Papering over new lime plaster

[YZ2ZY]

We own a 200 year-old sandstone built house. It was an old rectory which was rebuilt (200 years ago) to be pretty lavish in the old gothic revival style. There's been some bodged fixes over the years which we're gradually rectifying. The current project involves getting rid of a large dry rot infestation by stripping the walls back to the stone in the main drawing room and main bedroom above, repairing/replacing the infected timber windows and replacing the lead gutters correctly.

We've just had the walls replastered using traditional lime plaster (and goat's hair). They've now been skimmed and the surface is not quite as smooth as we expected. It has a very fine powdery grain to it. When our builder questioned the supplier of the plaster for the skim, he was told it wasn't the absolutely top grade available as that was only used for places like windsor castle and buckingham palace etc... (That one includes a lot of finely ground marble and is very expensive). Our plasterers have been fantastic, but they're away for a couple of weeks and I'm trying to understand the options)

All the rest of the house has been decorated using painted lining paper. But we're yet to see if there's any dry rot in those rooms.

My question today is: is there any way of getting the plaster super smooth without reskimming with the super-deluxe skim? Is it ok to put lining paper over the top or will that stop the walls from breathing?

Thanks.

 

[88v8]

Hello and welcome.

Georgian gothic, envy envy.

Two coat plaster? First coat with hair, second without?
Can't be smoothed? Piffle. Lime plaster needs more work then gypsum. Wetting, with a mister, working, more misting, smoothing, more misting, polishing, more misting, etc. I watched a plasterer on an umble cottage renovation job last summer, we were out for a walk, he was misting polishing the lime plaster, when we returned an hour later he was still misting polishing the same bit of wall and it was 'orrible smooth. My beef with lime plaster is that it can end up so slick it looks like gypsum.

Anyway, you are where you are.
Presumably the aim is to paper with some suitably gothic wallpapers.
Upstairs, I would have no concerns. Once the walls have dried out - around one month per inch thickness - paper away. Lining paper, then top paper.

Downstairs, I would wonder how dry the walls are and will be. No dpc of course.
The sizing, lining paper, sizing and top paper, will not prevent the wall from breathing, but wallpaper does not like damp. I would be concerned that it will stain, then come adrift.

Downstairs, try papering, in some unobtrusive corners, see how it goes for a year or three before you embark on a £100/roll finishing process. Meanwhile, clay paint will improve the wall texture as it is quite full-bodied, and breathable and a lot less faff than limewash.

Ivor

 

[Kearn]

Downstairs, try papering, in some unobtrusive corners, see how it goes for a year or three before you embark on a £100/roll finishing process. Meanwhile, clay paint will improve the wall texture as it is quite full-bodied, and breathable and a lot less faff than limewash.

Plus one for clay paints - Earthborn paints helped mask a few of my initial forays into lime plaster repairs in our bathroom, when my smoothing and polishing technique was less than great!! It also responds wonderfully to being splashed - looks wet for a short while, then just dries out with no visible remnant of where you the mark was... Super easy to paint on, water based so easy to clean up, a joy to work with really. Even smells bearable! Plus the matt finish masks any imperfections by bouncing less light around so the walls look flatter than they may be, a flattering paint if you will!

Personally I'm not one to understand papering, seems like a lot of hard work and cost to hide lime plaster - I know many love it and that's just my personal preference, I actually love the finish and texture of the lime - I'd agree with Ivor, there is only so smooth a finish that I would be looking for, a little texture is nice and tactile.

Good luck!

 

[Kearn]

My question today is: is there any way of getting the plaster super smooth without reskimming with the super-deluxe skim?

the first Q of your two - I would respond with a question: when you say 'just had' how recently are we talking? Lime plaster maintains great workability over a much longer period than you would think, as long as the temperature is right for carbonating at the correct speed. It's an odd time of year to be lime plastering, but if you don't use the room in question, then I suppose you can maintain an appropriate lower than household temperature to prevent drying out and cracking. If the house is too warm, then the plaster should be being sprayed anyway to add moisture. It may be possible to still continue the smoothing and polishing process as the carbonation occurs. Lime can have days to weeks to be worked once skimmed depending on various factors.

 

[YZ2ZY]

Thanks for your replies.

Yes, 2 coat plaster. Top coat has no hair. They put the last coat upstairs about 3 weeks ago. Worked a 13 hour day because it was taking a long time to set. They haven't been back yet, so I don't know what the next steps are. I maybe premature in my concerns.

