E10 Petrol and Old 4 Stroke Engines

[Cubist]

In our three cars... 1990, 1974, 1963, we only use E5.
Even so, I have changed all the fuel hose to Gates Barricade, which is ethanol-proof.

In our mower... 1984, I only use E5.

E10 is not fit for use in an old engine, and anyone using it is laying up trouble for themselves.

Even with E5, I put a stabiliser in the last tank of fuel when laying up the mower over winter.

Ivor

Cheers Ivor,
I've abandoned E10 now having learned my lesson and will not be using it again. According to DVLA its supposed to be compatible with Black Bess, my 20 year old Jag, but who would ever trust them?

I'll be sticking to premium in the future and including additives where needed for the various bits of kit around here.

All the best,
Steve

BTW I cracked my PTO problem. The voltage drop I was seeing was due to a bad ground wire used as part of the circuit to the Mower Deck Switch. Those crafty Italians, and some others it has to be said, routed the ground to the fourth pole of the starter solenoid to provide a secondary (hidden) ground. Ho Hum, another lesson learned.

 

[philpjuk100]

I have used E10 since it was available, my mower with a Briggs and Stratton motor started up after E10 had been left in over the winter, my car has had the fuel pipe replaced with modern pipe as the old pipe was cracking, the only problem with the car is that the ethanol seems to be cleaning the "muck" from the bottom of the tank so I have had to fit a large disposable filter in it and carry a spare in the toolbox. Did not BP used to sell petrol with "Ethyl" in it in the 60s/70s? (not sure what %) I have bought some stabiliser but have not used it yet

 

[malcolm]

Did not BP used to sell petrol with "Ethyl" in it in the 60s/70s?

That was the tetraethyl lead they put in leaded petrol. They didn't want to mention the lead because it had a bad reputation so concentrated on the ethyl part in the marketing.

I've not had a lot of trouble with the ethanol petrol in period engines but I'm sure petrol is going stale faster these days. For higher performance engines you need to make the mixture richer but for most things replacing the fuel hoses regularly seems to be the thing.

 

[worms]

the only problem with the car is that the ethanol seems to be cleaning the "muck" from the bottom of the tank...

...or perhaps is creating the muck? If there is sufficient to need an additional filter and carry a spare, then that is a lot of muck, even for an old tank.

 

[philpjuk100]

There is a hundred years worth of "muck" I should really take the tank off and clean it properly but it looks a pain to remove and filters are only 99p each if you buy a few from eBay. I have even fitted two filters with a changeover tap so I can switch filters when one blocks and change the blocked one when I get home. They are blocking less frequently and it must be over a month since I changed one.

 

[philpjuk100]

In 1928 Harry Ricardo, National Distillers Co. and Shell Oil introduce an alcohol fuel blend in the United Kingdom called "Cleveland Discol." The ethanol blend is a popular unleaded gasoline brand and is sold through 1968.

 

[Cubist]

Well thats annoying, when I were a lad I prided myself on being able to easily recognise most pre-war cars on British roads but, despite knowing I'm going to be kicking myself, I'm stumped!

Put me out of my misery Phil, what is it?

 

[philpjuk100]

Well thats annoying, when I were a lad I prided myself on being able to easily recognise most pre-war cars on British roads but, despite knowing I'm going to be kicking myself, I'm stumped!

Put me out of my misery Phil, what is it?

Bullnose Morris Oxford 1925. had to buy it when my lads who traveled everywhere in my 1933 Minor (owned since 1969) would not allow our grandkids to ride in it!

 

[Cubist]

If you see some marbles rolling around somewhere, they're mine!

 

[worms]

There is a hundred years worth of "muck"

Lol! That is potentially a lot of muck! Nice car!

Even so, I'd be wary of just how quickly the alcohol/water/petrol gel can buid up and clog filters. It may be that the gel causes little harm if it can get all the way through to combustion in the engine but in my 2.5L petrol Land Rover it was definitely clogging the pre-filter in the tank. Have to say, though, that I never had any problem with the V8 in either Land Rover or Range Rover on the same fuel and no problems in the 2.5L once I removed the pre-filter.

 

[philpjuk100]

Lol! That is potentially a lot of muck! Nice car!

Even so, I'd be wary of just how quickly the alcohol/water/petrol gel can buid up and clog filters. It may be that the gel causes little harm if it can get all the way through to combustion in the engine but in my 2.5L petrol Land Rover it was definitely clogging the pre-filter in the tank. Have to say, though, that I never had any problem with the V8 in either Land Rover or Range Rover on the same fuel and no problems in the 2.5L once I removed the pre-filter.

No filters as standard and no pump, (scuttle tank, gravity feed) it has two taps on the tank, one used to feed the carb and the other fed the fuel gauge or sight glass) I have soldered a small brass tube on the main tap that now feeds the carb via a filter and the gauge from about 2" above the bottom of the tank and the other tap at the bottom of the tank has become a "reserve" feeding the carb via another filter. I think when petrol was bought from the chemist in two gallon tins it may not have been as clean as it is now. When I am running low I now use the running board can and then fill that again when I fill the tank so the fuel in the can does not become stale. The "muck" seems to be hairs or like paint brush bristles, not sure if they were introduced with the fuel or have grown in the tank, there are no gaskets in the tank. Before I fitted the filters I had to clean them out of the float chamber. The carb is bronze.

 

[worms]

Interesting stuff! I presume that the carbs back then were also much more tolerant of variations in fuel quality...and I guess quantity, as surely with a gravity feed, the fuel pressure must drop as the level in the tank goes down?

 

[philpjuk100]

I would think that must be correct but the fuel level is controlled by the float and should be constant. Is the SG of E10 the same as "old" petrol? if not the float will be at a different level and the carb will be rich/lean.

 

[malcolm]

The float tends to operate a valve that shuts off the flow of fuel once the float chamber is full. If fuel is getting in then you are good.

The bullnose is old enough to run on just about anything. It looks fab!

 

[philpjuk100]

The float tends to operate a valve that shuts off the flow of fuel once the float chamber is full. If fuel is getting in then you are good.

The bullnose is old enough to run on just about anything. It looks fab!

Any good quality petrol as sold today will give satisfactory running on a Morris car. A mixture of equal parts of Benzole and petrol will give better mileage and also allow the engine to run for long periods before decarbonization is essential. Morris cars are tuned up at the works and the carburetter set to give maximum results from number 1 shell petrol. (from the handbook) After running prewar Morris cars for over fifty years I have never had to "decoke" them, not sure if it is the petrol or oil but something has changed, when I have had to open them up (usually to change a valve) there has been very little carbon inside.