Thatch

[Bogart]

There is a wealth of information, and a lot if disinformation, out on the web regarding thatch. You can even get 2 thatchers with totally opposed views.
Less of my ramblings, what I have is a water reed roof in decent nick totally netted all over. The state now is that a lot of autumns leaves are stuck in the netting especially
in a gully where they have actually composted and the moss is having a field day. I am in two minds to have the netting removed, unable to find out the thatcher who put it on to ask why.
I also believe the roof can be treated with some sort of moss killer to try to keep it at bay. If anyone has nuggets of advice on this I would be very grateful.

Dave

 

[MikeG]

I built a new house with a reed thatch, so can speak on this with some authority. I didn't net the bulk of my roof, but the ridge does require netting in the normal way. There was no downside to omitting the netting, other than on an exposed verge where gales lifted the thatch and eventually shook a few bits out of it. After a few years I had this verge netted to help hold it down, but the bulk of the roof remained un-netted.

My thatcher was initially sceptical when I asked him to leave the netting off, but has since taken to leaving it off other reed rooves.

As for getting two thatchers to agree on anything thatching related...................good luck! The only way that ever happens is if it's father & son, where the former taught the latter.

 

[88v8]

Our roof is totally netted. Combed wheat. Tratt Brothers.
It prevents rodents from tunnelling into the thatch after the wheat ears. And also helps keep the ridge on.
When the thatch shrinks with age and the fixings become loose, the netting keeps it all secure.
Reed, can see why one might not need netting.

The leaves, surprised... our netting is too fine to admit leaves. Maple, oak, sycamore, ash. Looking out at the eaves, I guess about 3/4" gauge. Think you have the wrong netting.

In wheat, ridge and valleys need redoing after 8-10 years. The valleys rot, it's nature's way..
You can postpone the evil day by spraying the valleys with Jeyes fluid (dilution... can't remember, but dilute, read label....) using a pump-up sprayer. Don't rake out the moss, it will be bedded into the thatch and you will simply make holes in the thatch.
Spray it twice yearly when the roof is thoroughly dry.

Ivor

 

[tobydog]

The leaves, surprised... our netting is too fine to admit leaves. Maple, oak, sycamore, ash. Looking out at the eaves, I guess about 3/4" gauge. Think you have the wrong netting.

I agree with Ivor. We have what I would call normal chicken wire on our roof and it's probably about 1/2" gauge. Although we have water reed (the ridge is straw) the whole roof is covered. The only problem I have with wildlife is when pigeons or jackdaws (or both!) pull out complete lengths of reed through the wire mesh for their nests. Thankfully not too often.

We had a substantial amount of moss removed from the thatch a few years back. It was getting on for 1" thick all over like a carpet. Being on the north side, it kept the thatch constantly wet. Our thatcher made short work of it with a petrol hedge trimmer with what looked like a curved blade. Did minimal damage to the reed as it only removed the dead soggy ends. This allowed him to see and fix some rotten sections. He sprayed the new surface with Roundup which worked for a while. The moss is coming back but nowhere near as bad.

 

[88v8]

He sprayed the new surface with Roundup which worked for a while. The moss is coming back but nowhere near as bad.

Hadn't thought to spray the whole roof. Our thatch is ten years old. To the south, the ridge is suffering from uv and the hazels have pretty much come to bits. On the north, where the valleys are it's getting soggy. A regular spraying of the whole north face with Jeyes fluid will prevent the return of your moss. Depends to what extent you can get at it with a ladder, but a pump-up garden sprayer with a lance will achieve good coverage on a calm day.
Where moss is concerned, prevention definitely best.

Ivor

 

[Bogart]

Would never have thought of Jeyes fluid. As regards the leaves the problem is more aesthetic than problematic. I know straw is usually netted but reed in theory does not need it. Not sure why in some
instances only the ridge is netted but there again I am no thatch expert this being my first such roof.

 

[tobydog]

He sprayed the new surface with Roundup which worked for a while. The moss is coming back but nowhere near as bad.

Hadn't thought to spray the whole roof. Our thatch is ten years old. To the south, the ridge is suffering from uv and the hazels have pretty much come to bits. On the north, where the valleys are it's getting soggy. A regular spraying of the whole north face with Jeyes fluid will prevent the return of your moss. Depends to what extent you can get at it with a ladder, but a pump-up garden sprayer with a lance will achieve good coverage on a calm day.
Where moss is concerned, prevention definitely best.

Ivor

One way of seeing how much ridge has been lost to degradation is by looking at the ever increasing gap between the top of the ridge and the wire. A clear space appears as it drops. When our roof was cleared of the moss, the wire was replaced tightly and therefore there was no longer a gap. Although this has reappeared to some extent, the tell tale sign on the south side is the same as yours where the hazels have started to detach and fall down the thatch under the wire. Our ridge is now about 12 years old so probably time to get in the thatcher's queue for replacement given how much lead time they need. As the main thatch is re-dressed at the same time, I'll get him to use the Jeyes fluid.

