Veg patches?

[discobarry]

Morning, i was wondering who has a veg patch at home here? I started turning a large area yesterday and i wondered if anybody had some tips to share? I'm following the advice of john Seymour's self sufficiency book which is becoming a bible to me at the minute.

 

[Lime]

I don't have a veg patch now, it has a large trailer tent and Land Rovers on it.
However my advice is to double or treble dig the land.
You will be remarkably fit afterwards and the land will always be better and more healthy for decades to come.
Plants will grow like you've never seen them before.

...all that presupposes you are not growing in an area where rock is just under the surface.
If you are I suggest raised beds. Nowhere near as good as treble dug land but an alternative.

 

[skier-hughes]

I have a veg patch, and a fruit patch and an orchard.
Very hard work keeping it all under control, but on a good year I grow enough veg to last us a year.
I'm giving up on potatoes. I say it every year, but I go ahead, but they are the hardest work for smallest return.
I would have thought turning the soil in this very wet weather to be a tortuous task!!
Mind you, I have a rotavator, another boy toy well worth it's money, like this http://www.lawnmowersdirect.co.uk/product/mid-tine-tillers--rotovators/honda-f220-tiller?gclid=CODqqtCCirwCFTTJtAod_WEAwQ but from ebay, 3 months old and way less money

Only problem with it is, it stores in the farmers barn, so I have to rotavate his patch as well for storage costs

Tip 1, weed weed weed and weed every day
Tip 2, start off with a smaller than you think you want patch this year, tend it, grow things, enjoy it. Then expand year on year. Too large will lead to disappointment and resentment at the amount of hard work involved and seemingly nothing in return for ages.............

 

[discobarry]

The book I'm following says to fork over and out all perennial weeds. Then fork over again to make sure you have pulled out the majority of weeds and leave it for a couple of weeks so the weather can do its work. I will then go over it with a rotovator a couple of time and then leave again. I agree that preparation is the key. I will preparing a big area but just maintaining a lot of it just to grow some vegetables and not too many initially. I'm planting a beech hedge around it and to the south west I will plant some small and medium trees for wind protection. I would love an orchard but that will come later, Maybe next winter.

Thanks for the advice so far, btw potatoes I never have bother with. At my old house I would get loads, it's everything else I struggle with.

 

[vicky whitworth]

We have a big veg plot, and grow allsorts of things - much of which we never get round to eating. Gardening is our therapy.
Here's my advice www.charlesdowding.co.uk
He advocates no dig gardening - what's not to like. My OH has been on a course with Charles who has a house and garden that all us period property buffs would love. It's rural paradise down Somerset way.
Best of luck. Vicky

 

[Moo]

My allotment in Norwich was huge, and infested with knee-high twitch (couch) grass when I took it over.

This is what I did:
Used a strimmer to take off most of the top growth;
Waited until re-growth was lush;
Sprayed it all with industrial quantities of Roundup;
When it had all turned straw colour, attacked anything green with another dose of roundup, and waited until that was dead.

Then:
Covered the lot with thick plastic (damp-proof membrane rescued from a skip);
Uncovered a narrow strip and went over it with a hand fork, removing all the dead roots;
Spent the rest of the summer working back over the rest of the plot, accompanied by an enthusiastic group of birds.
Kept a small spray can of roundup to deal with any nasties that survived the first onslaught.

The result was a plot where I only needed to keep the inevitable annual weeds under control, and was able to concentrate on fun things like planting, harvesting, and drinking tea in my shed (thank you, Joss!).


ps
No-dig gardening is definitely the way to go, as is starting small.
However, if you have perennial nasties like twitch-grass that have sinister invasive roots, I'd be inclined to clear the whole plot at the outset, and then keep most of it covered with something weed-suppressant so that you can gradually increase the acreage under cultivation.

 

[skier-hughes]

ACREAGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[discobarry]

I don't know how I would clear it all, there is 1
Acre in total. That's why in beech hedging a nice rectangular area first. My wife wants a jersey cow, not yet.

