Insulating outside taps

[skier-hughes]

Has anyone succesfully insualted an outside tap so that it doesn't freeze and continues to produce nicely chilled flowing water? We are currently getting lows of -7.5 overnight according to my greenhouse thermometer.

I have a few taps in the paddock, coming out of the ground.
The pipe has hessian type insulation underground and overground.
Overground it is then covered in the foam pipe wrap and then covered in the hessian wrap again.
Pipe is now about 6" in dia. :roll: Well about 3" anyway.

I wrapped the hessian wround the tap head. Fixed with cable ties.

Problem is the tap head freezes up and can't be opened even if the water in the pipe isn't frozen.


A bit of searching I came up with this

http://www.martleyelectronics.co.uk/homegarden.htm#tap

Anyone tried one?
£8 seems a bit of a rip off, so may try to insulate more myself.
Anyone used or seen anything similar?

I really need two of the taps working for the caravanners, one for drinking and one for cleaning the waste away.

Graham

 

[Pford75]

Graham,

We used to have a similar problem with taps in our paddock. I built a rudimentary timber box which surrounds the standpipe (nothing fancy given my woodworking skills). The tap protrudes from this and during cold weather we do 2 things:

1. We shut off the tap from a simple stopcock indoors

2. We have a block of polystyrene left over from TV packaging...this was rammed onto the tap, making a nice tap-shaped hole...and although it looks a little strange, it doesn't seem to freeze. (it's quite a big block though apx. 2ft sq.)

 

[skier-hughes]

I was just thinking about making a wooden surround and filling it with the polystyrene chips left over from packaging, hoping the air would insulate the tap head, but I have some foam I could possibly use for that.
Access would be via a hinged lid.

More to think on, ta.

 

[chuckey]

Both my outside taps which are remote from the house have a stopcock underground in the 20mm polypropolene pipe. The cocks were enclosed by a bit of 6" diam plastic pipe with a pair of deep notches cut out so it sits nicely on the pipe. The holes ( to my shame) are covered one, by a ali pot lid found in the garden, the other by an inverted plastic flower pot. I really should make a proper foam insert and some posher covers some day. When I want water, I turn the stopcock on, problem is remembering to turn it off at close of play.
Frank

 

[Edwardia]

We have a block of polystyrene left over from TV packaging...this was rammed onto the tap, making a nice tap-shaped hole...and although it looks a little strange, it doesn't seem to freeze. (it's quite a big block though apx. 2ft sq.)

We managed to buy a similar plastic-covered foam/polystyrene cover, might have been from Robinsons Country Leisure http://www.robinsons-uk.com

 

[MdB]

The stopcock to my outside tap never froze as it was buried two feet underground.... I found it with the mini digger when digging pipes for the heat pump - and yes there was a nice little fountain....

 

[skier-hughes]

Problem with turning the stop cock on and off is you never know when the caravanners will want water, so really it has to be on all the time.

 

[skier-hughes]

We managed to buy a similar plastic-covered foam/polystyrene cover, might have been from Robinsons Country Leisure http://www.robinsons-uk.com

Can't find anything on their site, but never knew they were just around the corner from us

 

[Flyfisher]

Problem is the tap head freezes up and can't be opened even if the water in the pipe isn't frozen.

I've had this problem before and am planning some new outside taps later this year.

My assumption is that the washer mechanism in a standard tap becomes too rigid in the cold and stops working correctly, even before the water freezes. My proposed approach is not to use a standard tap but to use one of those lever-operated valves widely used in plumbing systems (gate valve ?). I plan to insert the valve in the standpipe and cover it with the standard foam insulation, leaving just the lever sticking out for easy operation.

There would then be no need for a standard tap at all, although I've yet to find an attachment for fitting a screw-on hosepipe adapter to plain copper pipe so I might end up with a standard tap, although I would then simply leave it turned on permanently and only use the valve.

As this is only an idea so far I have no idea if it will be any better than a standard tap, although I'd be interested to hear any reasons why it wouldn't work.

 

[FamilyWiggs]

Flyfisher - have you tried one of those standard rubberry hose connectors for a tap. They squeeze over the tap and are secured by a jubilee clip.

Can't see why that might not work with a length of copper pipe - particularly if you were to solder a compression olive onto the pipe first, so that there is something for the jubilee clip to fit around.

