Cost of visiting period properties

[biffvernon]

A little film: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBYAUl4O5v4

 

[Flyfisher]

And the conclusion is what exactly? That tent fabric does not heat up in a few seconds that a person is inside it?

Why did the protestors not film the tents in the early hours of the morning when people might have been expected to have been inside the tents for a while?

Hardly a valid comparison is it? Which makes it meaningless at best or misleading at worst.

 

[MatthewC]

I read that St Pauls costs £20k per day to run (how?!) and that visitors' fees bring in £16k per day.

I expect that the £20k/day figure is their total annual expenditure divided by 365, so it includes everything like salaries, electricity and heating as well as repairs and maintenance. However, as owners of old properties, we all know how expensive they are to run and repair, and the C of E does not get any income from the government for maintaining such a large and expensive national treasure. People say how much real estate is owned by the church but fail to realise that, as historic churches are rarely sold, they should actually be on the balance sheet with a negative value because of the associated costs. Personally, I would be delighted if the C of E was allowed to pass on all the old, expensive and unsuitable listed buildings to someone else to look after, but it'll never happen! (And yes, I know that the Churches Historic Trust have a a couple of hundred, but that's only when they have become redundant.)

I thought it was usually possible to go to St Pauls for a service on Sunday?

Yes it is, and it's free. You should NOT be asked to pay to attend a service in any cathedral or church where any sort of entrance fee is asked for. In my experience they normally separate tourists and worshippers at the door. Many such as Southwark Cathedral are free entrance.

 

[robgil]

I thought the royals owned St Pauls, when it burned down didn't old queeny dear want tax payers to foot the bill?

 

[FamilyWiggs]

I thought the royals owned St Pauls, when it burned down didn't old queeny dear want tax payers to foot the bill?

Do you mean Windsor Castle Rob?

 

[biffvernon]

St Paul's also burnt down, but that was in 1666 in the Great Fire of London.

This is probably something close to what it looked like before Christopher Wren designed the new-fangled domey thing:

Big, wasn't it?

(how do you make a picture smaller?)

 

[robgil]

I thought the royals owned St Pauls, when it burned down didn't old queeny dear want tax payers to foot the bill?

Do you mean Windsor Castle Rob?

Ah perhaps that was it, so who actually owns it then? I know a few banks etc have a lot to do with it.

 

[biffvernon]

The Church of England owns St. Paul's cathedral.

 

[Nigel Watts]

Bankers have always been scapegoats. In the past they were mostly Jews, which made them doubly hateful.

The behaviour of some bankers may have been very irresponsible but our underlying economic crisis was not caused by them; it is our addiction to cheap credit to pay for cheap imported consumer goods and our governments' addiction to cheap credit to pay for public services. We have been living beyond our means and now need to readjust, which will be very painful. The cheapness of the credit is not down to the bankers but China and the sovereign wealth funds of the large oil exporting nations. We are buying comsumer goods and oil from them and they are using the proceeds to feed our credit addiction habit by flooding the financial markets with cheap money.

 

[biffvernon]

I'd go back a step further. It's not the bankers nor the cheap credit etc., it's the conflation of two facts:

1. Economic activity is closely bound to energy use
2. Energy production is not growing

Our financial system, particularly the fractional reserve banking, only succeeds whilst the economy grows. The economy cannot grow whilst energy production does no grow. The conventional oil production peaked in 2005, the shortfall has been approximately made up by much more expensive 'unconventionals', the Arctic, deepwater, tar-sands, oil-shales, bio-fuels and tight gas, but geology ensures that these can only be extracted slowly and at a cost right at the margin of that which the economy can bear. We are quick to make scapegoats out of the weakest links that fail first - Lehman Brothers, Greece - as contemplating the reality of no more growth is just too difficult.

 

[Nigel Watts]

At a global level you may be right but it doesnt explain relative growth rates in different parts of the world. The West's recent growth has been fueled artificially by cheap credit whereas that of China and India has been more real. In other words the shift of economic power from West to East has been masked and delayed and the hangover will be all the worse for it.

 

[philpjuk100]

Just a recomendation for what I consider a "value" admission charge,we visited creswell craggs last week,two "old gits" guided tour around robin hoods cave for£11,the ice cave with cave art is closed until easter.There is no charge to walk around the limestone gorge.Also great cake in the restarant! (are inhabited caves "period property"?) phil.

 

[Penners]

Talking of anti-capitalism protests . . .

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Penners]

Big, wasn't it?

(how do you make a picture smaller?)

It was big, but I strongly suspect that the edifice in your picture isn't.

The easy way to shrink a pic is to use the brilliantly-named Shrink Pic. It's free and very useful.

http://www.onthegosoft.com/shrink_pic.htm

 

[philpjuk100]

Bankers have always been scapegoats. In the past they were mostly Jews, which made them doubly hateful..

Yes william shakespeare did not help with Shylock,or maybe it was not him after all!

 

[biffvernon]

so who actually owns it then? I know a few banks etc have a lot to do with it.

The Church of England is the short answer.

There is a longer, and much more interesting answer here: http://www.morningstaronline.co.uk/news/content/view/full/111318

 

[Moo]

A little film: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBYAUl4O5v4

Oh, I do like Ian Hislop!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbZdFtT2VvM&feature=related

 

[Flyfisher]

The Church of England owns St. Paul's cathedral.

Indeed. And a very asset-rich institution it is too, though not a patch on the catholic church of course. But they're not in it for the money, so that's alright then. :wink:

 

[Flyfisher]

Our financial system, particularly the fractional reserve banking, only succeeds whilst the economy grows. The economy cannot grow whilst energy production does no grow. The conventional oil production peaked in 2005, the shortfall has been approximately made up by much more expensive 'unconventionals', the Arctic, deepwater, tar-sands, oil-shales, bio-fuels and tight gas, but geology ensures that these can only be extracted slowly and at a cost right at the margin of that which the economy can bear. We are quick to make scapegoats out of the weakest links that fail first - Lehman Brothers, Greece - as contemplating the reality of no more growth is just too difficult.

No more oil-based growth perhaps, but what about coal? China seems to be doing quite well on it. When is peak-coal expected anyway? I'd say we have another century or so to develop practical alternatives to fossil fuels - after all, look at the progress we've made in the last century.

And yes, I know coal is the fuel of the climate-change devil, but we'd better get used todealing with it because as long as it's there we're going to burn it until there is a practical alternative.

 

[biffvernon]

Oh, I do like Ian Hislop!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbZdFtT2VvM&feature=related

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