roof too heavy

[riley]

Hi - am new to this!

Am hoping to complete the purchase of a property circa 1740. It needs plenty of work but husband getting cold feet. There is some bowing to one wall due to the weight of the stone tiling. I'm told this is very common and am getting a structural engineer to look at it. I'm so far advised that either wall ties or (or both?) or reinforcing the beams should be done. To calm the nerves of white knuckled husband - does anyone have an idea of cost. It's in pretty good condition overall but costs prior to purchase are mounting. Conservation planning department are pretty positive but any advice would be gratefully received.

 

[88v8]

Hello and welcome.

Sorry about the delayed reply. New posters get moderated.

As you will doubtless have noticed if you are keen on old properties, tie beams are pretty common, and depending on the layout of the house - whether there is a clear line-of-sight for their insertion - may be the simplest solution.
Otoh, some house were simply underdesigned and the timbers eventually sag and might need some assistance. There have been threads on here along those lines.
Or woodworm or water ingress has been at work and weakened a roof which was perfectly adequate.
The solution may involve various aspects, and could be a matter of a few thousand, or end up with the roof off and the walls partially taken down.
How big is the house? And the wall? Made of?

If indeed there is really anything to solve. The house has stood for 270 years, it's unlikely to fall over tomorrow, and I wouldn't necessarily attach too much weight to a report by an arse-covering surveyor. So the problem may not be a problem, and the cost of rectification may be Nil.
The front wall of our 1620 cottage is bowed several inches in the middle. I'm giving it a good ignoring.

Is your structural engineer someone who specialises in period property? Otherwise you may just end up with another lot of arse-covering. If you post the general location, someone may be able to recommend a specialist period house surveyor.

Pre-purchase costs.. but better than post-purchase shocks, eh, what?

As regards husband, at the risk of statin' the bleedin' obvious, old houses are not like new houses but with added charm. They are not the same to live in. Old houses tend to throw up issues one isn't expecting, and their repair and maintenance is often beyond the skills of a general builder. Indeed, ignorant builders can do a lot of long-term harm and people on here spend considerable time and effort undoing their predecessors' work. If one is practical and prepared to learn and get one's hands dirty, perhaps very dirty, one can deal with the problems and indeed quite enjoy the process.
But if he's not that way inclined and you don't want to become an old house restorer...?
Apologies if you know all this !!

Ivor

 

[malcolm]

Can't add much to Ivor's comments other than suggest linking to some pictures if you can.

Do be wary of surveyors and structural engineers - their advice can be invaluable if you get a good one, but most in my experience aren't all that good. If a structure has been working for 300 years it will only have stopped working if something has changed (rot etc) and the fix would normally be to get the structure back to where it was. Beware of structural engineers who want to add a new structure because they can't be bothered to understand how the old one worked or the old one doesn't tick the boxes in the modern rule book.

 

[MatthewC]

Totally agree with Ivor. Be very wary of any builder who says he knows how to look after old buildings - as Ivor says, there are a lot of ignorant builders out there and you have to find out enough to know whether you can trust the one you happen to find who gives a cheap quote. It's pretty sad really but I reckon 95% of builders either do not understand old buildings or just don't care, and they will do work which actually damages the building, then take your money and run before you find out (which could be the next storm or a few years!).

Going back to your purchase, is the stone tiling original, and is there any clue that the wall might have been bowed for 50 or 200 years? Also, what are your (you and OH) skills and abilities? I'm afraid that on some of these matters you have to make up your own mind, taking into account your own knowledge and the risk you are prepared to accept. I bought my place without any survey, as I could see the issues and reckoned that if they were a real problem then I had the knowledge and financial resources (plus the advice of this forum!) to fix them if they were serious (they weren't ). However, if you have no DIY skills and a large mortgage then perhaps it's a risk you would do well to avoid.

Good luck, and please keep us informed

Matthew

 

[DavidB]

Riley

Do you know when the 'bowing' occurred (like old photos)? I wouldn't worry - don't try and fix it unless it's broke, it's probably been like that since the 1800s. My outside walls are all over the place. I really worried about it at first. But my surveyor said it probably happened relatively early on. If there is some more recent movement then fair enough there might be a problem that needs fixing. We have two tie rods. In our house we have large cross beams upstairs at about waste height. One of them was cut through to make a normal sized doors in a bedroom and the previous owner fitted one tie rod about 40 years ago to restore some structural rigidity due to the cut cross beam. The second tie rod seems to have been fitted to strengthen a damaged beam under a dormer. I suspect the house fell into disrepair and rot set in and then a beam snapped and was repaired. I found a picture showing the dormer around 1911. So its probably been like that since the early 20th century. So if you've had some alterations that have weakened the frame then a tie rod might help. But if the house has not been altered and it's looked like it does for ages then I wouldn't worry.

 

[Penners]

Riley,

I'm afraid your main question is unanswerable with any degree of accuracy - particularly as you haven't told us the construction of the house. Is it timber-frame, stone, brick... or what?

Some photos of the problem, and of the roof structure at that point, would be an immense help in visualising the extent of the problem. Meanwhile, Ivor's thoughts above are about as helpful as it's possible to be.