insurance company recomendations for a thatched cottage?

[Jon Maine]

ok guys , its crunch time. la playa wont touch us because we are not paying a contractor over 50k to do the work, nfu wont do it either.
self build zone will cover us and we are waiting for a quote from renovations zone. i will give ecclesiastical a try also.
can anyone recommend anyone else?
la playa said that our rebuild cost would be around 250 quid per square meter replacing like for like , does that sound about right for a timber framed house?

Googling "self build insurance" will give you more options to get quotes from I think.

£250 per metre, not a chance, you would be severely under insured. This is what I borrowed from another earlier post which falls in line with my assumption of £1000 to £1500 per metre square "having reviewed various architect and home build sites, the cost of a build is quoted as generally between 60-120 pounds / sq.ft"

 

[Moo]

£1000 to £1500 per metre square

Am I correct in assuming that that means we should measure our house's footprint and then multiply by the number of floors?

 

[garnett]

NFU is one of the better insureres as it often sends out a surveyor before they offer cover but they sometimes find problems as you have found.

The seminar was sponsored by Payle Russell (Special Risks) ltd who are Thatch and Listed Building Specialist.

We used to be insured with Playle Russell who were fine to deal with although we never had a claim. They stopped offering insurance on thatched houses unless they're detached (we're on the end of a row of 3 cottages). We're now insured with NFU, who know we have a woodburner in one fireplace (with a liner which is insulatedwith rockwool sleeving) and one open fireplace.

The use of insulated rock wool sleaving and other systems provoked rather a lot of debate at the seminar. There appears to be a growing objection to their use. There was no doubt that they did the job but there have been issues with the linings breaking and the contents falling out without people knowing. Particularly an issue if you did not install the flue and don't know how it works.

They were putting forward two other alternatives as best practice. One was the system of ceramic flue pipes and the other was a twin walled pumice flue with stone beads (that looked rather like brown m and ms!) poured into the gap.

I think that it would be worth PPUK doing a proper article on this in consultation with the Master Thatcher’s.

The other option for those who can’t get insurance is to look at installing a Dorset model thatch roof. This has a fire resistant material over the rafters and the thatch is then applied. In the event of a fire the thatch is sacrificial and can be racked off by the fire brigade leaving the building below fully intact. If you are listed this may not be possible. It rather depends on how old your base coat is. If it is not particularly old, I as a conservation officer would take the view that it is worth doing in the long term interest of the historic building, particularly if you can't get insurance but others may take a different view. The insurance companies strongly approve of them.

I am about to reinstate one building following a fire and I will be using the Dorset model for this.

Garnett

 

[Flyfisher]

Regular readers will know that NFU Mutual insurance seems popular among people here, myself included, but no one has (I think) commented on their claims performance. I can now report that I'm very pleased with them following a minor saga with Mrs FF's engagement ring after the diamond fell out somewhere and was lost.

A call to the local NFU office to ask about the claims process revealed that our policy didn't actually cover us for jewellery! After a minor bout of indignation and explanation that they had specifically recommended their 'cover plus' (or whatever it's called) policy that specifically mentions jewellery, they agreed it was most odd and they would look into it. The next day they called back to explain that a recent policy revision had taken jewellery out of the basic cover and provided it as an optional extra, which our policy should have included, but didn't. However, they did remember my conversation about requiring jewellery cover when choosing the policy and agreed it was odd that it was omitted from the final policy. They asked us to write a formal complaint letter explaining the circumstances and they would look into it officially. At all times they were very sympathetic and apologetic. All this was a couple of weeks ago.

Yesterday we received a telephone call explaining that they were amending our policy to include jewellery cover and that this would be backdated so as to allow the claim for the diamond ring. They were also looking into revising their literature to avoid future confusion. Again, very apologetic. Today we received a letter confirming all this, apologising once again, and asking that we send in the claim for the ring.

Finally, we've just had a case of wine delivered from the local NFU office, again apologising for the confusion.

I'd say that's a pretty good example of customer service at its very best!

Lessons?
1. Read the final policy documents in as much detail as the proposal ones to be sure that you actually get what has been proposed.
2. NFU Mutual are nice people to deal with.

 

[Louis Henry]

I used to have buildings insurance with Abbey (attached to the mortgage) and contents insurance with Lark. The costs of both seemed to be going up about 50% each year, so eventually I didn't bother to insure contents at all. After I paid off the mortgage I looked around again and got a very good deal from Sainsbury's home insurance, including contents and unlimited rebuilding costs, for less than half what I had been paying just for buildings insurance. I've no idea whether they will be any good if I ever need to make a claim. It's just nice to be fully covered again, and nice to deal with a firm that doesn't run a mile at the word thatch.
Louis

 

[Jon Maine]

£1000 to £1500 per metre square

Am I correct in assuming that that means we should measure our house's footprint and then multiply by the number of floors?

