Realising a Vision

[biffvernon]

Will this place be a period property of the future?

Comments to Green Building Forum please (as well as here of course).

PS It's got lime mortar

 

[Penners]

Very interesting. I haven't read it in detail yet, but I'm printing it off to do so.

I note his comment about multi-foil insulation. An 'R' value of only one-third of the manufacturer's claim. That seems to back-up a highly scientific experiment that was carried out on this material, some time ago.

 

[Nemesis]

Well, assuming the world as we know it is still here in say 100 years' time, and the building survives, then probably it will be a period building by then...

 

[Flyfisher]

Some very interesting and pragmatic conclusions regarding 'green' technologies such as organic insulation (sheep wool presumably?), heat pumps, wind turbines, solar voltaics and rainwater harvesting - none of which receive an enthusiastic endorsement. At least those are installed by choice whereas condensing boilers, which were also disparaged, are, as I understand things, now compulsory.

Not entirely the 'feel good' article I was expecting from the title :?

 

[Nemesis]

Not all organic insulation is sheep's wool. I think that small scale wind turbines mounted on buildings are not something which most (apart fronm D Cameron) would consider cost-effective.

Where did the information that condensing boilers are mandatory come from?

 

[Ian Bond]

The house looks great - can I have one please ?

I noted the remarks about the condensing (or High Efficiency) boilers too. Rather worrying, as I need to install some heating - currently have none, and the HE boilers are effectively compulsory.

Already not too keen on the requirements for a condensate drain, and the 'pluming' problems. My neighbours have an almost continuos stream of vapour by their front door - not very welcoming!!!!

 

[Nemesis]

http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/home_improvements/heating_and_hot_water/

Not sure though they are mandatory?

 

[Ian Bond]

I was looking into installing a new CH system a couple of years back, before the new regs came into force.

Unfortunately I was too slow, and my chosen system boiler is now illegal - I would never get permission to fit it, as it does not meet the required efficiency rating.

It was all in here somewhere :roll:
http://www.sedbuk.com/


At the time, I did a lot of reading up, and plumbers were raising the issues of these new condensing boilers being rather inefficient in practice. Plus the corrosion problems, and difficulty of installation. And expense etc.


Still, I've always got plenty of timber off-cuts around, so I'll just have to burn them to keep warm.

 

[Nemesis]

Glad we haven't got gas then!

 

[Ian Bond]

A few years back, when I started looking at all this, the only boilers that met the requirements were condensing, or HE models. Given that I had chosen the 'perfect' boiler for my system, I was gutted. I checked and double checked at the time, and could find no way around the problem.

However....

That may have changed now - maybe some of the manufacturers have developed non-condensing, high efficiency boilers that do the job.

I must admit that with all the other stuff that needed doing, I gave up. The layout of my house makes it difficult enough to install a central heating system, without the extra complexities and problems of the HE boilers. Particularly plumes of condensate with the potential to upset neighbours. Got to consider all these things in a terrace.

 

[Nemesis]

http://www.bhl.co.uk/category/High_Efficiency_Gas_Boilers

Nothing is ever simple, is it?

Are wheelie bins another difficulty? I note our local authority was wittering about giving people three. Not sure where some people would put them.

We refused to have one!

 

[Flyfisher]

Glad we haven't got gas then!

I believe the condensing requirement was extended to oil boilers in April 2007.

It's ironic that recent threads concerning chimney linings for fires have highlighted the importance of insulating the flue so that combustion products don't condense within the flue, thereby leading to corrosion and early failure of the flue, whereas the exact opposite is being dictated by regulations for gas and oil boilers in the name of efficiency.

Yes, I know oil and gas are supposed to burn cleaner than wood or coal but there are still rumblings of corrosion problems with condensing boilers and I can't help but wonder if the boiler industry is expecting a bonanza of major repairs or even replacements to condensing boilers starting in about 5 years time.

I wonder if the savings in fuel will compensate for the reduced lifetime of the boilers?

 

[Nemesis]

Glad we haven't got oil then!

 

[Gareth Hughes]

Will this place be a period property of the future?

Comments to Green Building Forum please (as well as here of course).

PS It's got lime mortar

I'm sure its green credentials are great, and therefore as a technical experiment it may, in future, be seen as important.

But how uninspiring aesthetically - just a slightly-better-than-usual Barratt / Wimpey thing with a big greenhouse tacked on.

I do hope this isn't the future of environmentally responsible architecture.

 

[Nemesis]

It's not a first though is it, many experiments have been carried out, and continue to be so, in building sustainable homes?

http://www.peabody.org.uk/pages/GetPage.aspx?id=179

http://www.bedzedhouse.co.uk/



It may be that this brings together a number of 'cutting-edge' ideas, but until the full details are made available we won't know just how radical/innovative/vibrant - whatever the current buzzwords are - this house is.

 

[Penners]

not too keen on the requirements for a condensate drain, and the 'pluming' problems. My neighbours have an almost continuos stream of vapour by their front door - not very welcoming

My aunt has the same problem. We call it "la plume de ma tante".

 

[GK]

As a non-plumber, I've never really "got" the supposed problems with condensing boilers.

I understand that pluming might be a problem if you can't get the terminal out of the way, but what extra difficulty in installation is there? They have the same number of pipes to them as a standard boiler, plus one. And plus one should be done in push-fit plastic and taken to a nearby drain. Is that really so difficult?

As to longevity, I fitted two of the very earliest Ideal Standard models in my last property, circa 1990, and they were still working fine when we left 12 or so years later.

I fitted another condenser this week and it was, well, not too difficult at all. Quite disappointing really. As I understand it the components that are susceptible to condensate are made from stainless steel.

Paired with a water store that maintains the return temperature in condensing range means I should be getting the quoted efficiency, well, most of the time.

 

[Ian Bond]

Well, it is difficult if there's no handy drain, and you are therefore more limited with siting the boiler. Already tricky in cramped terraced houses with awkward layouts. And it's another hole in the wall, so more damage.

I suppose you get what you pay for - perhaps cheaper boilers with less robust components fail early?

 

[Ian Bond]

not too keen on the requirements for a condensate drain, and the 'pluming' problems. My neighbours have an almost continuos stream of vapour by their front door - not very welcoming

My aunt has the same problem. We call it "la plume de ma tante".

Doh!

:lol: