to it!

A dog is a pack animal with strong instincts to defend, chase, kill, eat, fight, mate - these instincts don't sit very easily with human habits

You've not been out on the town on a Saturday night for a while then!!

Seriously, Joce that sounds horrendous and very upsetting. Not all dogs or owners are bad and it is possible to live next to them in harmony - I grew up next to a small kennels that bred gun dogs, with a very responsible and caring owner it was never an issue. But I freely admit we never kept chickens.

As I think someone else mentioned above, is it worth some "Chickens roaming freely - please keep your dog on a lead" signs on the path a short way from your house? I'm not saying that everyone will stick to that, but some will and so reduce the risk - and others will at least keep their dog near them. If you are dog walker you tend to end up knowing everyone else that walks their dog on that route, especially if you go at a regular time. Word gets around if something has happened.

For what it's worth I don't think you should be ashamed at all of not being able to put your birds out of their misery. Big hairy biker that I am (or rather was....), I once took a blackbird that a neighbour's cat had injured in my garden to the vets to be put down!

Thankfully, neighbours like this seem to be rare over here. Although I do wonder in truth how "rampant" a problem it is.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-15475636

 

[JoceAndChris]

So sorry to hear this - can't imagine the nightmare you've been through. I'd be devastated.

I'm not sure about to what extent you can dog proof your garden without ruining the look of it.

I will say though that as a doggy person myself, I always appreciate signs up if there's any risk he might cause havoc - most of us are responsible owners (I promise!) and maybe a couple of signs along the edge of your garden saying something along the lines of 'chickens run loose in this area - please keep dogs on a short lead' would help? If nothing else, it gives you a stronger footing with an owner if anything does happen again (though I really, really hope it never does).

Thank you for your post Louise, I put up signs to keep them on a lead just after the attack. Now I am getting a stream of kindly people explaining to me that their dog would never chase a chicken, because he's old, or he's frightened, or it isn't in his nature, and so there is no need for them to put him/her on a lead. I don't want to argue with them, but if there was a chciken visible on the other side of the hedge, and a gap that doggy could squeeze through or a wall to jump over to get to it, how can they guarantee it? Oh, I just have to hope that they're right and that the people who have young spaniels or whatever will put them on a lead. I'm not greatly optimistic though, I've lost 7 hens in two years to dogs and there have been many signs over the years. Plus my cockerels crow loudly and incessantly so there's no mistaking what lives here. Some people really, really just don't care. If only everyone could be caring and responsible like you!

Joce - now I'm home I can see the pictures of your garden. At work certain pictures get chopped off. Very nice and I agree that you could lose a fence in there somewhere. I reckon you could also find a friendly blacksmith to make you a gate to fill the gap in the holly hedge.

I hope my defence of the dog wasn't too insensitive. I just didn't want the post to go down the route of demonising the dog.

I have to say though that when you refer to 'defend, chase, kill, eat, fight and mate', these are characteristics you see all too often in humans let alone dogs. Maybe they are often referred to man's best friend for a reason.

I agree with you that people see themselves in animals and that's partly what makes them so loveable. I also agree with you that it would be nice if the thread didn't go down the route of demonising the dog. But I don't think I made my meaning very clear - if the dog is fighting you, or chasing or killing your pets, or eating your shopping as you unload from the car (I've had this happen here!!), or chewing your things, or mating your leg, and it it is not your dog, then it's going to cause stress and upsetment, and its ways are not fitting in with your ways. Humans must check their instincts to live in society. Responsible owners must control their dog's instincts to live happily around people. Most do.

And you aren't insensitive at all, but very kind, and thanks for your posts.

Big hairy biker that I am (or rather was....), I once took a blackbird that a neighbour's cat had injured in my garden to the vets to be put down!

:lol: This has really made me laugh this morning. Fantastic.

 

[JoceAndChris]

By the way, this story goes way back with me. As a child, we had a Rottweiler, and I loved her very much. She roughed me up a bit in play now and again, and none of us ever got control of her, but I forgave her, and grew up with no fear of animals, but just seeing how they enhance your life and fill it with interest and companionship. One day when I was away at boarding school the dog jumped over the fence at the back of my parents' garden and killed some new hens beyond. The farmer asked my mother to greatly heighten the fence at the back of the property, but she didn't want the alteration in the view (the view was nice) and so she sold the dog. I came home, the dog was gone, I was pretty devastated. So I've been on both sides of this, and either way, losing something you've loved and looked after hurts.