 

[MikeG]

............Not sure why in some instances only the ridge is netted but there again I am no thatch expert this being my first such roof.

Reed rooves still have straw ridges (reed doesn't bend). Straw needs protecting from vermin, and birds.

If you ask nicely, I'll tell you how this netting saved my life 10 years or so ago.

 

[Bogart]

Oh go on then let's have all the gory details.

 

[Me!]

Reed rooves still have straw ridges (reed doesn't bend).

Or a reed thatch can have a ridge made from sedge.

 

[MikeG]

It can. I don't think thatchers like sedge as it cuts their hands. They're not common ridges, I don't think, at least not round here. I guess they might be more common in Devon and Somerset, maybe.

 

[MikeG]

Oh go on then let's have all the gory details.

I was working on the chimney, doing a little repointing, and had set up a tower scaffold to eaves level, then propped a ladder on that. It was a very tall roof indeed, and that was the only way of getting a (double) ladder to reach the ridge, lying along the face of the thatch. Anyway, I was climbing the ladder carrying a big bucket of mortar, and a couple of metres short of the ridge, the ladder started going down the roof........Like a scene from bugs bunny I ran faster and faster up it to stay in the same place on the roof, then dumped the bucket of muck, and from the top rung of the descending ladder leapt up to catch the ridge netting. I just managed to grab onto the bottom couple of inches of it, and hauled myself up onto the ridge, which is really broad and quite comfortable. The tower scaffold had completely collapsed, and lay in a heap on the ground. I sat there for an hour or two, waiting for someone to appear, and eventually my neighbour came out to mow his lawn. "Erm, Tom, you couldn't come and give me a hand, could you......."

Luckily, my neighbour panicked, and forgot to grab a camera.......so the ignominy went unrecorded!

 

[Bogart]

My it is good you can laugh at it now. In fact could have been very serious with any other outcome.

 

[MikeG]

Yeah, I could easily have broken something. As it was, cleaning a bucket of mortar off the thatch was the worst problem I had to deal with...........other than......you know, denying any such thing ever happened to the whole of the rest of the village for the next few weeks. :lol:

 

[JoceAndChris]

:shock: that's a brilliant but equally terrifying story, MikeG! Glad you were unharmed! Actually very quick thinking there and good self preservation!

My father in law fell of a ladder in June, whilst cleaning soffit boards I think. It wasn't high, just a flat roofed garage extension, but it was high enough. He hit his head very badly which triggered a "brain bleed" - in other words a stroke. He also broke his wrist in three places which has needed surgery. Physically he is wonderfully recovered but mentally he isn't and to an extent my mother in law has lost her companion as he can't share conversation normally yet and it isn't certain if he will ever be able to If only there had been netting or something to catch hold of! I swear I'm going to start laying mattresses out when C is doing ladder work!

 

[88v8]

Back in Essex where we first lived, a neighbour was an aerial installer. One-man band. None of this H&S piffle. He had a triple extension ladder, but not rope-operated.
His party piece with a high roof was to extend the top section, and then balance the ladder near the falling point and run up it pushing the middle section ahead of him, the idea being that it fell against the wall just as he got to the point of maximum extension.
He lived to a ripe old age,

I never fell off a tall ladder. Yet. If ever I'm in a situation, I hope I have Mike's presence of mind.

A prominent member of the Rolls-Royce Enthusiasts Club fell off a ladder recently. A step ladder I think it was. Hit his head. After an initial recovery, he went downhill and a few months later his life support was turned off.

My wife has begun independent ladder antics pursuant fruit picking. Worrisome.

Ivor

 

[MikeG]

..........I never fell off a tall ladder. Yet.

I haven't yet either, unless you count stepping backwards off one straight into a wheelbarrow. I have fallen straight through a scaffold though. I now make the scaffolder walk a complete circuit before he hands it over.

If ever I'm in a situation, I hope I have Mike's presence of mind.

I'd advocate forethought as a better option, though!! Tying the tower scaffold to the house would have saved a wasted bucket of muck, and a couple of hours idle time viewing the village from an unusual vantage point.

 

[Me!]

My wife has begun independent ladder antics pursuant fruit picking. Worrisome.
Ivor

I bought one of these Fruit Picking Tripod Ladders a few years ago, and they are absolutely fantastic. Three legs mean they never wobble even on wonky surfaces, and a spike on the bottom of the 3rd leg anchors it firmly into soft ground.

For cutting hedges and pruning trees etc. it is extremely stable and I would recommend them to everyone in those sorts of situations.