Bl**dy insulation grants

[Nemesis]

I was cold called yesterday by a 'Lisa' trying to get me to take up the government insulation grants for roof insulation and cavity wall insulation. That's despite the fact I am registered with the Telephone Preference Service and calls such as this should not be made. Neither have I cavity walls.

I am apparently entitled to have my roof insulated 'free' as the current insulation is less than six inches.

I asked if I was entitled to have sheepswool or other 'green' insulation, but no, it's only Rockwool, at no doubt vast expense to the taxpayer.

http://www.homecarbonsaver.com/Schemes/Index.aspx

Today I was cold called by someone from 'Home Carbon Savers'. She asked if I was me (yes) and then proceeded to call me by my first name, telling me about the grants.

I pointed out that I did not want Rockwool in my loft, if I did I could go and buy it, and install it without any expense to the taxpayer. I expressed my 'dismay' at this scheme, which as far as I can see will be costing taxpayers millions of pounds and making the companies fitting the stuff a fortune.

This is apparently the government's answer to the recession, paying people to fit insulation to buildings, but there is no choice as to what we get. Personally I'd rather have a small cash grant and be able to choose what I want and have it fitted by someone who understands period buildings.

So - no doubt we will all be receiving such calls. It's going to be a bonanza for some.

 

[Penners]

She asked if I was me (yes) and then proceeded to call me by my first name

:evil: :evil: :evil:

My hatred of that is exceeded only by my loathing of being called "mate".

 

[Nemesis]

Even worse she didn't pronounce it properly...

 

[Craig]

Even worse she didn't pronounce it properly...

E as in Bed or E as in Bead? Or something worse...

 

[Nemesis]

She called me E as in bed, which isn't actually the full monty, but anyhow no-one calls me that apart from my mum.

And what's wrong with being a spot formal? Why all this pals together from some person at a call centre to whom I HAVE NOT BEEN INTRODUCED????

But I do despair at this grants stuff. I don't want some 'surveyor' coming round who probably knows far less than I do about saviing energy and what's appropriate for my circumstances, and no doubt drumming up trade for insulation and wind turbine and solar panels, none of which I want or, even with the grants on offer for the latter two, wish to pay out a vast sum for.

No doubt I'll be told uPVC double glazing would be good too.

AAAAGGGGGHHHH>

 

[Flyfisher]

I suspect it's far less to do with saving energy (except in a PR sense) than helping (if only in a small way) to get the economy moving again. When it comes to the economy vs the environment, it's now quite clear to see that the government deems economic woes to be far more important than environmental ones.

What could be better for the environment than a recession? Reduced consumption, reduced pollution, reduced greenhouse emissions. But no, the urgent priority is to restore constant, year-on-year, economic growth with little or no concern about the cost of re-priming the economic pumps to make it happen.

Forget all this 'going green', downsizing and reducing your eco-footprint nonsense - get out there and buy loads more stuff you probably don't need to keep the economy growing. Live now, pay later - as officially endorsed by the entire 'western' world.

 

[Nemesis]

I wonder how many new jobs have been created for people to cold call?

The announcement by the gov was that this insulation programme would create the jobs which the construction industry problems have shed.

OK - but at what cost to the taxpayer?

I still would prefer a cash grant and the ability to choose and fit my own insulation. I would like NOT to have to keep answering the phone to folk who are really trying to drum up trade.

But I agree - the whole spend spend spend stuff is sickening.

I will - I will get the roof and chimneys fixed, thus taking advantage of the tiny VAT reduction. But I was going to do it anyhow.

I won't be rushing to buy a load of gadgets and gewgaws I don't need. Maybe we shouldn't base our whiole economy on whether or not M and S makes a profit.

 

[skier-hughes]

If you look at the cash grant across the whole spectrum of our population, then it benfits those like my parents, who don't have the urge to go up in the loft and fit insulation any more, particuarly as it would be itchy and involve a lot of bending.
My parents have a lot less knowledge of green insulation.
Surely fitting some insulation is better than not, as it isn't wool.
The cost to the tax payer is expensive in comparison to having someone come and fit it for you.

As for the cold calling, they probably get away with it as they aren't selling you something, it's free... no selling involved!!! Which is how tehy get around the telephone preference service. People will phone you to ask you questions, which isn't barred, then the last will be is that something that interests you, yes, ok I'll pass you onto our sales team. As you only spoke to a marketing person they can call. Useless but it's the way it is.

 

[Nemesis]

If your parents want to take advantage of it then OK, (I'm an OAP too...) but why must I only get a grant to put insulation in the roof if it isn't what I want AND I am not allowed to DIY? It would be cheaper to the taxpayer to give me the cash. I can provide a receipt. (We do have some insulation, by the way - it's old and filthy it's not what we want and it's less than six inches).

I do know of people who had grants via a company in the past - the insulation they had was fine, but it was removed and new fitted under a 'scheme'... ditto a hot water jacket!

Interesting stuff about Warmfront on Watchdog recently.

http://www.helptheaged.org.uk/Discussion/forums/3/947/ShowThread.aspx

 

[skier-hughes]

I agree it would be good to give people a choice, but suspect that would be too hard to administer, thus adding to the cost.
Round here, they don't renew, they just top up, so if you have 1/2" they give you 5 1/2" top up, if you have 5" they top you up with an 1".

 

[Andy Davies]

I agree it would be good to give people a choice, but suspect that would be too hard to administer, thus adding to the cost.
Round here, they don't renew, they just top up, so if you have 1/2" they give you 5 1/2" top up, if you have 5" they top you up with an 1".