Realistically yes.

It could be argued you could do it for less but you may have to in the worst case pay the insurance company builders.........

Here to do a top notch job it cost around £1600 a m2 which was probably a bit high in terms that it was minging but I was making no profit so there you go.

 

[Schoolmarm]

So just out of interest Jon, what is the rebuild value of your fab place?

 

[Flyfisher]

Am I correct in assuming that that means we should measure our house's footprint and then multiply by the number of floors?

For two floors, yes, that's what I was advised. For three or more floors I recall that there was a discount factor but can't remember the details as they didn't apply to us.

I agree with Jon that £250/m2 is way too low for a timber-framed house - probably any house actually - based on the estimates I was given.

I've used £1400/m2 for rebuild purposes.

 

[Ushy M]

The use of insulated rock wool sleaving and other systems provoked rather a lot of debate at the seminar. There appears to be a growing objection to their use. There was no doubt that they did the job but there have been issues with the linings breaking and the contents falling out without people knowing. Particularly an issue if you did not install the flue and don't know how it works.

They were putting forward two other alternatives as best practice. One was the system of ceramic flue pipes and the other was a twin walled pumice flue with stone beads (that looked rather like brown m and ms!) poured into the gap.

I think that it would be worth PPUK doing a proper article on this in consultation with the Master Thatcher’s.

This is interesting Garnett. I wonder how you are fixed with a listed building if you wanted to install the ceramic flue or the pumice flue systems? Presumably these involve some impact on the fabric of the building to install them? (I'm guessing you can't either drop them down the flue or post them up as you do with a flexible metal liner?) Also, is this approach possible if the flue isn't straight, as in many old buildings?

Would be very interested to see a proper PPUK article on this.

 

[robgil]

sorry guys , it was square foot not square meter. still a bit low i think but we got 350k rebuild cost for a smallish two up two down so i think/hope it should be about right.

 

[Jon Maine]

So just out of interest Jon, what is the rebuild value of your fab place?

Well we have it at £800k and the NFU insure us for around a pound per £1000 inc contents too.

 

[Jon Maine]

NFU is one of the better insureres as it often sends out a surveyor before they offer cover but they sometimes find problems as you have found.

The seminar was sponsored by Payle Russell (Special Risks) ltd who are Thatch and Listed Building Specialist.

We used to be insured with Playle Russell who were fine to deal with although we never had a claim. They stopped offering insurance on thatched houses unless they're detached (we're on the end of a row of 3 cottages). We're now insured with NFU, who know we have a woodburner in one fireplace (with a liner which is insulatedwith rockwool sleeving) and one open fireplace.

The use of insulated rock wool sleaving and other systems provoked rather a lot of debate at the seminar. There appears to be a growing objection to their use. There was no doubt that they did the job but there have been issues with the linings breaking and the contents falling out without people knowing. Particularly an issue if you did not install the flue and don't know how it works.

They were putting forward two other alternatives as best practice. One was the system of ceramic flue pipes and the other was a twin walled pumice flue with stone beads (that looked rather like brown m and ms!) poured into the gap.

I think that it would be worth PPUK doing a proper article on this in consultation with the Master Thatcher’s.

The other option for those who can’t get insurance is to look at installing a Dorset model thatch roof. This has a fire resistant material over the rafters and the thatch is then applied. In the event of a fire the thatch is sacrificial and can be racked off by the fire brigade leaving the building below fully intact. If you are listed this may not be possible. It rather depends on how old your base coat is. If it is not particularly old, I as a conservation officer would take the view that it is worth doing in the long term interest of the historic building, particularly if you can't get insurance but others may take a different view. The insurance companies strongly approve of them.

I am about to reinstate one building following a fire and I will be using the Dorset model for this.

Garnett

When re-thatched a 12.5mm fireboard I believe is the spec fitted over the rafters, possibly a double layer with the joints overlapped would be first class. Then counter battened and battened and thatched. So sensible, should also be set to a recognised standard so insurers take into account in their calcs. Kevin McCloud demonstrated this on TV and the fire-boarded sample was fine structurally yet the un fire-boarded collapsed the structure too.

 

[Flyfisher]

sorry guys , it was square foot not square meter. still a bit low i think but we got 350k rebuild cost for a smallish two up two down so i think/hope it should be about right.

£250/ft2 = £2778/m2, which sounds rather high, unless it already allowed for two floors in which case £1389/m2 seems like a reasonable figure.

As I understand things, measure the outside footprint of the house and multiply by the number of floors = m2