Wrestling with my conscience....

[Manks]

I am currently converting an old Victorian terraced house into three bedsits. This involves ripping the place out and starting again, basically.

The house is a bit of a sad case to be fair, someone undermined the foundations whilst creating a basement dining room and the front elevation has sagged a bit. It seems to have stopped moving and as the property is worth maybe £100k a repair just is not worth it.

But, the property does still have most of its original cornicework, fireplaces and joinery. The cornicework will have to be covered up - its the law now that lath and plaster ceilings have to be chickenwired and overboarded for fire safety. The joinery, too, will vanish mostly because fire doors and frames need to go in.

The fireplaces could all remain though....except that I am thinking of removing the one in the front reception. It is an intact combination with marble surround. I would be removing it for several reasons, firstly it will lookincongruous in its new environ, secondly its doubtful whether the tenants will appreciate it, thirdly it will sooner or later get damaged and lastly my hallway at home is in need of a fireplace a lot like this one...

But I am usually so fiercely "leave-it-where-it-is-ist" that I am struggling with my conscience.

Thoughts anyone?

Manks

 

[Nemesis]

Yeah - put it back on the market and give someone the chance to buy it who might love it for what it is?

No, silly me.

 

[Manks]

Yeah - put it back on the market and give someone the chance to buy it who might love it for what it is?

That's why I own it now. It was on the market, it didn't sell. It went to auction, it didn't sell. Back on the market again... you've guessed it. So I bought it.

No, silly me.

Not silly, but naive perhaps. I could show you a lot of beautiful empty old period property that no one cares about. But you'd need a telescope to see it from your ivory tower dear.

Manks

 

[Nemesis]

Yes dear. It never fails does it - wind him up, off he goes.

Do what you want with it - sounds pretty much as though it's going to be boggered anyhow.

PS - I do regularly take pictures for the Buildings at Risk Register.

 

[Manks]

PS - I do regularly take pictures for the Buildings at Risk Register.

Don't tell me, you wait for a clear day and use your telephoto lense? I bet you can get some pretty good aerials from your broomstick too?

You'd be right that the property is pretty much bugg'red. Here's a similar one (not the same, the one in question is a 3-storey flat front) http://www.rightmove.co.uk/viewdetails-9752235.rsp?pa_n=2&tr_t=buy

The property will never be a nice house again, and even if it were everything around it is tat so you'd not get an owner occupier to love it. The area has improved since the early 20th Century when it was a slum area. Until the early part of this century it was an area of high crime. Still is, but its also well policed.

Despite how low rent the area is, it's got a certain charm. It's the Victorian architecture and dark underbelly. There's always someone up to something. I own a few properties there and I have enjoyed working with them for the most part. But the real world dictates that they need to be used in a way that the market demands, not restored to their former glory and splashed with Farrow and Ball.

Manks

PS, Still trying to buy the Manor House Bingham out the SAVE catalogue....

 

[Nemesis]

Broomstick?

Dear I take the Bentley.

But please - NEVER use the phrase 'restored to former glory' again. It's such a dreadful cliche dahlings.

Sorry, must dash out of my ivory tower and go and knock off a few more miles of cement pointing. One just can't get the starff these days.

 

[skier-hughes]

I'd put it where it'll be appreciated for what it is, I'm not a puris, but a realist.

 

[Ian Bond]

Manks,

Are you sure about the lath & plaster / chicken wire thing being mandatory?

I've found this book except, but it required patience to load - I'll need to have a look at the regs proper again when I get a chance.

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...OL4g62O&sig=UQhzluXyl-1M9tVyReREaZLByGg&hl=en

As far as I was aware, a lath and plaster ceiling in good nick gives better fireproofing than some pb ceilings.

Sound insulation between floors is also a consideration of course, as I know myself as a former flat dweller in a similar house

Plus, are there not acceptable ways to upgrade the doors without replacing that are quicker, cheaper and less wasteful?

I'm particularly interested in the subject as I live in a humble terrace. Some of the houses are now reverting to multiple occupancy, although the regs are more stringent now than they were back in the 1830s - if there were any. I hope I'm not wasting my time and effort retaining the original features...

Perhaps the tenants will enjoy having some attractive features in their home? I certainly did in my Leeds flat. It was the first 'old' house I'd lived in.

The tone of this thread turned unpleasant rather quickly, I note. An example of why I'm wary of directing people to the forum, as per my reply to MdB earlier.
http://www.periodproperty.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=9299&p=105753#p105753



Ian

 

[Nemesis]

No, it didn't really. Honest. Manx thinks I live in an ivory tower surrounded by palatial acres, I know he's a greedy property developer who rips and strips... but it would be nice if he got the Manor House and was kind to it. It needs it.

