DPC DRY RODS ANY ONE USED THEM?

[Zebra]

Ahh on the outside it is, we removed the cement border recently. Lime is still going to be on the inside, when we get the work completed.

Well, hadn't you better get that off before making any decisions about the dpc? The moisture could be getting through higher up, unable to get out again and making its way through to the inside?

 

[pipthecats]

If you’re going to DIY them and install them into the mortar rather than the brick then it’s probably going to cost you less than £150 and won’t really do much damage if it doesn’t work.

I am also 100% in the sceptical camp on these things but might be tempted to take that approach with suitably low expectations of it working and maybe be pleasantly surprised

Well, hadn't you better get that off before making any decisions about the dpc? The moisture could be getting through higher up, unable to get out again and making its way through to the inside?

Yes maybe, I’ll have to inspect it more. The bricks under it are so badly damaged though.But you make a good point.

 

[CliffordPope]

I can't see how an injected DPC could ever work. How do you know how far it has penetrated? It seems to me very unlikely that it could possibly form a continuous layer, like a physical barrier like slate or plastic. Surely the chemical will just follow the course of least resistance? I can't see it pushing water out ahead of it - it's just going to spread out down the easy paths inside the wall.

A series of porous tubes inserted in the wall might at least give an avenue for the damp to evaporate?

 

[stuart45]

Also some interesting reading here:

"Rising damp myth"â statement - the true story

Following the recent publication of the âJoint Position Statement - Investigation of moisture and its effects on traditional buildingsâ, I have noted my name sometimes quoted in the context of the âsurveyor who does not believe in rising dampâ. For many years this has followed me, and whilst it is o

www.linkedin.com

The Fraud of Rising Damp

Rising Damp does not exist. This page helps you understand the real reasons for damp problems you experience, fraud of damp proofing company and recommendations for damp proofing.

www.heritage-house.org

Interesting sites for different reasons. Stephen Boniface is saying that he was misquoted, and doesn't really know whether it exists or not.
Peter Ward's website is interesting for some the the things he comes out with.
For example
did you know that in Holland, they don't even have damp courses? True... Even in new houses, damp proof courses are not required. They build their houses with their feet in the water, and they don't get damp walls. I teach Dutch architectural students at college, and they fall about laughing when we talk about what they call our 'Quaint English Custom' of damp courses and injection damp proofing. Sounds funny, but this is serious stuff - we are being defrauded to the tune of hundreds of millions a year, by chemical companies selling useless, fraudulent treatment
This is total fiction. Having worked in Holland years ago I know they use a DPC.
If you google Opstijgend vocth, you will find loads of sites offering chemical injection and details of DPC methods in new builds.

Opstijgend vocht zelf behandelen: zo doe je dat

Heb je last van vocht in de muren, en vermoed je dat dit door opstijgend vocht komt? Ontdek onze tips om dit zelf te behandelen.

aquaconsult.be

Opstijgend of optrekkend vocht in je muur? Behandeling & kosten - Aqua Protect

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opstijgend vocht - Bing

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www.bing.com

 

[pipthecats]

Interesting sites for different reasons. Stephen Boniface is saying that he was misquoted, and doesn't really know whether it exists or not.
Peter Ward's website is interesting for some the the things he comes out with.
For example
did you know that in Holland, they don't even have damp courses? True... Even in new houses, damp proof courses are not required. They build their houses with their feet in the water, and they don't get damp walls. I teach Dutch architectural students at college, and they fall about laughing when we talk about what they call our 'Quaint English Custom' of damp courses and injection damp proofing. Sounds funny, but this is serious stuff - we are being defrauded to the tune of hundreds of millions a year, by chemical companies selling useless, fraudulent treatment
This is total fiction. Having worked in Holland years ago I know they use a DPC.
If you google Opstijgend vocth, you will find loads of sites offering chemical injection and details of DPC methods in new builds.

