Restoration company sanding bricks

[Janfranco]

Hi all - I need to have non-breathable paint removed from my Victorian terrace and cement mortar removed to be repointed with lime. Honestly trying to find someone that I trust fully understands what’s needed and doesn’t just want to make the house ‘look nice’ is difficult. The only real option seems to be engaging a listed building specialist who will work mostly by hand but you’re looking at 4x the cost of some already very expensive quotes.

Anyway, there’s a restoration company that’s been around for 20 odd years that charges a premium, has nothing but 5 star ratings, was recommended by a neighbour - but one google review in praise of them clearly states they sanded down some bricks (before and after photos below). Every company of this type seems to be at it; from what I understand it ruins the bricks, so my question is, is everyone going to end up having to rebuild the front of their houses in London in 5 years because these restoration specialists are going round sanding bricks? Should I steer clear?

 

[Toby Newell]

No idea what you are on about. Good tradespeople cost money, for a reason! They are often better value in the long run. If you are in London I already sent a link in a similar thread. I only met them briefly over a few days but I could tell they were very good. Good guys who specialise in period properties are who you want. Cheaper guys will more often cut corners or undertake unsympathetic work.

CJH Brick Restoration | Heritage Brick Restoration Conservation Specialists

CJH Brick Restoration are Heritage Brick Restoration and Conservation Specialists based in Teddington, Richmond Upon Thames which include all types of traditional lime pointing, such as Georgian penny pointing and tuckpointing.

heritage.cjhbrickrestoration.co.uk

Yes, it's true, you can get diddled by BS con merchants who charge a premium but still do shoddy work, but in general, a well regarded trade who has years of experience of and specialises in period properties are normally very good, because the work is a lot harder! You only do it if you love your job. Money is never enough on complicated and difficult jobs.

 

[Toby Newell]

You are best to speak to a specialist. Crappy work is being done every day by carefree builders! A specialist will find a sympathetic and appropriate solution. The Doff and Torc systems are generally regarded as being the gentlest and most efficient cleaning methods. You can't really 'sand' brick, I know, I am a sander.

 

[Janfranco]

Thanks for your info - I’ve looked at the guys you sent over already actually so will be speaking to them. Seems like a lot of ‘restoration specialists’ are still sanding/sandblasting 130 year old brick.

 

[stuart45]

I wouldn't advise you to get London stocks sanded. The kilns were different back then, so the outer surface was harder than inside. Once the surface is gone, the bricks deteriorate much quicker. There are certain types of old bricks, like red rubbers, that are the same right through and can be rubbed down.

 

[Toby Newell]

Thanks for your info - I’ve looked at the guys you sent over already actually so will be speaking to them. Seems like a lot of ‘restoration specialists’ are still sanding/sandblasting 130 year old brick.

'restoration specialists' are just words used by many chancers, proper restorers seldom use sanding or normal sand blasting, they use chemical cleaning, Doff or Torc. Even soda blasting can damage many bricks.

I have worked with thousands of tradesmen over the decades, you get a good feel pretty quickly, the guys I mentioned seemed very honest and very good, so much so that I took their number, fyi I do that only every few years there is such a dearth of quality guys out there. No idea how competitive they are.

 

[Toby Newell]

I wouldn't advise you to get London stocks sanded. The kilns were different back then, so the outer surface was harder than inside. Once the surface is gone, the bricks deteriorate much quicker. There are certain types of old bricks, like red rubbers, that are the same right through and can be rubbed down.

Any sintered ceramic has a stronger 'skin' because it has both open and closed porosity, inside there is more open porosity. I think 'rubbers' were probably fired at lower temps to give a softer product all round.

 

[Janfranco]

'restoration specialists' are just words used by many chancers, proper restorers seldom use sanding or normal sand blasting, they use chemical cleaning, Doff or Torc. Even soda blasting can damage many bricks.

I have worked with thousands of tradesmen over the decades, you get a good feel pretty quickly, the guys I mentioned seemed very honest and very good, so much so that I took their number, fyi I do that only every few years there is such a dearth of quality guys out there. No idea how competitive they are.

I’ll be looking to get some building and decorating work done too actually in the near future so if you have any trusted recommendations who work in London that you’re prepared to send me that would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Toby Newell]

I’ll be looking to get some building and decorating work done too actually in the near future so if you have any trusted recommendations who work in London that you’re prepared to send me that would be greatly appreciated.

Sorry, I don't know any trustworthy builders, what part of London are you? I know a very good decorator, he is based in N11 but doesn't like travelling.

 

[Janfranco]

Fulham - SW6. Might be a bit far

 

[Toby Newell]

Fulham - SW6. Might be a bit far

Well, maybe, he doesn't like crossing the river! None of us North London boys do... I will ask him.

 

[stuart45]

Any sintered ceramic has a stronger 'skin' because it has both open and closed porosity, inside there is more open porosity. I think 'rubbers' were probably fired at lower temps to give a softer product all round.

With rubbers it's more about the preparation of the clay, and grinding it to a fine powder. Modern rubbers can be fired in excess of 1000C, although the older ones were a bit less. They have an open pore structure which can last without issue for centuries, although over time they also develop a very hard surface. Nowadays it's normal for gauged arches to be cut in a factory.
The main problem with the older bricks is the difference in quality due to their position in the old style kilns. With London stocks this really shows when you need to cut one. It's not always the lightly fired ones that suffer. Over fired ones are often cracked.

 

[Toby Newell]

Should I mention LBC Tudors...

 

[stuart45]

Should I mention LBC Tudors...

You should, they're always worth a chat over dinner. These are also worth talking about, but don't mention the war.

 

[Toby Newell]

You should, they're always worth a chat over dinner. These are also worth talking about, but don't mention the war.
View attachment 13250

Nice. German, not Indian I presume.

 

[stuart45]

That's a German brick. There is a row of terraced houses in Yeovil built with the Indian peace version in different coloured bricks in the brickwork.
Known locally as Swastika terrace, it was built long before Adolf came on the scene.