Rats in wattle & daub wall

[Me!]

Snap traps, glue traps, poison grain, poison blocks, … who has had good results with one of these please when trying to get a rat that is somewhere in a wattle and daub wall? I was kept awake for most of last night listening to a rat eating its way through our house, so I’m hoping for a quick but extremely inhumane way of getting rid of it please! The last couple of times we have had rats in the house, I have used snap traps baited with chocolate raisins. These did the job fine, but took several days before the rats trusted the traps enough to eat from them and I really don’t want to wait that long.

I was thinking of trying poison this time, but there are 401 results for rat poison on eBay, and every different type claims to be better than all the others, so any suggestions for ones that definitely work would be much appreciated please.

Or, if poison is not the best option, then all other suggestions are welcome. They can’t be any more wacky than my sleep-deprived ramblings which have already considered smoke-bombs, guns, napalm and even nuclear radiation* as possibilities.

Help please!

* I actually also thought this might have possibilities for killing deathwatch beetles that are buried deep in oak beams, but that is another problem for another day

 

[Keithj]

The problem with poison is that they crawl into an inaccessible corner and die. You then have the pleasure of a distinctive odour for months to come. Food in a trap near the entrance is the only way I'd use.

 

[MdB]

It took something like 3 to 4 weeks for our rat to nibble our snap trap and receive a quick bash over the head. Rats are very suspicious of anything new so won't touch a new trap for a while.

We had poison down too (supplied via the council) - none of it was touched.

It is not a process I would like to repeat - It was a month of hell and I fully understand where you are coming from.

 

[Flyfisher]

The last couple of times we have had rats in the house, I have used snap traps baited with chocolate raisins. These did the job fine, but took several days before the rats trusted the traps enough to eat from them and I really don’t want to wait that long.

I'd suggest that the answer is contained in your earlier post - set those same traps and start the 'several days' clock running while you seek (probably in vain) a quicker solution.

 

[Me!]

I've just set three traps as close as I can get them, and started the waiting

 

[skier-hughes]

As has been said rats are very wary, so poison will be a while before they eat it, then it takes a short while to work. Most good poisons mumify in some way so you don't get the smell of decomposing rat.
I've got traps and poison down, using neosorexa gold, and am awaiting results.
Some poison has been taken, but I removed the chicken corn from the fuel store which appeared to be their food source.
Jo is coming round to the idea of a new cat, as we haven't had any trouble in the previous 7 years whilst we had the last two cats.

 

[Me!]

We do have two cats. One is completely useless, but the other does catch rats. However, this one being inside a wall has stumped her.
One thing that worried me about poison though, is would a cat eat a poisoned rat, and what would happen if it did?

 

[Flyfisher]

I've always thought that the best mousers are well-fed cats because not being hungry does little to curb their hunting instincts but is does mean they are less likely to eat what they kill.

As for the wariness of rats, is it an old wive's tale that when rats discover a new type of food they will only eat a tiny bit at first and if they become ill they will never eat touch the same thing again? I'm not sure where Ive heard that but it was a long time ago. Also, I believe rats cannot regurgitate if they do become ill, hence their wariness. Anyway, true or not, they are certainly highly adaptable and quite inspiring in a way . . . as long as they're not indoors!

 

[Penners]

There is almost always far more than just one rat. They breed prolifically, and the parents are often hunting for food to take back to the nest. So if you leave out loose poison, you may kill the rat(s) that has(ve) been eating it in situ, but there will invariably be more of them waiting back at home.

I reckon Townex sachets are an excellent idea. They consist of poisoned bait enclosed in a rat-portable polythene sachet. So instead of munching the bait at the point where you've laid it, the rat takes it home to feed the family. And rats will stockpile food in the nest, against a possible future shortage. So, with a bit of luck, you wipe out the entire infestation.

I've been laying Townex sachets in an outhouse where I found rat droppings. I have put down three of four sachets a day for about the last three weeks, and every one of them has completely disappeared within hours (sometimes in less than an hour). However, today they haven't been taken. The Townex instructions say that you must keep replenishing until the bait remains untouched and that this usually takes about three weeks, so it looks as though I'm bang on target.

I have so far found one carcase outside, but I'm hoping that there will be more in the nest (wherever it may be).

You do of course run the risk of death occurring inside the house, in which case you will - as Keith said above - suffer a pretty awful smell for a week or two, while decomposition takes place. But the rat's nest may not be in the house - it may be under a nearby shed, in the bank of a ditch or somewhere else outdoors.

http://www.townex.co.uk/artists.php

 

[skier-hughes]

Not sure, but I read a fact sheet, which I can't find, which just said they are wary of new things for a while.

 

[Feltwell]

Penner's Townex sounds like a good idea to me. On the one occasion I had the lovely job of clearing out a rat's nest it was full of plastic from where they had been scavenging food (from bins presumably) and dragging it back - bread bags, crisp packets, sandwich wrappers, allsorts.