Opstijgend vocht zelf behandelen: zo doe je dat

Heb je last van vocht in de muren, en vermoed je dat dit door opstijgend vocht komt? Ontdek onze tips om dit zelf te behandelen.

aquaconsult.be

Opstijgend of optrekkend vocht in je muur? Behandeling & kosten - Aqua Protect

Last van opstijgend vocht in je woning? Ontdek hier de juiste oplossing ✔️ Levenslange garantie! Gratis diagnose

www.aquaprotect.be

opstijgend vocht - Bing

Intelligent search from Bing makes it easier to quickly find what you’re looking for and rewards you.

www.bing.com

Love this "This is total fiction. Having worked in Holland years ago I know they use a DPC"
I don't understand why Peter Ward loves to spread crap around.

 

[Flyfisher]

Interesting sites for different reasons.

That was sort of my point. It's surprising to me why there is, apparently, no scientific consensus about the subject, which allows the debate to rumble on and on.

Still, there also appears to be a sizeable number of people who believe the moon landings were faked and that the Earth is flat, despite all the evidence to the contrary. Welcome to age of fake news, where even its leading exponent felon seems likely to be voted into the most powerful office on the planet later this year. I'm beginning to think that climate change is not the biggest threat to humanity's continued existence.

 

[CliffordPope]

It is occasionally possible for two contradictory statements both to be true - it depends on the exact circumstances. If the building material is naturally impervious to water, or a modern material is the same, then obviously no DPC would be needed.
If on the other hand the only available material were extremely porous then it would be madness not to use a DPC.

 

[stuart45]

Love this "This is total fiction. Having worked in Holland years ago I know they use a DPC"
I don't understand why Peter Ward loves to spread crap around.

It could be he genuinely believes that the Dutch don't use a DPC. He probably got the idea from Jeff Howell's book about rising damp. In the book, Jeff Howell went away for a weekend in Holland, and asked someone on site why the DPC was missing. He was told it wasn't needed, and since then this rumour has spread around the internet.
He probably added the bit about teaching Dutch architectural students to make it more convincing. If he really new the construction trade in Holland, he'd realise they rising damp is a big issue there, and the government have given a lot of money to the Faculty of the built environment for research into it.

European attack on rising damp in buildings

www.tudelft.nl

 

[stuart45]

That was sort of my point. It's surprising to me why there is, apparently, no scientific consensus about the subject, which allows the debate to rumble on and on.

Still, there also appears to be a sizeable number of people who believe the moon landings were faked and that the Earth is flat, despite all the evidence to the contrary. Welcome to age of fake news, where even its leading exponent felon seems likely to be voted into the most powerful office on the planet later this year. I'm beginning to think that climate change is not the biggest threat to humanity's continued existence.

There have been a few done, although people usually disagree with the results if they don't like the answers.
This was quite a long study.

Rising damp evaluation and treatment : a quasi-experimental case study

The UK has a well-established industry involved in the treatment of rising damp. Yet, critics argue that rising damp is extremely rare and remedial damp pr...

salford-repository.worktribe.com

 

[Lacan07]

My take on all this is that the technology behind liquid DPC's (in its varying formats) is most likely sound, whether it works so well in an old wall where the joints are all higgledy piggledy is up for debate. The damp industry that push it however as part of their 'remedy' are not sound. The spectacle of them walking around your house with their damp meters and condemning every wall is beyond ridiculous. The fact is a slate DPC shouldn't fail so readily, in one or two places perhaps, but not across the entire ground floor of a house simultaneously. The practice of Tanking (picking a fight with water) is foolhardy at best and should be avoided, along with the middle class fetish for externally painting brick houses. Most damp issues can be explained away by high external ground, crappy retro-fitted concrete floors, or poor drainage. Although never reproduced in a test lab I suspect rising damp probably does exist, but its most likely quite rare and takes decades to appear.

