Condensation in bathroom!

[jocelyn plummer]

We are finding that condensation is quite a problem. Not surprisingly really with a plastic wood effect floor, plastic window, plastic tongue and groove half way up the walls.

What is interesting is that the oil from the bathroom vinyl paint that was used previously, is running down the walls as well as the moisture droplets.

Anyway, I am obviously going to investigate behind and remove the plastic tongue and groove, in order to repaint with a breathable paint.

How do I get the vinyl paint off the walls ? There seems to be only one coat, with plaster behind-- discovered when I put a cupboard up.

Then I will replace with wooden tongue and groove, but should I wait until I can afford to replace the placcy window and flooring as well, or will my part measures and time and effort make a significant difference.

The window budget is really best left until next year when I hope to do all the others as well.

 

[fjpdesigns]

You could try this outfit. They know their stuff and have a product for most, if not all, situations.


http://www.stripperspaintremovers.com/legal.htm

 

[Cloudscape]

How do I get the vinyl paint off the walls ?

Wallpaper steamer and some scraping (if the wall is flat enough)? It's washable paint, but if it was painted straight onto plaster, it will probably give up the ghost quite easily. I'd avoid anything 'chemical' that could soak into the plaster.

 

[MdB]

Wallpaper steamer and some scraping

I agree that could work but watch out for your steamer removing the plaster from the walls as well.

What sort of ventilation do you have in the bathroom? I would look into increasing that first before doing much else. A breathable wall will help a bit. Good ventilation will help a lot.

 

[Cloudscape]

I agree that could work but watch out for your steamer removing the plaster from the walls as well.

Ah... yes. Good point. I did pop some of the top skimmed layer once (gypsum), when I got carried away with the steamer.

 

[Lime]

If the problem is condensation then any cold surface will cause problems even with "breathable" paint.
The need is to rid the room of moisture which means good ventilation like an open window particularly when the condensation is being created or at least immediately after till the walls are dry.

Also I think there is some confusion.
Paint that allows the walls to breath will do very little to stop condensation.
Damp IN the wall is usually from a different source than the damp ON the wall.

 

[Flyfisher]

I've always assumed that condensation is inevitable in a bathroom - it has been in all the houses I've known.

Unless the ambient bathroom temperature is extremely high (impractically and unbearably so) then the steam from a shower or bath will inevitably condense on some areas of the room. Surely ventilation is the only real answer?

My solution has always been to open a window while in the shower to let the steam escape but I presume an extractor fan would do the same job.

 

[Pford75]

This is one of the reasons that Building regs now require extractor fans in bathrooms.

I recall there was some debate on here recently about them, but in my experience, they do a lot of good and the vents can be sufficiently hidden. (i recommend going through the ceiling and then veting out through the soffit (rather than through the exterior wall)

Most people fit the cheapest fan they can find, but very often (esp. if your bathroom has high ceilings...you may find that the basic models do not extract enough air for the size of the room). Fitting a decent extractor fan made a major difference in one of our bathrooms

 

[biffvernon]

Building regs now require extractor fans in bathrooms.

Where does it say that?

 

[Flyfisher]

Fans or no fans, the steam from bathrooms or kitchens has to go somewhere and without adequate ventilation it'll stay indoors and will condense somewhere.

 

[MdB]

For those that don't know, the building regs state that "there shall be adequate ventilation provided for the people in the building". That is it, there is no more.

Building control, who decide what the regs mean, state that an extractor fan in the bathroom (of the right sort) or similar extraction arrangement is enough to meet this requirement as specified in approved doc F. If you decide that you don't want an extractor fan in the bathroom, you will have to prove that your method of ventilation is "adequate" to building control, if you want the work signed off by building control. Getting building control to sign off something other that what is in the approved doc F will be a very big up hill struggle which in practise generally means that a fan in the bathroom is a requirement. Biff is technically correct though in stating that it isn't in the regs.

 

[Essex]

In The Part F Approved document, under System 2. Passive stack ventilation, there is a note that states that an open flued appliance may provide enough ventilation.
This has interesting possibilities

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Thank you Folks, advice very useful !

In their wisdom, our predecessors put in a plastic casement window, with the opening side just by the huge re claimed period style cast iron radiator, and a couple of feet from the side of the roll top bath, so leaving the window open, which I have always done in previous properties, is an obvious waste of heat, and provides a good view for the neighbours!!!! ( see my posting of Dec. mustard yellow bathroom)

Living with placcy is a nightmare, dreadful stuff.

Thanks also for the chandelier light bulb debate, I was going to ask the same question. Will check out screwfix.

 

[Pford75]

Why the resistence to extractor fans??

As I see it, they can be very effective in removing moist air from a bathroom, without the attendant security risks and heating challenges of open windows. You can even get them on humidistatic switches. They can be installed reasonably unobtrusively (well, no more obtrusive than the shower, lightswitch etc. which are not exactly period features).

I'm all against doing stuff just because b.regs says so...but in this case it seems somewhat perverse and non-sensical to fight it. Or am I missing something?

 

[MdB]

Personally, I don't like extractor fans due to the noise they make, the cold air they invariably draw into the bathroom and their appearance which isn't great. However, I will be fitting one as a mouldy damp bathroom is even worse.

Some fans available now are supposed to be low noise and the appearance of some are a lot better than others so some of the bad points can be mitigated a bit.

 

[Moo]

We have two shower rooms and a downstairs loo, none of which have any windows at all, so all three had extractor fans fitted when we 'did' the house over a decade ago.
The fans are very efficient (re odours and/or condensation) and I can't say that we've ever been bothered by the noise.
Nor have any of us been aware of cold air being drawn in. But perhaps we've just been lucky.

 

[Lime]

Why the resistence to extractor fans??

Noise.

Opening the large sash windows in our bathrooms ventilates the rooms in less than a minute.

I like the sound of the wind blowing in.

 

[Moo]

I like the sound of the wind blowing in.

In these temperatures ????

 

[Lime]

I like the sound of the wind blowing in.

In these temperatures ????

Yes, I have no problem with that.
With the door shut it takes a minute to thoroughly ventilate both the rooms.
No condensation, no damp air but immediately the window is shut the still-warm walls and other fabric within the bathrooms warms the air up in minutes.

 

[MdB]

Nor have any of us been aware of cold air being drawn in. But perhaps we've just been lucky.

More likely, the airflow arrangement had been thought about.

What a lot of people miss when installing extractor fans is that the air that is being thrown out of the room has to come from somewhere. If the room is sealed (tight fitting door, etc) then extractor will do very little as the air can't come from anywhere. If the room is poorly sealed, (gaps in floorboards, gaps around the door etc) then the air will come from there. If this incoming air is cold, the extractor fan will cause a cold draft across the room. However, if you are clever and allow an air route to a warm part of the house, there will be no cold draft.

In the house I grew up in, the extractor fan pulled in air under the bathroom door. The other side of door was the main hall way / staircase which was always cold. As a kid I never switched the extractor fan on (no matter how much I got yelled at) as the cold draft was unbearable.

Recently in Poland, I noticed that most of their bathroom doors had holes drilled through them to allow the extractor fan to work properly (at least I assume that this is what they were for).