Sealing Pamments

[Flyfisher]

For our newly-built kitchen, we've pretty much decided to lay pamments over the new floor slab. Because this is a kitchen area, there will inevitably be liquid spills and potential for staining etc, so we want to seal the tiles and grout. Because it's a new floor in a new extension, breathability is not a prime concern. If it wasn't a kitchen area I'd probably just use linseed oil but I've read that this is not waterproof and therefore not stain-resistant.

What would the panel suggest as the best product to seal the new pamments?

 

[plasticpigeon]

This maybe a useless reply as I have not got first hand experience, but might lithofin make an appropriate product?

 

[Flyfisher]

Thanks for that. From what I've been reading, the world seems split between the traditional oil + wax treatment and various modern treatments. The Lithofin product range seems to cater for both approaches.

Here's some more info I've found from a specialist company: http://www.artofclean.co.uk/services/terracotta-quarry-tile-brick-cleaning-sealing-cambridge/

There's an interesting video at the bottom of the page that explains why a wax finish is better for handmade pamments because of the more open structure of their porous surface when compared to machine made tiles.

We're 99% sure that we'll be using handmade pamments so it's looking like oil + wax is probably the answer. Now I just need to find the 'best' wax for the job!

 

[JoceAndChris]

I'd use the Liberon stone products ( trying them out on one first of all) They've provided a lovely finish here, rich and long lasting. Admittedly I've used them on stone and not pamments but it says on the tin suitable for hard porous floor surfaces.

First there are three coats of Liberon Stone Floor Sealer, which is oil mixed with a carrier. You rag it on and wait for it to dry - that's 3 days work. Then there's the Liberon stone floor wax, which needs another 3 coats. The wax becomes very liquid and easy to use when it's warmed gently. You put that on with another rag and wait for a couple of hours, then buff. A buffing machine comes in handy at this point unless you want to spend a lot of time sliding about in socks! After a week you have a lovely deep shine, and it's all breathable. After around 6 months to a year another coat of wax cleans and renews.

During this time it's advisable to vacuum, not using too much water if you mop. Of course the wetter it gets the more this type of waxed surface gets lost, so I wouldn't recommend this system for really muddy areas.

 

[Penners]

Although I can't support it from personal experience, I reckon Joce's recommendation sounds good.

What I can report from personal experience is the downside of using a modern, non-breathable chemical sealer. Our last house had a pamment floor that had been sealed with something-or-other of this type, and it had begun to wear badly. All the pamments in the high traffic areas had a kind of flaking skin on them that was pretty well impossible to get off.

In the end we employed professional cleaners to come and clean the floor. They tried a variety of solvents until they found one that worked, and ended up peeling the semi-dissolved crap off the floor in sheets.

The moral being, of course, that modern finishes are great until they start to wear... at which point they can become a nightmare.

But I'm sure you knew that already.

 

[Flyfisher]

Thanks for the reassuring comments. I'm probably just worrying too much really (as usual). I seem to worry mored about making a mistake with these sort of finishing touches than I do when faced with a gaping hole in a roof. :lol: Still, I don't suppose much can go wrong with an oil and wax treatment - well, nothing that can't be rectified later. The worry is that any mistake arising from inappropriate use of some 'wonder chemical' might be difficult to rectify later.

I'm not overly concerned with general dirt and grime (we have plenty of that in other areas with pamments) but I'd like to make the new pamments as stain-resistant as possible, given that they'll be in a kitchen area so there is bound to be a lot of liquid spillages - especially when I'm doing the cooking. I guess a waxy finish will suffice for this.

The only other thing is choosing a hardwearing wax, as part of the floor will be in a high traffic area with an outside door.

 

[JoceAndChris]

Well I've been lazy with my stone hallway floor lately, I reckon it's well over a year since it was last waxed. And it gets plenty of mud! I've found that since the stone floor sealer ( which felt like pouring oil into sand!) the flagstones don't get penetrating stains anymore - the mud/tea/coffee sits on the surface. When it's freshly waxed the liquid spillage beads up as you'd expect. But I'm pretty confident that the Liberon stone floor sealer alone has offered a good level of protection.

If you're passing I can let you have my old tins to try out on a pamment and then you could pour ketchup or wine or whatever on it and see what happens.

I was all set to do the pamments in the kitchen but unfortunately they've suffered badly over 200 yrs and are just crumbling away so I'm thinking of an old Turkey carpet just to cover the whole lot up! ( this is a sitting part of the kitchen - in the working part there are modern tiles ) Don't really want to lift them and renew as they're fine to walk on, just rather damaged to look at.

Whichever you use make sure you try a test pamment first! The Liberon sealer darkens the colour a lot and you might not like it. The same would go for any oil based product I'd imagine.

