Internal door locks with missing keys

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ElectronicFur
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Location: Monmouthshire

Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by ElectronicFur » Fri 6th Nov, 2020 5:42 pm

Matt's question about internal door mortice locks reminded me of an issue we have. Almost all our internal doors have locks on them, about 24 doors. The majority are mortice locks, with just a couple of sash locks. But only 4 of the locks have keys remaining. The rest have all been lost. Previous owners said they were missing already when they bought the place. Even the cupboards have locks on them with missing keys.

Has anyone had keys made up for missing locks? I did research this on the internet a while back, but it looked very expensive. I did go into a local locksmith with a key for a lock I had taken apart, on the toilet door. But he wouldn't sell me a matching uncut key, as he said they're not allowed to. I was hoping to just file the key to size myself by looking at the levers.

I could just replace the entire locks where I need them, I guess, but it seemed kind of wasteful. And also tricky finding the right sizes.

Feltwell
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Location: Shropshire, England

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by Feltwell » Fri 6th Nov, 2020 8:18 pm

ElectronicFur wrote:
Fri 6th Nov, 2020 5:42 pm
I did go into a local locksmith with a key for a lock I had taken apart, on the toilet door. But he wouldn't sell me a matching uncut key, as he said they're not allowed to.
That sounds like local policy at one particular locksmith to me. I've used my local Timpsons on a few occasions to buy blanks, which they've roughly cut to size for me, and I've just finished them off with a file to shape - really very easy, internal door locks are invariably crude! Look for another locksmith or key cutting outlet I'd say.

However - don't make keys to lock internal doors for security reasons. My in-laws ran a security company for many years, my father-in-law always said that if someone has done the risky bit of breaking into a building, once inside & in private they will just kick any internal doors through, especially as a locked door says something is worth having on the other side. I just made a key for the toilet doors here (previous owners must have been good at singing! No keys and no bolts) and one attic room that I used to hide the kid's Christmas presents in.

ElectronicFur
Posts: 102
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Location: Monmouthshire

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by ElectronicFur » Sat 7th Nov, 2020 10:46 pm

Thanks that's good to know. It was actually my local Timpsons I asked, and he said no locksmith would sell blanks.

Yes, my parents learnt that lesson about locking internal doors. Their internal doors were wrecked after burglars forced them, and they had metal door frames, so the damage was substantial.

The missus would prefer the locks on the toilets and bathrooms to work :D

So that is really my main aim. And maybe my office, for when I want to keep the kids out.

Perhaps making a key out of wood, filing it to shape, and then getting it cut by a locksmith might be another way to solve the issue.

a twig
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Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by a twig » Sat 7th Nov, 2020 11:24 pm

Just open up the lock and swap for new internals no? Cheaply available in many places

Me!
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Location: Suffolk

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by Me! » Sun 8th Nov, 2020 8:02 am

There are lots of different mortice key blanks available on eBay.

Feltwell
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Location: Shropshire, England

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by Feltwell » Sun 8th Nov, 2020 10:28 am

ElectronicFur wrote:
Sat 7th Nov, 2020 10:46 pm
Thanks that's good to know. It was actually my local Timpsons I asked, and he said no locksmith would sell blanks.
Perhaps it helped that I walked in with the lock in my hand - so it was obvious that I wasn't up to anything nefarious, wanting a blank key. The key was then roughly ground to size to simply fit through the hole in the lock casing, for me to finish off.

But as Me! says, online is definitely an option. It's not as if old mortice keys are exactly secure!

LadyArowana
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Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by LadyArowana » Fri 13th Nov, 2020 10:48 am

ElectronicFur wrote:
Sat 7th Nov, 2020 10:46 pm
Thanks that's good to know. It was actually my local Timpsons I asked, and he said no locksmith would sell blanks.
By coincidence I had to get some spare mortice lock keys cut today in Timpsons [ in Stall St, Bath ] and the guy there had never heard this, so either there is no such rule, or nobody told him. Hope you are now sorted for what you need.

RBailey
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Location: Rutland

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by RBailey » Fri 7th Jan, 2022 9:03 am

Me! wrote:
Sun 8th Nov, 2020 8:02 am
There are lots of different mortice key blanks available on eBay.
Just giving this thread a bump as I think I am going to give making a key for our front door lock a try.

Can anybody recommend a good source for key blanks?

I need large shank size and fleabay UK only seems to offer "modern" sized blanks.
I have found one in the US which maybe an option but shipping is expensive and seem lubricous to have to ship in a key blank.

(The old mortice lock is not the means of locking the front door, I just think it would be nice to have a big old chunky mortice key to match the lock.)

Thanks,
Richard B.

paulc
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Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by paulc » Fri 7th Jan, 2022 11:36 am

RBailey wrote:
Fri 7th Jan, 2022 9:03 am
Can anybody recommend a good source for key blanks?
Make your own ?
Most are little more than a bit of round bar with a flat welded on. Do you have a dimensioned drawing of what you need ?

RBailey
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu 1st Aug, 2019 7:25 am
Location: Rutland

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by RBailey » Fri 7th Jan, 2022 11:47 am

paulc wrote:
Fri 7th Jan, 2022 11:36 am
Make your own ?
Most are little more than a bit of round bar with a flat welded on. Do you have a dimensioned drawing of what you need ?
Thanks, I was thinking about that.
Abusing, I mean using, my dads lathe and getting out the TIG.

Cheers,
Richard B.

RBailey
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu 1st Aug, 2019 7:25 am
Location: Rutland

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by RBailey » Fri 7th Jan, 2022 12:43 pm

Just disappeared down a rabbit hole, this is some amazing work:
https://www.d-r-lock-restoration-and-repair.com/

Craig89
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Location: Shropshire

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by Craig89 » Fri 7th Jan, 2022 8:58 pm

RBailey wrote:
Fri 7th Jan, 2022 12:43 pm
Just disappeared down a rabbit hole, this is some amazing work:
https://www.d-r-lock-restoration-and-repair.com/
Some very nice metal work/art there!

I too would look at making my own key

Isabellah
Posts: 5
Joined: Mon 17th Jan, 2022 11:46 am

Re: Internal door locks with missing keys

Post by Isabellah » Mon 17th Jan, 2022 12:55 pm

Strange! Maybe its local locksmiths intern politics, but I have used tower hamlets locksmith services for such cases a lot of times, my kids are loosing keys often so I have to make copies a lot of times and I have never had a single issue going to my local locksmith and asking for a key copy.

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