I'm sick of my house stinking of soot :o(

[Tom]

This is really getting me down. Because our external chimney stack has been demolished down to gutter level, we get a really bad downdraft when we have westerly or south-westerly winds (the prevailing direction around here :roll: ). In this case, it's impossible to use the wood burner because it leaks smoke tremendously and fills the house with it! However, even when we're not using it, the wind forces the smell of soot from the stove and the house stinks. I've just been in there now doing some waxing and I stink of it and have such an acrid taste in my mouth :evil:

We're having the stack reinstated next year (I even have all the stone in the yard ready, to add salt to the wounds!) but in the meantime I've had an anti-downdraft cowl fitted that was supposed to make the problem a lot better. It's one of these (fitted straight onto the stainless steel flue)

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However, it's doing nothing to stop the wind coming down and forcing the smell out. I've got all the vents closed on the stove but they don't totally seal and there are fine gaps where the top meets the main body, too. I know there's probably nothing I can do until we get the stack built. I think I just need to moan about it :lol: :roll: Even so, if you can think of something I could do to remedy this short-term, please let me know.

 

[Flyfisher]

We have a similar problem during the summer due to 'chimney reversal', which I think is often due to the stack being cold. We never seem to have the problem during the colder months when we have fires and the chimney is warm (well the odd downdraft if it's really windy).

Clearly, you won't be able to use and warm up your chimney until it's rebuilt so I would see if there's anything you can do to seal the cut-down stack in an air-tight manner. It's not idea for ventilation reasons, but I doubt that a single winter would do much harm.

You could also try a 'chimney balloon' (google for details). We use one in the summer months and it really reduces downdrafts, but it's not a completely airtight seal (intentionally) and allows a trickle of air past to provide some ventilation.

Alternatively, stick a bunch of old rags up the stove flue for the time being - although it might be an idea to leave a reminder notice in the stove in case you forget them in the excited rush to relight your stove when the chimney is eventually rebuilt!

 

[Lime]

In a temporary situation such as this I'd use an old foam cushion (settees in skips are a good source) cut down to fit the chimney opening.
If the flue is relatively small then Flyfisher's suggestion may work too.

No special flue pot except a sealed cap will stop this problem recurring until the chimney is rebuilt.
The rule of thumb for chimneys is to be taller than the ridge of the roof..... with no nearby tall trees either.

You may find the wind draws air from the house up another chimney causing a suction effect which exacerbates the downdraught problem.
In which case it may be sensible to block that flue too... but just temporarily.

 

[Tom]

Thank you both for your replies. I think you're right; I should really just plug the flues and wait until next year. It's just so lovely to have a roaring fire while I'm in there working....sort of halfway to being in there properly, if you know what I mean. Still, I can't put up with this smell and if I'm not careful it will impregnate everything and I'll never get rid of it. Thanks for your advice. Now, where are those old cushions I had lying around.........

 

[philpjuk100]

With the ridge being higher than the chimney in some wind directions the chimney will be in a higher pressure area,is it possible to add a length of flue pipe to the chimney to bring the outlet higher than the ridge?.The idea is to have the room at a slightly higher pressure than the chimney outlet,are there any holes on the downwind side of the house? could a window be opened on the upwind side?(I know it is not the weather for open windows!).At a house we used to live in the open fire worked fine in all wind directions until the loft hatch was opened then the pressures were reversed and the room filled with smoke.phil.

 

[Tom]

Phil, the flue at the moment is a good 10' or so below the ridge, so no chance of adding to the flue length because it would just be flapping about in the wind :shock:

Are you saying then that if it's windy and I'd like to light the fire, I should open a window on the windy side of the house? So, if the wind is westerly I open a window on the west side? I don't mind opening a window to get it going, as the house holds the heat well in the walls etc., but would I have to leave it open all the time? And by how much? Wide open or just a little? I don't mind doing some experiments

Thanks

 

[Jill]

We've currently got a plastic mop bucket wedged in place up one of our unused chimneys. Paul fitted it temporarily in place with expanding foam (this doesn't like being squirted upwards :lol: ). I'm not sure yet if I want to be around on the day it is removed. The bucket will need some holes putting in it first to let any "liquid" out and i'm sure the air will be very blue. Whenever Paul swears I just laugh. I laughed when it went up as all of the expanding foam came downwards, and know it will be much worse when it is removed. It was his choice to do it this way.