 

[AMc]

Sealed my pamment kitchen floor with Osmo Polyx hard wax oil. Easy to apply, a little goes a very long way and to date there are no permanent stains despite being messy and careless with red wine etc. been there since 2009.

 

[Flyfisher]

I had thought of Osmo Polyx, but was under the impression that it was only for wood floors, so that's a very helpful recommendation (especially the bit about being messy, like us :wink: ).

Were your pamments new? Is the Osmo treatment a single treatment or did you apply anything to the tiles beforehand?

I did some experimentation over the weekend by applying linseed oil to some samples of new 'red' and 'yellow' pamments, to see the colour change, but I'll now order some Osmo Polyx hard wax oil immediately.

Many thanks!



(You'd think the limited choice of colours would make things easy, but oh no. The FF household is currently wrestling with the choice of pamment colour - I'm favouring the 'red' ones but Mrs FF favours the 'yellow' ones. I'm hoping that the weekend experiments will push things in my direction as the yellow ones seems to have turned a bit 'muddy' whereas the 'red' ones stayed basically the same basic hue albeit a little darker).

 

[Penners]

Here's a creative contribution to your family discussion, FF. I'm sure I read somewhere* that yellow pamments wear much faster than red ones, and are much easier to crack and break.

*Or did I dream that useful bit of persuasive information? :wink:

 

[Flyfisher]

You see, that's the sort of expert, authoritative and definitive advice that makes PPUK such essential reading.

I shall print that out in a large font and declare the matter hereby resolved*. :wink:





*If I'm never heard of again, you might suggest to the police that they check the colour of our new kitchen floor and if it's yellow then they might wish to check what's underneath them.

 

[Penners]

Yellow, with ugly splatter of red, might be an alternative.

 

[masochists-r-us]

I used Osmo Polyx on the old Pammets in my hearth. They do get dusty, but a quick mop and the finish is as good as new. Have to say, I didn't seal them first which I think with hindsight would have been a good idea. I have a kitchen floor to do next and although I like the idea of a traditional finish, think I will go for Osmo again, but seal with Liberon first.

 

[AMc]

I had thought of Osmo Polyx, but was under the impression that it was only for wood floors, so that's a very helpful recommendation (especially the bit about being messy, like us :wink: ).

Were your pamments new? Is the Osmo treatment a single treatment or did you apply anything to the tiles beforehand?

I did some experimentation over the weekend by applying linseed oil to some samples of new 'red' and 'yellow' pamments, to see the colour change, but I'll now order some Osmo Polyx hard wax oil immediately.

Many thanks!

No, the pamments were the originals lifted from the vinery before we dug and insulated. They're mostly "buff salmon" in the vinery and red floor bricks of similar vintage in the kitchen. We pressure washed as they were laid - easy to do when you're moving them from a pallet outside to a brickie to lay on a hot day. There was no other pre-treatment.
I painted a coat on with a 2" or 3" brush. The following day I applied a second coat. Subsequent cleaning has been regular hoovering and the odd mop with Ecover Floor Soap (contains linseed oil).
When I first finished the floor water would ball up if spilled, it's not quite that water repellent now but still resists our spills and drips.

Osmo Polyx is wonderful stuff on wood or ceramic. I was doing some wood floors, noticed it said suitable for ceramic floors so I painted a couple of pamments as a test and really liked the finish.
Apply it quickly and REALLY thin, almost to the point of over brushing. If you put it on too thick the solvent will evaporate and leave it slightly oily, a little goes a very very long way. It dries very fast but I would give each coat a day to go off.

 

[Flyfisher]

We have a hallway and half a room with original pamments, but the ones in question will be brand new.

I'll buy some Osmo Polyx and experiment. Thanks again.

 

[Flyfisher]

Well, I've tried a sample pamment with Osmo Polyx and it seems to be OK. The chap in the shop was surprised to hear I was going to use it on tiles, but the technical notes clearly state it can be used for this.

I also tried it on a piece of oak to check the colouration effect, because previous tests with pure linseed oil caused too much darkening for my taste. The result was excellent, with minimal darkening of the oak.

So it looks like I'll be splashing the stuff over the new floor as well as the new windows and door (not exactly cheap though, is it? :shock: ).

 

[sevenleaf]

Hi all,

I have been reading this old thread great with interest, and am resurrecting it with good reason. I have cleaned up around 1000 'half' pamments and am looking to have them laid onto our new breathable limecrete floor.

The question of what to put on them - to protect from spillages and grime whilst retaining the maximum breathability is what I am now researching.

How are you all getting on with your respective choices - a few years down the line? I sense that whilst the natural choice (pardon the pun) double-boiled / thinned linseed has fallen from favour, no one product has taken the baton...