 

[MdB]

You can get a brass 15mm compression joint with the correct thread on the other end for a few quid at your local plumbers merchant. I've got one connected to my heat pump to pressurise it from the hose pipe.

Flyfisher - If you go with your plan, I would come vertically out of the ground, have a U bend at the top (N bend??), then a valve of your choice so that the water travels down through it. This way you don't have any water left in the pipe after the valve to freeze.

 

[Flyfisher]

I wanted to avoid jubilee-type fittings, which need a screwdriver, in favour of a screw-fitting, which should make it easier to remove the hose and fill a bucket or similar. In practice, I'd probably use a screw-to-pushfit adapter for the hosepipe.

Good point about about fitting the valve so the water can drain out when turned off, but my reasoning for fitting it on the upright pipe was that it would be easier to fix the pipe each side of the valve, thereby not stressing the pipe and joints when operating the valve.

Funny how even the simplest things can get complicated!

Perhaps something like this would work: http://www.ro-man.com/shop/product_info.php/products_id/1116

 

[skier-hughes]

Well at -9.2c last night and -9.1c at 7.30 when I walked the dogs, the house water is frozen somewhere so a trip up into the artic.... attic and some insulation is called for today me thinks.
Now to go and light the fires to warm up the house!!!

 

[MdB]

Well at -9.2c last night and -9.1c at 7.30 when I walked the dogs, the house water is frozen somewhere so a trip up into the artic.... attic and some insulation is called for today me thinks.
Now to go and light the fires to warm up the house!!!

It was -7 outside the caravan and -2 inside when we got up this morning. Dog bowl (inside caravan) and incoming water pipe had frozen too. The pipe to the caravan comes from an insulated standpipe inside the garage. That had also frozen and I had to heat it up before I could switch the water off.

We are moving into the house tonight as the cold patch is predicted to continue. Unfortunately, we currently have no hot water, no cooker and no loo. Fortunately, all should be able to be put into position temporarily for a few nights. It is going to be an interesting few days. At least I was able to get the insulation into the roof of the house over the weekend so the house is now warm(ish).

 

[skier-hughes]

I now have running water but the waste pipes are frozen solid so have to manually remove water!!!!

 

[Aidan]

You can get insulated stand pipes for outside taps. However, since the insulation only reduces the rate at which heat is transferred, an outside pipe or tap will eventually freeze in a prolonged cold spell. The only way to avoid this is to trace heat the pipe ( 2nd time that's been mentioned recently) or isolate the water supply indoors and leave the outside tap open; if the pipe is laid to fall it will drain and the supply can be turned on and off from indoors during freezing weather.

That tap cosy thing is ludicrous.


Plastic is good for external pipe because it will freeze but won't usually split like copper.

 

[Flyfisher]

Plastic is good for external pipe because it will freeze but won't usually split like copper.

Does this apply to the plastic joints and elbows as well, or are they susceptible to being 'pushed open' by frozen water?

Mention of plastic and freezing pipe has reminded me about something I saw ages ago to stop pipes splitting open when the water inside freezes. It was thin plastic chain consisting of sealed segments of air, a bit like a set of train carriages, that was inserted into water pipes at risk of frost damage. The plastic was very thin and flexible and the idea was that when the water froze its expansion would compress the plastic segments rather than force open the pipe.

I can't remember where I saw it though, or even if it's still available. It might have been one of those old "Tommorrow's World" programmes where ingenious inventions were never seen again.

 

[MdB]

I can't remember where I saw it though, or even if it's still available. It might have been one of those old "Tommorrow's World" programmes where ingenious inventions were never seen again.

Could have been TW. I remember seeing it a long time ago and haven't seen it since.

 

[Jon Maine]

I have just gone for using hep20 or similar for outside taps. It just freezes and expands as it has a bit of give in it.

We have had minus 6 in the garden and no burst pipes today when it has all thawed out.

You should fit an internal stopcock/valve ( possibly with a drain off point)and close this whilst opening the tap at the end of the autumn anyway.

 

[skier-hughes]

Ours freezes and thaws fine.
I have push in non return valves in the upright flow and push in connections at the tap end, none of which have been pushed apart by the freezing.
Graham