 

[philpjuk100]

Also although not "doggy" folk we have many friends who are responsible owners even one with two Rottweilers who tells us"no one messes with me cause I have rotties!" but they are walked on leads and not allowed to roam.I found the staffy that killed our hen on the edge of the village,the owner denied it was his saying it was good natured,would not hurt a fly and was never let out.I pointed out it was wearing a studded collar which had been extended with white cable ties just like his,he then turned nasty saying "whats the fuss about its only a fu*"%ng hen?clear off or I`ll set the dog on you!" Bought a 22 air pistol to distract it should it return(it has a great pair of "nuts" for a target!) our hens and other from our road have the run of the village and it seems such a pity to have to pen them in.After bellas death the others now seem to stay nearer to home and when they hear a dog bark make a run for the hut.

 

[JoceAndChris]

That is a terribly sad story. I feel your rage. Somebody needs to dig a large grave and bury these people who make such blots on the landscape and such a waste of potentially useful human organs.

On a happier note, chickens have the run of your village. Not many places in England can boast that; it must be a pretty sight.

 

[tobydog]

Had to laugh about the nuts for a target.

As for free roaming chickens, I remember when we went to the Suffolk Wildfowl Centre to get ours, we passed a Light Sussex scratching around on the side of the A14 at the Asda turn-off. We had to go that way two days later and it was still there. It did cross my mind too late that I was actually paying good money for a Light Sussex but I didn't have the heart to catch this 'wild' one. Having said that, I've seen Rocky try and catch chickens so I shouldn't flatter myself. Also I would probably have chased this otherwise streetwise chook into the traffic. It is good to see them doing what comes naturally.

 

[philpjuk100]

We have friends who had a chicken brought to them that was found in the car park at the local KFC! (DWB are you still on the forum? not posted for some time)

 

[philpjuk100]

Why dont folks call their pit bulls and rottweillers something sweet like "fluffy" instead of satan,tyson,chaos etc?

 

[JoceAndChris]

Because we live in a society where God is dead and violence and chaos made glamorous and exciting amongst the anarchic flotsam drifting in the sea of state-spongers and petty criminals. Duty and responsiblity are out of fashion.

Chickens do get out - but do bear in mind that when you pick up seemingly lost and homeless animals many aren't lost at all, but just like to take a walk. A lot of people have informed me chickens are living wild in the Crematorium below my house, but they've failed to notice there is an allotment bordering and the chickens are just nipping in and out under the hedge to party on the graves, and going back to sleep in their little shed.

It would be out of character for a chicken to leave its friends so if any are spotted in odd places, alone, I'd be really inclined to think they've run from their nearby home due to predator attack, and I'd want to be taking a good 100 metre walk in all directions before claiming the chicken, and yes, it would be pretty impossible to catch it, you'd have to return at night with a very good torch.They just let you pick them up at night.

 

[Coz]

So sorry Joce. I have a dog and keep chickens but am careful never to let the two mix. Our Border terrier is an escape fiend. We put chicken wire all across our gate and all around the garden in front of or among the hedging and it has done the trick. Our front gate is five feet high and the dog can't get over it. A while ago we heard a noise in the garden and a rangy flea bitten mongrel had jumped the gate but luckily the chooks were in their run. Putting wire mesh across the gates and fences stops your average mutt from getting in or out though, and also it is pretty un-noticable. Hope you can get it sorted. Definately demand compensation from the owner.

 

[Flyfisher]

Not all dogs or owners are bad and it is possible to live next to them in harmony - I grew up next to a small kennels that bred gun dogs, with a very responsible and caring owner it was never an issue. But I freely admit we never kept chickens.

Funny you should mention that. I looked after a friend's gundog for three weeks during the summer, a 'standard issue' black lab about 5 years old, so pretty much in his prime, but very steady and obedient.

During the time I had him, I was doing some work on the chicken shed and took him into their fenced-off area (though he could have easily jumped the field gate had he wanted to). He certainly showed an initial interest in the hens but a sharp 'no' and he subsequently ignored them completely. The hens showed no alarm either, though of course they kept well clear of him.

I suppose it's that old saying about there being no bad dogs only bad owners - of which, sadly, there are plenty.

Now, if I could only stop the cat from killing things . . . .

