Old doors & Fire regulations

[MattW]

Many of the original doors in the grade II Georgian terraced house I am renovating have been thickened with ply or some sort of fibreboard, presumably to ensured they met fire regulations for door thickness. Obviously the conservation officer and I both want to put the doors back to how they ought to be but presumably we still have to meet building regulations. I was wondering whether anyone on here has had any experience in dealing with the council building control officer in this type of situation?

I have read that there are a number of possible solutions - any comments would be welcome!:

1. Paint doors with intumescent paint e.g. http://www.thermoguarduk.com/fireproofpaint.html - has anyone actually used this stuff? does it have a paint finish like normal gloss paint?

2. Split the door panels and insert a metal sheet between the two halves - this seems like it should be be very difficult to do, and presumably risks destroying the door if it goes wrong. Has anyone tried doing this?

3. Install an integrated firealarm system so that an alarm set off in one room causes all of them to ring. Is this sufficient to meet building regs?

Are there any other possible solutions?

Matt

 

[MdB]

Very much not an expert on this but a standard house doesn't require fire doors so fire doors will only be required if there some feature of the house which rates it as more dangerous than normal.

Example 1, the works new office building required fire doors on all office doors as it didn't have two routes of escape from upstairs.

Example 2, our house revamp removed the walls either side of the staircase meaning that there wasn't a safe route out for people upstairs if there was a fire in the lounge. For that, we had to fit escape hinges to the windows upstairs to allow a second route of escape. A mains linked fire alarm was also required. Fire doors were not required.

If you have large windows (450mm x 600mm if I remember correctly - there are lots of detailed requirements on this so read up) then this will probably be ok for a means of escape and fire doors won't be needed. If you have smaller windows then you may have a problem.

Having said all of that, adding modern plywood / hardboard to horrible old fashioned doors to make them look more fashionable was a craze in the 1960s(?) and it could well be that it wasn't done for fire issues at all.

 

[kmcarth]

You have never mentioned if your property is 3 story or not if not why the need for fire doors in a domestic situation

In Scotland all 3 storey domestic houses require 1/2 hr fire doors with self closers to all habitable rooms that access onto the stair well. No harm asking BC what they would accept.

I would ask them if they would accept an alternative approach, instmescent paint / varnish and hard wired smoke detection with battery back up, maybe adding smoke seals to the doors.

Work in BC North of the border

 

[worms]

I would ask them if they would accept an alternative approach....

Work in BC North of the border

Why ask at all? Surely removing what is possibly a decorative addition from some internal doors is simply changing the decor and not a change requiring BC approval?

 

[MattW]

Why ask at all?

That is definitely going to be my first approach. Given I am not doing a loft conversion or extension (and hence change of use etc), I am not convinced that I need to bring the doors up to fire regulations, even if I am doing a lot of work elsewhere that will be up to modern standards (e.g. insulation in floor or loft). The reason I asked though was to prepare my fall back position in the event that they are insistent.

 

[kmcarth]

If the work involved does not require a Building Warrant then they cannot insist, and you could argue that its an existing situation and no more onerous

 

[MattW]

Well it seems that they cannot insist on me changing existing doors, which is obviously good news but any replacement doors have to be up to fire regs, which of course means they won't match. Hmm.

 

[MdB]

Out of interest, what reason was given for the doors needing to meet fire regs?

 

[Penners]

I've used intumescent paint in the past, on exhibition stands. I'm pretty sure you can get it in a gloss finish.

Or you could paint the door normally, then apply a clear, gloss, intumescent varnish over the top: http://www.thermoguarduk.com/fire-varnish.html

 

[ljn]

I have just had a fire inspector look at my house to help me with a fire risk assessment.
I want to be able to have paying guests in some rooms, so I need a protected escape route down the stairway. If there were no paying guests in the equation, Building Control would be happy with non-fire doors where existing as the building is listed.

The previous owner needed fire doors because he used the rooms as bedsits. He said he had used intumescent paint. The problem with that is you can't prove it, even if you have a receipt and an empty can, so building inspectors don't like it. Even if you have used it, it can be invalidated if other paint is applied on top.

He mentioned a listed building where they had sawn the doors down the centre and put a fire barrier in the middle and glued them back together.

And a company called fire-tech http://www.fire-tech.co.uk/ they apply a coating and give a certificate. It is more like a film/than a paint, apparently. Contacting them is on my to-do list.

If you need to out in new doors, you could get a fire door and then apply panelling on top to blend in with the existing doors.

 

[Gareth Hughes]

The origianl poster may find this useful

http://www.firesafe.org.uk/html/fsequip/firedoor.htm

English Heritage, 10 years or more ago, did produce guidance on "timber panelled doors and fire", but though I've found links to it on the net, I haven't yet found a version that does cause my computer to have a fit.

Edit: thanks to Ev, here's it is:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/17841436/EH5-Timber-Doors-and-Fire

 

[ljn]

A rep from Fire-Tech came round.
He is giving me a quote to paint the inside only of my doors. I also have the option of getting the paint from them and they will come and check the job and, if OK, issue a 30 min certificate and sticker for the door. They can mix any BS colour.
They also do a paper coating that can fireproof lath and plaster ceilings to give over 1 hour protection. He is going to send me a pack on listed building options.