We don't intend to finish with wallpaper. I was only thinking about lining because my experience is of of typical brick built houses with plaster in a poor state and you remedied by using lining paper. This whole period property thing is a very new experience for me.

I know what you mean about the timing. We started this project in July, just intending to free up and restore some shutters. The dry rot we discovered turned the whole thing into a bit of a nightmare. Luckily the house is big enough that we've been able to move out of the front 2 rooms and keep them cool and separate. We even took the floor/ceiling out as it had been so badly repaired 30 or 40 years ago. We've also had to wait on listed building consent before being able to progress with some of the fixes. Anyway, the plaster is certainly not dry yet.

I like the idea of clay paints. We just had the cellar limewashed, and what a faff that was. I've been reading up about clay paints and that definitely seems the way to go. Thanks. Interesting what you say about the final texture. I was coming round to the idea that you might not expect it to be mirror-like smooth. I just want it to be right, but I'm not sure what "right" is.

Thank-you very much for your advice. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions as the work progresses. If you're interested, you can see the history of the property at whittontower dot com

 

[Flyfisher]

Plus one for clay paints - Earthborn paints helped mask a few of my initial forays into lime plaster repairs in our bathroom, when my smoothing and polishing technique was less than great!! It also responds wonderfully to being splashed - looks wet for a short while, then just dries out with no visible remnant of where you the mark was... Super easy to paint on, water based so easy to clean up, a joy to work with really. Even smells bearable! Plus the matt finish masks any imperfections by bouncing less light around so the walls look flatter than they may be, a flattering paint if you will!

Plus two for clay paints.

Having previously used casein distemper on lime plastered walls (and very successfully too) I used Earthborn clay paint for the first time last year and agree with all those points; it's very easy to use and gives a lovely flat finish. Flattering indeed and I'm a definite convert.

As for the smoothness of lime plaster, while I'm sure a mirror-like finish can be achieved (not by me though!), any subsequent painting will likely add a slight texture to the surface finish depending on the type of roller used. This texture will only usually be noticeable when viewed close up, in much the same way that a slight texture to the actual plaster surface may only be visible in close up. I appreciate this could be an excuse for not bothering to achieve a mirror-like finish in the first place (or not, depending on personal preferences) but it's worth considering. If the plaster finish really is heavily textured then papering will certainly give a smoother finish (and I've also done this myself), but it is a great deal more work. It's all a matter of degree and preference really.

 

[plasticpigeon]

Your house sounds lovely.

I've used clay paint on lime too and it seems to work, it just needs to be thinnned a bit as it is very thick. It will hide a rough surface, but not scars or undulations.

I would question whether you need to have plaster removed due to dry rot. Removal was the trend many years ago, but I think it was a bit of a fraud that damp people started to exploit. A lady who owns a huge house near me that she is unfortunately turning into flats must have spent 10 of thousands removing woodwork and plaster even though it was nowhere near any rot. If the source of damp that allowed the dry rot to occur is removed, then the rot will also go away. That is a much more conservative way of dealing with things, much less mess, no chemicals, no destruction, so please don't do any unnecessary stripping back!

 

[Pennyviz]

Top coat plaster could have been ecomortar as that gives a sand grain finish in my experience (or lack of it),

penny

 

[YZ2ZY]

I would question whether you need to have plaster removed due to dry rot.

We may have gone over the top with repairs and renovation but we know there was quite extensive dry rot treatment 30 years ago and the problem has come back. Some of the joists sporting the ceiling/upstairs floor were rotted through. Large areas of the plaster were actually cement render, which simply exacerbated the problem by reducing the breathability of the walls. In the end it was simpler to rip it all off and do it properly.

On the plus side, we found a bricked up chimney in the bedroom which we are re-instating as well as a bricked up alcove/shelves/edinburgh press.

I am looking forward to it all being finished. It's been 6 months so far which really is long enough for me.

 

[skier-hughes]

I am looking forward to it all being finished. It's been 6 months so far which really is long enough for me.

I wouldn't last long with you then, I'm on year 14 in two months time!!!

 

[YZ2ZY]

I am looking forward to it all being finished. It's been 6 months so far which really is long enough for me.

I wouldn't last long with you then, I'm on year 14 in two months time!!!

WOW. I couldn't deal with that. Our neighbours at the bottom of the drive bought their house 10 years ago and are still doing it up. He's a retired builder in his eighties and doing all the work himself. It worries me sometimes when I see him up on the roof with his 85 year-old wife passing stuff up to him.

I don't have that dedication, I'm afraid.