 

[88v8]

Our soil compacts badly when trodden, so the beds in our veg patch have been made narrow, that way we can work them without walking on. We plan on no-dig.
Sort out a series of good compost heaps.
Provide a tap for watering the compost as it's made it up otherwise it will never compost. Compost heaps need a lot of water as well as a suitable mix of materials... not just grass clippings. Have a separate container or three for leaves. Leaves make lovely compost, but it takes a couple years. Only a nut burns leaves. Where we lived before, there were plenty of nuts.
Watering... and possible drought restrictions... storage. Lack of water stunts many crops. Not just the obvious ones such as courgettes. An acre plot will require quite a watering network, which will need burying against the frost. Agri-plastic pipe is cheap, although the fittings aren't.
Think about shutting out the critturs who will see your veg patch as a free supermarket.
Grow what prospers in your soil ph, not what doesn't.
Plan crop rotation.
Plan the area as regards soft fruit, tree fruit, a greenhouse. Galling to realise later that you've put permanent planting in the wrong place. Fruit trees need pollinators, which have to be in flower at the same time.
Allow space - one blackcurrant bush can spread 5ft.
Remember you've got to maintain all this planting in future. Pruning, the right way the right time, mulching, weeding. It can all become a real drudge if you don't enjoy gardening.
Think about the unhelpful shadows cast by high crops such as runner beans.
If there is shade, grow things there that don't mind it.
Put the herb garden near the kitchen.
Think how and where to store bulk harvest. No point growing and then seeing it rot.
Think how to use bulk harvest. One can only eat so many gherkins.
There are always good topical veg tips on GQT. Bob Flowerdew has some wonderful left-field ideas.
Remember one is supposed to enjoy it. This is not about economics. The stuff will all arrive when veg is cheapest in the shops. What we've spent buying and fencing and equipping our veg patch, we could have had veg delivered in a Roller from Harrods for the rest of our lives.
But my wife gets a real buzz out of veg growing.

Ivor

 

[skier-hughes]

I'm trying to buy an extra bit of land, then put a couple of pigs on it, let them destroy it for 6 months, eat them, grow veg on my new cleared veg plot.

 

[Keith Bowman]

Our soil compacts badly when trodden.......we could have had veg delivered in a Roller...

Ivor

No wonder it compacts - this is a roller!:-
http://www.edinphoto.org.uk/0_edin_t/0_edinburgh_transport_steam_roller_1960s.jpg

 

[88v8]

Our garden is rather slopey

 

[discobarry]

Thank you Ivor, a big concern for me is the wind we get up here. We live in a very exposed location so I'll be trying to plant some wind defences hopefully using just trees and hardy shrubs.

 

[discobarry]

I'll post a pic of so far....you can see how exposed it is approximately 260m up in the Pennines.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

and drinking tea in my shed (thank you, Joss!).

I remember that day as clearly as yesterday Moo-- where has the time gone?

It seems to me that the old style kitchen garden is probably the best way forward, as shown on the Garden Revival programme last week---probably more relaxed once the basic preparation is done, with more haphazard combinations as opposed to rigid neat rows of veg. :roll:

 

[Keith Bowman]

Our garden is rather slopey

Hope you managed to jump clear in time I always thought those black plastic sheets for weed suppression were quite natty, but 6" of asphalt is simply OTT.

 

[Juju]

We took on an allotment last year - waist high weeds and grass. We dug it all out. Yes it'll keep coming back but eventually we'll get on top of it. We covered sections with weed suppressant fabric which helped. The previous allotmenteer had covered much of the plot with carpet - I would never do that personally as it is horrible to get rid of later on and the weeds take seed on it the minute you start walking dirt on to it...

In terms of digging, yes you've got to get the weeds out, then dig again and rake before planting. But don't kill yourself digging, it's not worth it!

At the National Trust property where I garden - and which is a very weedy garden because of years of neglect - some weed killer is used on paths etc but mostly now we just take the heads off to stop them flowering and then they weaken and eventually die. We pull/dig the weeds out the flower and veg beds obviously.

And crop rotation is important. I was running a workshop a while back and a participant said he had trouble growing potatoes - had tried for several years but they were being eaten by something. I said 'presumably you've changed where you plant them?' He said 'no'. Hmmmmm.
Juju

 

[skier-hughes]

I've changed where I've tried to grow mine, but I think, as potatoes used to be grown in abundance on the farm it is all potatoed out!