Making an offer on a derelict building.

[Griffen]

How do you go about putting a price on a large semi- derelict convent building of some 12,000 sq m.built in 1875 ?

It is not listed & is in the countryside. It is on a 2 acre site ..one acre of which is landlocked & not really suitable for building on anyway because of the slope. Next door are the primary & secondary schools.
(Current site prices are about 60,000 for an acre & there are plenty on the market unsold in nicer spots.)

Do you offer site value & throw a bit for the building? We estimate it is going to take about 300000 to restore .We aim to live there & rent out some of the larger rooms as meeting rooms.

 

[dalivar]

I've no idea, but you can give them a silly offer and see if they say no?! That's the worst that can happen.
I would check to see if there has been any planning permission refused (local council website - planning area), there may be a reason why its not been bought already.

 

[angrybird]

I would make sure to do a check if you can get PP in some cases if a building has 'abandonment' on it it is unlikely you will ever get planning permission

(speaking from experience )

 

[Flyfisher]

Offer whatever it's worth to you.

 

[Griffen]

Thanks everyone. Went to view on Wednesday & it had gone to far to be rescued really at least by us. Very sad.

 

[AMc]

As a ready reckoner I was told to work on £1200-1500m2 for renovation of a derelict residential property.
In practice worked out to be more or less spot on at the top end with what we spent. That included rewiring, heating, reroof, bathrooms.

If you're serious about 12,000m2 then I can't see £300,000 coming close. Even if that's square feet (1114.8m²) you're still looking at £270 per m2 which seems very optimistic?

Given the cost or renovation is generally more than new build, a commercial developer would look at the property as a problem that detracts from the site - demolition is expensive.

As Flyfisher says offer what it's worth to you but I would get some advice on likely costs before you start. We estimated £60K for our project and spent about £200K

 

[Lime]

(Current site prices are about 60,000 for an acre & there are plenty on the market unsold in nicer spots.)

These must be agricultural values surely?
Even in the back of beyond here in the Fens building land is worth a fortune, to the tune of over £100,000 for a tiny plot.

 

[Griffen]

As I said the building was too big a project even if one took it one wing at a time @ 300,00. Thanks AMc for that guide price. Was that for builders doing most of the work ?

 

[MatthewC]

I spent abut £65k on the original house here which was not quite derelict but pretty awful; I think it's about 125m2, so that makes £520/m2, with me project managing various contractors and doing what I could myself. It didn't need a new roof structure (just new covering/slating/lead) but otherwise everything that AMc said. Had it needed new roof structure, windows and floors I can see how it would have got to £1000/m2 quite easily. If I had wanted to economise I could have cut corners and saved a few £000 but that wasn't the plan.

 

[AMc]

The ready reckoner numbers came from builder friends and were backed up by the guidance in Homebuilding & Renovating magazine. If you're serious then I would go and buy a few of the self build magazines.
There are obviously risks with only partly renovating a property - especially if you intend to open parts of it up for hire. Old buildings have a nasty habit of hiding very expensive problems. Mine hid a rotten roof for a glass vinery that meant instead of reglazing I had to rebuild from the ground up and a well in the middle of the kitchen that "only" cost £1500 to turn into a feature If you read the "projects" in the magazines you'll see behind the glossy pictures and smiles there can be a hell of a lot of hard work, heart ache and financial distress.

I used a local set of builders but ran the project myself as a full time job. I had no previous building experience and I would now almost certainly go for a fixed price, negotiated tender for a first project. I worked with the subcontractors directly and did a lot of labouring and sourcing myself. I had to penny pinch in a lot of places, not usually at the expense of the final result but in terms of reducing waste, reusing materials and expending my time instead of money to get things done cheaply. I also ended up doing the last 9-12 months solo and part time because we ran out of money and the building society weren't prepared to advance any more money.

If you're serious then I would contact a local builder with some period property experience and ask them to walk around the site and give you a suggestion of likely costs. Even if you don't go any further with them they will open your eyes to potential problems.
You also need to look at the tax implications - you pay 20% VAT on renovations but 0% on new building. If you intend to run the place as a business you may find it makes sense to begin with the business as this may allow you reduce the amount you pay the government.

I wouldn't want to put you off rescuing a derelict building but go in with your eyes wide open, it is a financial and emotional rollercoaster!

 

[Sonyaclegg]

If the building has been empty for more then 10 years and its being renovated, contractors can apply 5% vat which you claim back at end of project in addition to 20 vat on fixtures/ fittings. Look up DIY building scheme