 

[alexander]

to put lime plaster on the inside while there is a cement render on the outside is a complete waste of time & money & will achieve nothing, lime mortar works but allowing excess moisture in the building to exit via the mortar lines it allows moisture in the brickwork to seep into the mortar and exit via the mortar lines if covered or saturated the water remains in the bricks themselves allowing the water to freeze in winter & splay the bricks, I have removed cement render were the brick behind are soaking & the mortar is so wet its like water, rising damp is created usually by cement which is the most porous of material but requires moisture to go of usually depositing any excess moisture harmlessly into the cavity with a damp proof membrane under a concrete floor it would pull up moisture continually for the length of its life span approx. 30+yrs dampness the at the rate of 1inch per month but drying time will be extended by the the weather externally
& condensation internally ,
the pca is an organisation created by the damp proof companies to try and add some credibility to the claim of rising damp so is not really an independent source of information on rising damp as they have a vested interest, according to which rising damp is miss diagnosed in at least 75% of cases ,
if you think of slate and were it comes from its formed thousands of feet below ground in the most wet and dirty conditions so being between your brick work in relatively dry condition is not going to make it fail,
the biggest issue with most injection systems are they are drilling holes in the bricks through the outer core making them more prone to moisture penetrating & frost damage
then covering the inside with a cement render, water proofing slurry or plastic sheeting they are not finding the source of any moisture ingress but covering it up, the moisture ingress is still there but now instead of escaping its trapped creating damage to the structure of your building depending on how bad the water ingress is will depend on how long it goes before the structure collapses, to many people cause untold damage to older building by not under standing how all the materials used in there construction worked together to keep them water tight & dry
no I would not use dry rod or any modern damp proof solution, while you may gain a short term solution long term it will cost you dearly

 

[pipthecats]

Your comment is hard to follow.

Currently the cement border has been removed. Ground level lowered.

They get put into the mortar not the bricks. You know bricks are wet when are in the ground…

Slate is prone to cracking.

I’d love to know of cases where a building has collapsed other than your fictional theory.

 

[pipthecats]

Wait so you've already got a slate DPC? What makes you think an additional "Chemical DPC" is going to solve the problem then? Do you have evidence that the slate course has failed in some way? (sry if I missed that point in some post above).

I think it’s not going to do any harm if I do it, so why not eh.

 

[pipthecats]

It could be he genuinely believes that the Dutch don't use a DPC. He probably got the idea from Jeff Howell's book about rising damp. In the book, Jeff Howell went away for a weekend in Holland, and asked someone on site why the DPC was missing. He was told it wasn't needed, and since then this rumour has spread around the internet.
He probably added the bit about teaching Dutch architectural students to make it more convincing. If he really new the construction trade in Holland, he'd realise they rising damp is a big issue there, and the government have given a lot of money to the Faculty of the built environment for research into it.

European attack on rising damp in buildings

www.tudelft.nl

Ahhhh omg amazing. That sounds about right!
He gives off cult vibes but for old houses. Dangerous.

 

[alexander]

Your comment is hard to follow.

Currently the cement border has been removed. Ground level lowered.

They get put into the mortar not the bricks. You know bricks are wet when are in the ground…

Slate is prone to cracking.

I’d love to know of cases where a building has collapsed other than your fictional theory.

you have lead a very sheltered life if you have never seen a wall collapse due to the brickwork being compromised,
it was also recommended by the pca many years ago that injected damp proof courses were to go into the brickwork for maximum effect . apart from the obvious that your trying to water proof a breathable product,
cement by its very nature sticks bricks together allowing for a cavity it pulls in moisture to make it go off depositing any excess into the cavity preventing penetrating damp, or in the case of solid brick buildings behind the cement creating penetrating dampness,
over the years their is not one single solid brick building were on removal of cement render the brickworks was not found to be soaking wet,
I have never found any old building with cement render to be dry behind the render
lime mortar is a softer building material holds onto moisture in the mortar its self keeping it away from the brickwork and allowing it to exit via the mortar lines
the slate used in the olden days was welsh slate which against is a softer building material not prone to cracking and a life expectancy of 100 of years
but you go ahead an cause yourself more damage, like they say you can lead a horse to water but you cant make it drink, have a nice life

 

[pipthecats]

I do a live a sheltered life, maybe not for long according to you

I personally removed the pebbledash on the back of my house and further away from the ground the bricks were bone dry.

My house is over a 100 years now so maybe the slate is starting to see its life come to an end.

Back to the DPC:

I don’t see how keeping the water coming up causes damage. As the suspended wooden floor can allow the water to dry out. Same way the slate would have worked.

I guess we will find out.