I've Got a Crack!

[JohnB]

I was beginning to think there was little of interest to write about in my new house, but I found some nice mess that you might enjoy today .

I knocked off some of the cement render where it was cracked, and found this:
View attachment 2
View attachment 1

The crack runs down the wall from the eaves to the corner of the door opening. The concrete lintel seems to end a few inches in from the doorway, but there is more of the same material to the right and I can't make out what's happened, but the wall hasn't slipped. A neighbour who looked at it thought the wall had been extended to the left and not tied in properly.

It looks like the house was built with earth mortar. The render must have been applied around 40 years ago. It was unrendered in a 1967 photo.

More on the inside in my next post, as I can only attached 3 photos at a time.

 

[JohnB]

Here's part 2, when I investigated the loose plaster indoors:
View attachment 2
View attachment 1

This is a few feet in from the doorway in my last post. The wall is pretty damp, and the plaster came away easily. I don't know what the vertical cement is, but suppose it could well be another crack.

The wall is pretty thick, so I guess could have a rubble infill.

Anyone have any ideas about what's going on, and what I should do?

My long term plan is to externally insulate and lime render, and I would like to use earth plaster inside if my soil is suitable.

 

[Lime]

It looks much more like a join than a crack to me.

 

[JohnB]

This is the wall above the bit I've taken off:

Should I take the render off all the way up, or leave it for now?

 

[MdB]

The cement line is indeed rather strange. It looks too straight for a crack, especially in a wall of that type. I have plenty of cracks in my walls but nothing goes straight. I think my best guess would be that there was a wire or pipe or similar buried in the wall.

The lintel would be something I would want to fix though it wouldn't be a job I would want to do.

 

[Lime]

Looking at the cement render the small crack shows that there has been some movement in the join.
I think it must be a join of some sort or piecemeal repairs of the past.
The bricks on either side do not relate with each other.
As has been said cracks normally do not run straight but if they do they usually go straight through stone or brick.
The obvious question to ask is does the place where the crack can be seen run inside the house and coincide with any altered interior structure?
It does not look that serious at the moment but how long it has been in existence and how much more it will move may change that opinion.

 

[kevmiles1]

It is difficult to tell but it looks as though its is where something has been added on and not tied in properly as it is very straight and the stonework doesnt align as it would do if it was a crack in an original wall. Is there an extension or a later section been added on. Does the crack on the inside coincide exactly with the outside? Would suggest hacking all the way up and down on both sides to see the extent of it and if you are still unsure, get a specialist to take a look.

 

[Penners]

Yes, it looks as though the masonry above the lintel has been added at some point, without being tied in. The lintel itself is sitting on precious little. So all in all you have a classic candidate for movement and cracking.

As Lime and MdB have suggested, the vertical cement line doesn't appear to be logical for a filled-in crack. Maybe either a join or a bit of conduit let into the wall? Is there an electrical socket at the bottom of it, by any chance?

Having said that, the masonry on each side of the cement line appears to be very similar, so maybe it might just have been chased out in error, and then filled in again.

 

[JohnB]

It is difficult to tell but it looks as though its is where something has been added on and not tied in properly as it is very straight and the stonework doesnt align as it would do if it was a crack in an original wall. Is there an extension or a later section been added on. Does the crack on the inside coincide exactly with the outside? Would suggest hacking all the way up and down on both sides to see the extent of it and if you are still unsure, get a specialist to take a look.

I wasn't aware of there being an extension. The house seems to have been two originally, with a solid stone wall dividing them. The join, if that's what it is, is 11ft from the dividing wall, and the internal measurement of the "extension" is 7ft. That seems quite small for a house, by the time you allow for a 2ft or more end wall. The other part of the house is 24ft long internally. Why built a solid dividing wall for a room no more than 9ft wide x 15ft deep?

The internal bit is 2ft in from the "join" towards the other house, so could have been where the original end wall was.

I'm going to take off the plaster towards the doorway this afternoon, on the ground floor. I'm hoping to borrow a scaffold tower so I can do the first floor outside soon, and inside upstairs is part of the stair well, so will need a bit of planning.

I do want to get someone who knows what they're doing to look at it, as there's no way I'd do that lintel myself!

 

[JohnB]

As Lime and MdB have suggested, the vertical cement line doesn't appear to be logical for a filled-in crack. Maybe either a join or a bit of conduit let into the wall? Is there an electrical socket at the bottom of it, by any chance?

Having said that, the masonry on each side of the cement line appears to be very similar, so maybe it might just have been chased out in error, and then filled in again.

I'll take a bit of it out, and have a look. If it was originally an end wall, I suppose the internal stonework would have been redone when it was removed.

 

[MdB]

For my guess I think I'm going to stick with line of cement being where the wall was chased out for a wire or pipe or similar. If your stone is shaped anything like mine then the bits on either side could easily match up. I wish my wall was as well constructed though...

Please let us know who was right ;-)

 

[Penners]

Please let us know who was right ;-)

I am.





Because I've hedged my bets and agreed with everybody. :wink:

 

[JohnB]

Please let us know who was right ;-)

Don't panic, the wiring at this end of the house isn't connected! I've no idea where it goes yet. There are no sockets anywhere near it :?. Is this entirely legal? The previous owner is a plumber, who I would have thought would have a vague idea of the regulations, and he had the wall plastered!

I've been doing more render and plaster removal, so more later!

 

[MdB]

I win! Now where is my prize? :wink:

As far as the current regs are concerned, I believe it is perfectly legal as long as there is a fitting in line with the cables AND all the wires are connected to a RCD. I would welcome corrections on this if I'm wrong. I've no idea what the regs would have been when those wires were installed though.

 

[Penners]

As far as the current regs are concerned

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Penners]

I don't know whether this is required under the regs, but I think any electrician worth his salt would apply a cover cap to the cables, prior to plastering. Like this:

 

[JohnB]

I win! Now where is my prize? :wink:

1st prize is a week at my place removing render or plaster. 2nd prize is 2 weeks

Anyone want to run earth plastering or breathable external insulation installation courses at my place?

 

[MdB]

I don't know whether this is required under the regs, but I think any electrician worth his salt would apply a cover cap to the cables, prior to plastering. Like this:

Yep, I agree totally but my understanding is it isn't in the regs. To be honest, I'm not sure what the conduit actually does apart from keeping the cable in place whilst it is being plastered. It certainly doesn't give the cable much protection. I guess it gives a cavity for a drill to go into when it breaks through and that may be enough to warn the person drilling that they ought to stop.

 

[Flyfisher]

Er, no. Not in my experience.

The flash and a hell of a big bang certainly got my attention though. :shock:

 

[Jill]

[To be honest, I'm not sure what the conduit actually does apart from keeping the cable in place whilst it is being plastered. It certainly doesn't give the cable much protection.

The ones our electrician has just fitted are metal and look just like the one in Penners photo. I expect they would be easily detected using one of those beepy pipe/cabling detectors. Maybe Flyfisher should invest in one. Paul got ours after he had drilled through a water pipe for the second time - The words "I've done it again" bring back rather wet memories!