I've only ever seen 1 rat whilst at this house, and that was in one of our very grotty, and now demolished, garages. Our neighbour disturbed quite a few when clearing the manky outhouses in his garden, they were under the (mostly rotten) wooden floors - which he has now concreted, so hopefully no more rats for him or us.

 

[Pford75]

If possible, where gloves when handling bait/traps. Rats will detect the smell of humans and steer clear.

Have you considered an ultrasonic emitter to get them out of the wall?

 

[Penners]

Not sure, but I read a fact sheet, which I can't find, which just said they are wary of new things for a while.

My first Townex sachets disappeared within a couple of hours!

 

[Penners]

Have you considered an ultrasonic emitter to get them out of the wall?

I'm interested to know whether anyone has first-hand experience that those things actually work. I confess that I'm sceptical.

 

[JoceAndChris]

I agree with pretty much everything that's been said in this thread - never assume you have one rat! They live in large social groups and breed prolifically. They're so shy you may only see one, but it's the tip of the ratburg!

I have tried ultrasonic emitters which are said to make the rat want to go away - waste of time. We had it rigged on an extension lead in the chicken shed for a few months whilst the rats made merry underneath.

I agree the sachets are an excellent and safe way of exterminating them. We spent £50 on a large tub of Neosorexa Gold sachets and I put them down all the time.

I'll never exterminate every rat, but this definitely keeps the population right down, and I do go for weeks sometimes without seeing one.

My little tiny chicken ate a small bit of Neo Gold and survived. I think a cat would have to be very very hungry to eat a poisoned rat, and they really do prefer to die in private anyway.

If your pet gets sick and you suspect poisoning there are antidotes but yes, pets do occasionally die from this. However, what other options are there? They very quickly wise up to traps - in my experience all it takes is seeing one of their brethren dead on a trap and they never go near again.

There's another kind of poison - a dust - that sticks to the fur and kills them when they lick themselves. This is used in cases where rats have learned that sachets of Neo Gold lead to death. I had to use this in spring, but my autumn rats this year seem to have forgotten that sachets are bad.

It's my own fault I have rats, I'm feeding around 50-100 birds ( 30 chickens and then the wild birds), and I don't religiously remove every grain of corn, so the problem just goes on and on.

Make sure any feed is cleared - things like fallen apples and berries too.

 

[Penners]

An excellent digest of alternatives, Joce.

On the subject of poison and its danger to pets, wildlife, etc. I was told by our nearby agricultural supplies blokey, from whom I bought the Townex, that vermin poisons are nowadays required to incorporate an additive that induces vomiting. So if your dog, cat, etc. eats the stuff it will immediately vomit it back up.

The reason that rats don't also do this is that they have no vomit reflex. Once a rat has eaten something, it stays eaten.

However, it is still wise to be quite careful about finding and getting rid of the carcases of poisoned rats. I don't think the upchuck additive works 'second-hand', so to speak.

 

[Matt Green]

Not sure, but I read a fact sheet, which I can't find, which just said they are wary of new things for a while.

It's termed neophobia and it's really just selection pressure in action. Those rats that don't have a genetic desire to taste new things live long enough to pass those genes to the next generation of rats and those rats breed until the population is composed entirely of individuals that do not readily taste new things they find. In a similar vein beaver populations used to be diurnal until trappers caught all except those that were more active at dusk/night and now the population is generally nocturnal.

Anything eating a poisoned rat would taste a bittering agent, but rat baits work by weight, so a cat would need to eat substantially more than a rat from a primary source and many, many poisoned rats to get anything like a 50% lethal dose.

M.

 

[Penners]

Thanks for that clarification, Matt.

 

[Me!]

Thank you everyone for the suggestions.
I wasn't aware of the idea of sachets that the rats take to their nest, they certainly sound like the perfect thing to try in our sheds where we seem to have loads of rats this year. Maybe it has been a good year for them because we have had so much fruit fallen from the trees in recent months.

Oh well, the sun is over the yard-arm, and maybe a few pints of Adnams will help me sleep through the sounds of my house being eaten tonight!

 

[Jellyfire]

We've got what I think are squirrels, but may be rats in our thatch loft space. I certainly sympathise with them keeping you up at night. It sounds like a small festival is going on up there most nights. Unfortunately Im not able to get in there to block off any routes in, the loft entrance is too small for an adult (and as our little one has only just mastered crawling I can't really explain to him whats expected if I put him up there.)

The thought of them chewing into the electrics and setting the thatch ablaze terrifies me, so Ive tried rat poison, which they have eaten tons of but doesn't seem to have adversely affected them, and Ive had humane squirrel traps (mainly because there don't seem to be any inhumane ones available!) up there for about 4 weeks now, but they don't seem to have been near them as yet. The sachets sound worth a try though, so that will be the next plan I think!