tiling

[plasticpigeon]

I went to an old friends th other day, and he lives in a large house from the 1860s. He was lucky enough to have bought the house about 40 years ago in a totally untouched state, and has done his best to keep it that way. His house has a separate toilet in a small upstairs room that looks original to the house. I was particularly interested to see that the wall tiles look as if they were laid with no gaps between them at all and then grouted with pure cement. It looks great as the lines between tiles are very thin. Does anyone know why modern tiling is normally execulted with large ugly grout lines, and is there a reason not to lay tiles edge to edge?

 

[kreyszig]

you can't fit those little plastic spacers between them if they are too close together. ;-)
but seriously, I think it's to allow for a bit of movement and difference in tile sizes. I don't see why the gaps need to be as large as they are though.

 

[88v8]

And those I've seen were often staggered, like bricks in a wall. They were in the fire opening in our 1932 kitchen. They were laid in cement, jointed in cement iirc although it was 40+ years ago that I chiselled them off to replace with modern tiles mea culpa.
Back then, Tiles used to be a lot thicker. So perhaps not as prone to expansion? But could only be laid on brick or a very solid backing, whereas modern tiles can be applied to wood etc.
Probably just easier with a gap.
And the grout joints are actually sealed, whereas the thin cement joints quite often had no cement in them because they were too thin, not very hygienic in the kitchen and not much use in the shower. Although there were tiled showers long ago, so hmmm.

Ivor

 

[88v8]

The agent liked this place, so many pics. Unusually, it's not completely ruined. With some proper wallpaper, could be pretty good. And get that fireplace working in the bathroom.
Anyway, plonk through to pic 21, see that tiling? New, but like old. OK it' s grouted. So, nearly like. Shows it can be done.

Ivor

 

[plasticpigeon]

Hello Ivor, I'm interested to see the tiling in question, but the link is missing!

 

[88v8]

Oops
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-50414101.html

 

[plasticpigeon]

Oh yes, very nice, even the same colour we were thinking of, but I prefer cement coloured grout. Lovely place too, my dad used to live round there. In my mind pure cement slurry between butted up tiles should work. Grout isn't flexible so I can't see how thick grout lines could allow for movement. I'm a little fearful to try it though, just incase it leaks around the shower and then my other half will really enjoy saying "I told you so".

 

[mims&pip]

Oops
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-50414101.html

Ooh, yes Malvern Ivor.....we like Malvern and last year when we were looking to buy we did consider viewing this one http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-49990103.html but didn't like the fact they seem to have sold off some garden for a new build For the price it's pretty big, the price has been reduced somewhat and it's now SSTC.....

The one you've linked is almost identical layout-wise to a house we used to own in Southsea, Hants. I suppose it was a very nice house but - due its position close to a busy junction with a bus stop right outside - I never warmed to it. That's Pip's favourite type of house though - central door with windows flanking either side :wink:

Mims x

 

[plasticpigeon]

I'm definitely moving to Malvern in the near future if there are other deals like that.

 

[88v8]

Ooh, yes Malvern Ivor.....we like Malvern and last year when we were looking to buy we did consider viewing this one http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-49990103.html but didn't like the fact they seem to have sold off some garden for a new build For the price it's pretty big, the price has been reduced somewhat and it's now SSTC.....

£450k for that :shock:
Caramba.
Looks superb. I could move in tomorrow.
At least, it looks superb in the pics.

Well PP, there are a good few large houses in Malvern, mostly Edy or 20s, that I'd rate in the 'not expensive'' class. Many of them have decent views as the terrain is very steep, although they tend to have been built around. This one of Mims' though, is on another level.

Yes, I hate it when people flog off bits of garden. We moan about developers, but someone has to sell them the land in the first place. And then of course they move away and leave the resulting issues to others. Better not get started on that.

Back to the tiling. The problem, especially in wet areas, is getting any grout/slurry into dead-tight joins. Water will happily creep in by capillary action, but grout won't so there's no guarantee the joints are watertight. If the backing is damp-proof, bedded in cement on brick or clinker block for instance, a modicum of leakage may be OK, but no good on board for instance as cement probably won't adhere.
The 'I told you' problem can be quite serious. It tends to undermine faith in what one is doing, and domestic harmony. On the whole, I tend to do what I want, but then I jolly well have to make it work. Trying to think of an easy way to make it watertight as I type, only thinking of long-winded fiddly ways. This is why I spent 30 years on our last house hoho.

Ivor

 

[plasticpigeon]

Ha, 30 years is not my intended timescale. I think I will go for thin joints not butted up. The problem is, that although plases like the one in the link look fabulous and are incredible value, they are still not affordable to me. I spent too long £*%&ing about before getting a proper job, and my partner works part time as we have a small child. I think I need someone to let me in on the secret of working smart and investing wisely as I am certain grafting for a pay check is not the best way to make money.

 

[malcolm]

The secret is easy. Just invent a time travelling machine and go back 30 years, buy a cheap house, let hyper inflation (wages went up more than mortgage interest rates) pay the mortgage off for you, then get a few buy to lets to supplement your income.

What? making a time travelling machine is impossible you say? Young people want it too easy these days!

Back to tiling (again). I'd go for a gap. There will always be some gap even with tiles very close together, but with the tiles too close you'll never be able to fill it with anything. You'll get green stuff settling in there.

 

[TheRoost]

I'd guess that reason that wide grouted joints came about is because of the slight variations in size and squareness during manufacture. Last time I tiled a wall with 6" ceramic 'brick' tiles, they varied by up to 2mm in length.

I like the very fine tiled joints though, I've seen it somewhere before, maybe a hotel or pub. I wonder if the tiles were made very accurately, or whether the installers actually 'rubbed' them to matched sizes?

Suppose it's a bit like fine gauged brickwork, the modern world doesn't do it anymore because it's too expensive/too skilled/can't be bothered!