 

[shelli]

I know he's a greedy property developer who rips and strips...

Ian Hislop told me to tell you to edit that last post to include the word "allegedly" - and he should know :wink:

 

[Nemesis]

No, I KNOW he is...

PS - he even fits :shock: uPVC windows... :shock:

 

[shelli]

You must be his nemesis then !

or he yours...

 

[Nemesis]

No chance he's mine. I'm on the side of the angels. My soul hath not been sold for shabby profit.

(Doesn't get you rich, but I sleep nights...)

 

[Penners]

My soul hath not been sold for shabby profit.

Fat chance. I tried that.

No offers.

 

[Manks]

Ian Bond

Unfortunately we have to do the chicken wire and PB thing, the local authority insists upon it.

As for the tone of the thread turning sour, don't worry I don't take Nemesis very seriously. If I lived in luxury on someone else's income I'd probably be out of touch with reality too.

Nemesis - as for the Bingham property, you do know that if I get it I'll be replacing the timber windows with PVC casements and leasing the place to Spud-U-Like don't you? (By the way, Spud-U-Like is a chain of hot potato shops frequented by poor people or "facking peasants" as I think you call them).

Manks

 

[Nemesis]

Live in luxury on someone else's income? Like whose?

If only. A pension, paid for by myself over many years' of hard work. I retired early through ill health. That's hard work working with those poor people in deprived areas, trying to do some small amount of good and give them better chances in life. Vast amount of time spent since on voluntary work of course, but that not only doesn't pay well it's the opposite way round.

Not sure what you call luxury either - do define it? Then I might know what I'm missing. I'm sure you know all about luxury. I can only press my nose against the glass.

But what happened the last time you asked us the same question - that was about ripping out a fireplace in a bedroom I recall?

The there was the timber v uPVC debate - Ian might recall that one (if not he can do a site search). And then when Biff and I tried to point out the dangers of working with MDF you turned unpleasant

You don't actually want opinons, so I don't take it seriously. I don't think I'm now alone.

 

[Manks]

Nemesis

But what happened the last time you asked us the same question - that was about ripping out a fireplace in a bedroom I recall?

Don't think that was me dear.

The there was the timber v uPVC debate - Ian might recall that one (if not he can do a site search). And then when Biff and I tried to point out the dangers of working with MDF you turned unpleasant

Again I think your memory is failing you, I would never dispute that MDF is unhealthy. That wasn't what I disagreed with. I disagreed with your and Vernon's daft elitist claptrap and let them eat cake mentality. Handmade timber sash windows are ideal for an ivory tower, but they aren't the solution to everything.

You don't actually want opinons, so I don't take it seriously. I don't think I'm now alone

On the contrary, opinions were exactly what I wanted. However out of touch and rude I might think you are, it's always good to hear what you have to say Evelyn.

Well done on your voluntary work by the way. You can be as big a gyet as you like, so long as you do work for good causes.

Manks

 

[Nemesis]

Oh I'm sure it was - a thirties bedroom fireplace - dear. Your partner said rip it out... I did argue it would be nice to keep it.

But - you are clearly stuck in a mental rut, and in denial. Ivory tower? Rather more in the real world than you I think.

Shame you don't read what is said, I don't think the debate was actually uPVC ve expensive hand made in oak. But folks are entitled to read for themselves.

But this forum is surely about period buildings, and careful repair, not about rip and strip property development? I suspect I'm more in touch with the real world - whatever that is - than you are.

However, your misogyny is showing again dear. I doubt that anyone is much interested in your rather wrong headed ideas about me, based on never actually having met me, talked to me, etc.

As far as Biff's windows are concerned - I saved up for a small one. It is a joy to sit by it each day. He lives in the real world also. He wouldn't deny these are hand made, and you can buy off the peg or cheaper timber than his. But not uPVC, thank you. Not only are they ugly they are polluting and a short term answer.

 

[Manks]

Oh I'm sure it was - a thirties bedroom fireplace - dear. Your partner said rip it out... I did argue it would be nice to keep it.

Ah, that was a NOT taking them out conversation. Totally different situation and question. I was in favour of keeping them because they were intrinsic to a relatively untouched property that was to remain in single occupancy.

Now, I suggest that we draw a line under this. If you have anything positive to add please go ahead. Just be nice and we'll get on fine.

Manks

 

[Nemesis]

So did it (they) go or did it stay? I think that your partner said no-one would want a house with them in, as, sadly, did one or two people posting I recall.

Here's some more on terraces. I happen to think they are a fine housing type in need of tender loving care. I was born in one.

http://www.english-heritage.org.uk/upload/pdf/Low_demand_Housing.pdf