Our local council gives grants for difficult to insulate houses (like ours - we've got skeilings), and although they only pay a % based on the lowest quote (20% max £1k) it's up to you who you get to do the work

Andy

 

[Lime]

It always seems unfair on those who have spent their own money insulating their homes only to have to fund those who haven't bothered.
Topping up the insulation may work from an insulation point of view but the method always covers over decades of dirt and filth that can get damp and cause rot too.

Many years ago I watched a small cottage loft being insulated with fibreglass.
It was blown in.
While one man was in the loft another was in the street feeding the machine from an ordinary pack of block insulation.
The machine whipped it up into a light fluff, blew it up a pipe and it was piped/blown into the loft.
What surprised me at the time was how little block fibreglass was used.
The whole attic area was covered over with fluffy light fibreglass that normally would only cover (without the whipping) about 10% of the loft.
the whipping process extended the fibreglass material so they hardly used any at all.
Two problems became obvious after time.
first that the light fibreglass blanket could not be moved for wiring or plumbing without destroying its thickness and, secondly, in strong gales years later it all migrated to one end of the loft. :roll:

 

[worms]

And what are they suggesting if you have rubble construction walls and coomb ceilings?

 

[skier-hughes]

That you can't please all of the people all of the time

 

[worms]

That you can't please all of the people all of the time

I'd settle for reducing/removing VAT from the costs of the building materials that are required to do the insulation!

 

[Nemesis]

Something the President of RIBA has been suggesting too, although it's a long standing problem which the government seems not to wish to do much about. Some of it is connected with EU rules, but the opportunity to opt out arose in recent times and was ignored.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/2006/mar/21/budget.guardianletters

Why? A gov spokesperson seemed to think (with particular regard to listed buildings) that it would simply enable the better off to be able to alter properties at cheaper cost, while doing nothing to enable repairs to be done more cheaply.

Er....


This is the sort of thinking which gets us into wars, ie they haven't a bluuddy clue what they are talking about...

A balst from the past:

http://hansard.millbanksystems.com/commons/1972/jul/11/group-14-fees-in-connection-with-housing

 

[Nemesis]

I think this is the crux of what 'Home Carbon Savers' is all about:

Why do I need a survey?
A survey is required to ensure your property is suitable for the measures you are interested in. We will also check your property for a suitability match for other measures so that you are equipped with as much information as possible from the visit. The survey will also allow us to confirm what level of funding you are eligible to receive.


Who completes the installation work?
We aim to ensure that any work undertaken is of the highest quality. We have strong relationships with a network of installation groups and believe that they offer the best prices without disregard to customer service. We have pleasure in recommending these groups to you. Should you wish, we will also contact other organisations for comparison.

We actually come along and tell you what you 'should' be doing and then we have buddies in the industry...

Jobs
Energy Advisor We’re continuously recruiting for this post We are looking to increase the number of Energy Advisors in all of our well established council backed schemes around the country. There are positions available at surveyor, team leader and area manager level in all areas of the UK.

The specific work which is available varies depending on location, but will include one or more of the following types of survey:

Home Energy Reports
rdSAP Surveys
EPC Surveys
Stock Condition Surveys
Some of the work will involve canvassing and generating your own business, but a steady stream of leads is also generated via other marketing methods. Duties will typically include:

direct distribution of printed material to households and door to door follow-up
carrying out energy efficiency surveys
offering advice on energy efficiency and savings, and any available grant funding
collaboration with local authorities to call on their domestic customers
There are both full-time and part-time positions available, and we consider both employed and self employed surveyors.

To register your interest, please email hr@homecarbonsaver.com.

And as for qualifications???

I did a quick check on grants eligibility:

Free Grants Information
* if you receive any of the below benefits, you may be entitled to free installation of energy-saving products:

Attendance Allowance
Child Tax Credit where the relevant income is £15,597 or less
Council Tax Benefit
Disability Living Allowance
Disablement Pension which includes constant attendance allowance
Housing Benefit
Income Based Job Seekers Allowance
Income Support
State Pension Credit
War Disablement Pension (which includes either a mobility supplement or constant attendance allowance)
Working Tax Credit where the relevant income is £15,597 or less

And homeowners over 70.

I don't fall into any of those categories, yet twice I was told I would be entitled to free insulation.

Odd...

 

[Penners]

the light fibreglass blanket could not be moved for wiring or plumbing

My elderly parents (in their 90's) recently had free loft insulation installed under the Warm Front scheme. Immediately after the installers had finished clumping around in the attic of their bungalow, one of their phone extensions wouldn't work (the extension cable ran through the attic).

My father complained to the company, and they sent along a gentleman by the name of "Dave The Ferret". He disappeared under the rockwool blankets and emerged about half-an-hour later, having fixed the cable.

You'd have to pay me a very great deal of money to do that job. :x

 

[Penners]

I don't fall into any of those categories, yet twice I was told I would be entitled to free insulation.

Cynic that I am, I wonder how often people are told that they would qualify, but then after all the surveying, etc. is finished, someone says "Oh, sorry. Our mistake - you don't qualify for free. But as we made an error, we'll install your insulation for only £xxx."

I feel guilty even thinking it...

 

[Nemesis]

Well, I think I would be entitled to some grant aid - although not all paid for - for insulation, and of course there may be grants for solar panels, wind turbines etc... although I would have to put a gret deal of my own cash up too.

But once that nice free 'surveyor' for that nice company is invited into my home on the premise I might get it for nowt I have no doubt this little ol' OAP would be 'persuaded' that it's all to save the planet and I really, really need to spend thousands with a payback time of, well who knows?

Oh dear. I have no doubt many will be falling for it, just like the 'greenness' of uPVC windows.