Interesting Wall and Rotten Wood!

[JohnB]

The gypsum plaster skim on part of the room I'm working on was loose, so I ended up removing it, then the half inch of softish cement, then the rock hard almost pure cement, to find out what's underneath, and found this:

The vertical line was clearly on old window opening, and still has its lime plaster, tiny traces of red limewash, and a few bits of wallpaper. It's been filled in quite roughly with cement mortar, while the rest of the wall has earth mortar with lime pointing. For a mid 19th century house, it appears to have been a big window. The house is shown on the local woollen industry information boards as having had a hand loom workshop, so I'm wondering if this is where the loom was. The house is listed in the 1891 census as one house, but in later years was two, so I'm thinking this part may have been built as a workshop, and was converted to a house when the residents gave up the weaving.

As you can see, there is part of a timber lintel, and the top of the current window is higher. The beams have been stepped, and sit on a concrete lintel resting on the original lintel. Here's a close up, showing where the lintel was cut. There appears to be traces of old wallpaper on the underside of the lintel, so presumably it was originally exposed.

Here's a view of the end of it, showing the rot! Even with my poor sense of smell, I noticed it as soon as it was uncovered. The beam that rests on it is also rotting at the end, and the next beam along (in the corner of the room) that rests on stone, is also rotting at the end.

Any suggestions what I should/could do? I could do with a safe but short term fix for a year or two, as I don't want to deal with all the walls in the room at the moment.

 

[Flyfisher]

It's amazing what can be found when plaster is stripped from a wall. We've done similar and found all sorts of window/door alterations that we knew nothing about. We also found bits of wood within the wall but, fortunately, they were all in perfect condition so we left them in place.

If wood is rotting then it must be damp, so I'd want to investigate why. The cement wall covering clearly won't have helped any damp dry out but it must have come from somewhere and, I'd guess, not from the ground judging from the height of the problem. Are the usual suspects of gutters and downpipes all in good condition? Is there any interior pipework upstairs that could be leaking, or even just slowly dripping? Radiator pipes perhaps?

A safe short-term fix would be to simply support the floor joists with a couple of scaffold boards and acro-props - but the acceptibility of that will depend on whether you're trying to live in the room or just mothball it for a year or two while sorting it all out.

Removing the embedded rotting wood should be simple enough (with the floor joists supported of course) and then replace with brick, but the rotting joist-ends will obviously be a bigger job.

If time permits, my inclination would be to just prop-up the joists and let things thoroughly dry out now that the cement has been removed. Meanwhile, investigate the source of damp. When everything is dry, re-assess the damage to the wood (it may only be a few mm deep) to determine if the joist-ends still have enough strength in them to be safe.

 

[Penners]

If time permits, my inclination would be to just prop-up the joists and let things thoroughly dry out now that the cement has been removed. Meanwhile, investigate the source of damp. When everything is dry, re-assess the damage to the wood (it may only be a few mm deep) to determine if the joist-ends still have enough strength in them to be safe.

I quite agree with FF's views. In addition, I think I would be investigating the possibility that the damp that has caused the rot is the result of water penetration from outside. The stonework around that area looks pretty roughly built and imperfectly mortared. I wonder what it's like on the outside.

If propping up the joists is unacceptable to you for the medium term, or if you want to carry out a more permanent repair now (on the immutable principle that temporary fixes tend to turn into long-term solutions!) then you might consider bolting new beam-ends (or, indeed, complete secondary joists) on to the sides of the rot-affected joists. These can be tenoned into the wall-plate or suspended in joist hangers. Be sure to use oak or - if you use softwood - make sure it's pressure-treated. And if you use end pieces only, make sure that they extend into the room well past the rotted areas and are very securely bolted to good wood in the old joists.

One other alternative: if the rot is confined just to the very ends of the joists that are embedded into the wall, then you could consider mounting a horizontal support beam along the wall, for the joists to rest on. But I do emphasise that this solution is only practicable if the joists are sound virtually right up to the face of the wall. You would also need to ensure that you can mount the support beam very securely on what looks like fairly friable masonry.

 

[Lime]

What is holding up the floor joists above the present window?

added

The beams have been stepped, and sit on a concrete lintel resting on the original lintel

That isn't a good idea.

 

[Keithj]

It sounds like an acroprop may be a useful thing to borrow while you investigate more closely.

 

[JohnB]

I've been busy making lots of noise and dust removing lots more plaster, or rather some plaster and lots of cement! I should get the last bit off tomorrow, and then I'll know how widespread the problem is. So far it looks like it's confined to that one corner.

I've found lots of interesting botched jobs where windows have been moved and a doorway blocked up. And as for the fireplace, don't ask!

Hopefully there will be a lime washing and plastering workshop by someone who knows what they're doing next week, if anyone in West Wales is interested.

 

[88v8]

Brownstone Construction - based in Abergavenny but will travel - specialise in limework, including lime plastering, and I recommend them.
They'll turn up when they say they will, do what they say they'll do, and won't overcharge you. No connection, except as a customer.

Alan Davies 0796 663 4494

Ivor

 

[Penners]

They'll turn up when they say they will, do what they say they'll do, and won't overcharge you.

They can't possibly be builders - there must be a catch! :wink:

 

[JohnB]

Brownstone Construction - based in Abergavenny but will travel - specialise in limework, including lime plastering, and I recommend them.
They'll turn up when they say they will, do what they say they'll do, and won't overcharge you. No connection, except as a customer.

Alan Davies 0796 663 4494

Ivor

Pay someone??? Shock, horror :shock: :shock: :shock:. I don't want a boring perfect finish. I had one of those, even if the wall underneath was wet, and it needed to come off.

My cheap SDS drill that arrived on Monday, broke today, so I can have a rest from cement removal! Very nice tough drill, but with a feeble switch :roll:.

 

[skier-hughes]

I broke my father in laws cheap sds drill, I bought a blue (professional) bosch one, been excellent.

 

[Penners]

I found my SDS drill in a "reduced" bin at BeeanKoo, around five years ago. It cost me about £15. I've lost track of the number big holes it's drilled through masonry walls (many of them 110mm dia for soil pipes, extractor fans and so on). It's still going strong. The eight-piece set of core drills cost me £19.95.

Bargain kit!

 

[JohnB]

I'm replacing it with the same model, but if that one fails I suppose I'll have to save up my pennies, as this is only the first room that needs doing, and then there's the outside render!