PS: Speaking of cats, our cat, or the neighbouring ones, have never been a problem for our hens. I suppose they are a bit too large and 'flappy', though I've never actually seen a cat become particularly interested in them. But I was watching about half a dozen pheasants on the lawn a couple of weeks ago and noticed our cat stalking one of them. The pheasant saw the cat, stopped, then moved cautiously towards the cat. The cat moved slightly for better cover and another pheasant saw it and began to advance. When the pheasant was about 6-7 feet or so from the cat, she decided to retreat slightly, which emboldened the pheasants to advanced even more. As the cat continued to retreat, she attracted the attention fo the other pheasants and they all started to advance on her and she eventually lolloped away.

It all looked like curiosity on the part of the pheasants, rather than aggression, but it showed that even cats have their limits. Sadly, it doesn't extend to field mice, shrews and baby swifts. If only I could train her to hunt moles!

 

[JoceAndChris]

She is probably keeping your property free of mice so don't be too hard on her! My cat never hunts birds, not even fledglings or chicks. The hens will go and sit a metre from him, because when he catches the mice they run in and take them. It's a kind of happy symbiosis!

Thanks Coz, I am encouraged to hear the chicken wire is effective. I spent the day trying to do what I can with the limited funds we have just at present. It's certainly on the to-do list to get professional fencing, but hopefully this netting, which is garden side, will at least offer some protection. As Coz says it isn't very visible, and even the gate doesn't look too bad - I've snipped it straight along the top rail now.

 

[Coz]

Well done Joce - hope it works and you don't have any more problems. My chickens luckily have been safe so far - but they are confined to a large walk in run. I wouldn't let them free range with my Border Terrier around - cos she hates them. She sits outside the run and charges at them. They in turn show great disdain for her and ignore her but its better they are kept apart I think. Can't complain though cos she is a terrific mouser - better than a cat as she dispatches them but doesn't bring them into the house as presents!!

 

[FamilyWiggs]

Joce - I'm sorry you lost another one.

Our turkeys free range widely across our fields (it's what makes them taste so nice).

Bl00dy fox took a huge stag in daylight a day or two ago. I got to find the remains. :twisted: At least this is part of life's cycle - dogs attacking chickens because their owners don't have control is not part of the natural cycle.

I'd like to say that this didn't happen when the Hunt was freer, but sadly they didn't come this way. My neighbour does a sterling job of keeping them down but can't get all of them.

They're now shut away for a few days in case it comes back, I don't like keeping them indoors.

 

[MattW]

£22 to have her dispatched

It seems that a little of the country boy is still in me despite the move to the smoke... dispatching an injured alive bird takes a moment either by wringing its neck or hitting it over the head with a priest/stick/anything to hand. Also not difficult to do by holding the bird by the body and hitting its head against a post or similar if no stick to hand. Decapitation by a spade obviously works too. But the idea of driving of N miles while the bird suffers for it to be euthanised by a vet for £22 strikes me as somewhat odd. Apologies if this seems insensitive, but surely if one keep fowl & live in the country one needs to know how to cleanly kill them and then prepare them for the pot if required?

 

[philpjuk100]

Took her to the vets to see if he could save her,he could not so put her "to sleep" and sent us a bill for £22.It was explained in a later post,phil.

 

[JoceAndChris]

Attempting to club a bird to death or decapitate with spade sounds pretty unspeakably low and barbaric to me. I actually can't believe I'm reading that here. It certainly isn't what the vet told me to do, or what other experienced poultry keepers have said ( which is always the neck pulling method or swift decapitation with a good axe)

The judgement as to whether a bird will survive its wound isn't always something you can make alone, without the experience of a vet.

As for eating my ornamental fowl, there would be little point as they aren't meat birds. They're loved pets, perhaps a concept some find hard to grasp.

 

[vicky whitworth]

"Dispatched" - that's a dreadful word that people seem to use when it comes to killing chickens. We're dreading the first time one of our ladies' time comes.
Gate looks fine, Jose. Like the chicken sign - where did you get it?

Flyfisher, would you like to borrow Albert Herring? He specialises in moles. Usually a two a week man. Yesterday's mole was happily running round in the fireplace (not lit) until caught and returned to the wild. The one earlier in the week was not so lucky and had been dispatched by Albert to be found toes turned up behind the harmonium when he started to whiff.

 

[JoceAndChris]

I can't remember which website that chalkboard came from Vicky, Chris bought it for me. But there's a similar one on EBay and these ones look even better for advertising:
http://www.westkidland.co.uk/blackboards.htm
At the moment my board reads "Dogs entering may be shot". I've just ordered 4 professional signs reading " Please keep your dogs under close control", as 9 sheep arrived yesterday for our field.

Well done to Albert Herring!