 

[philpjuk100]

With ten feet of ridgid flue pipe you would need some wire "guy ropes" from the top of it.There is no definite answer to the second question,it is just "suck it and see" but if the pressure in the room is the same or greater than the top of the chimney then the smoke should end up outside!.There are chimney fans available but they are not cheap and do have running costs so are probably no good for a temporary fix.Phil.

 

[Tom]

@ Jill.....Yes, that might be the day to go on a long shopping trip or something!! :lol:

@ Phil.....Well, today was perfect for lighting the fire, so I have made the most of it and had it roaring most of the day I did notice, however, that there is one hell of a draught at the bottom of our stairs and I don't understand why. We have no holes in walls, windows open or massive gaps anywhere. Do you think this is air being drawn in from somewhere? Or, could it be the air circulating around that just makes it 'feel' like a draught?

 

[Flyfisher]

A roaring fire will expel a large amount of air up the chimney. This has to be replaced from somewhere, hence the draft (I'm assuming you don't have a balanced flue for the stove). Indeed, if it isn't replaced and the fire does not receive sufficient air (oxygen actually) then there's a serious risk of incomplete combustion resulting in carbon monoxide being released - which you really don't want under any circumstances!

 

[Tom]

Thanks, FF. Yes, carbon monoxide would not be a great idea :shock: I suppose with a roaring fire, even in a stove, it's the age old scenario of a bright red face and a cold back :lol: :lol:

Anyway, I've had a good look and feel around the house and followed the said draught to the en suite, where I discovered.......there is no flap on the outside of the vent :shock: So, as Phil asked earlier, I DO have a hole in my wall :roll: So, tomorrow I'm up the scaffolding to shove something in temporarily until I can get a flap fitted. I still have other sneaky draughts here and there which, as FF has said, I do need so they'll be left alone.

So, hopefully, with this little discovery the incidences of smoke in the room and howling gales down the stairs won't be happening quite so often

 

[AMc]

If you just want to bung the chimney I would stick a bin liner up there with scrunched up newspaper in it. As the newspaper unscrunches a little it sticks bt isn't a perfect fit. If you forget to remove it and light the fire the bag and paper won't last long before they burn off and it doesn't cost £20 like a chimney balloon.
I have one of our unused chimneys bunged this way - I removed a similar arrangement with 10 year old paper in it so I'm confident in this chimney in this house it isn't causing any damp problems YMMV

 

[Lime]

If you just want to bung the chimney I would stick a bin liner up there with scrunched up newspaper in it. As the newspaper unscrunches a little it sticks bt isn't a perfect fit. If you forget to remove it and light the fire the bag and paper won't last long before they burn off and it doesn't cost £20 like a chimney balloon.
I have one of our unused chimneys bunged this way - I removed a similar arrangement with 10 year old paper in it so I'm confident in this chimney in this house it isn't causing any damp problems YMMV

..........and something interesting to read when you remove it.
good Idea!

The only thing I would be worried about is is the possibility of the plastic bag being sucked up the chimney by an updraught.

..................
Has anyone else noticed how old newspapers under lino are such a good read too?

 

[AMc]

My bag is quite a snug fit, if the wind were strong enough to drag it up the chimney the missing roof would be more of a problem
I guess if it got stuck halfway up it could be an issue, but I doubt we'll ever use this particular stack so it's unlikely to be a real problem here - obviously the OP would be well advised to consider that option though.

 

[Tom]

This is a great (no pun intended :lol: ) idea and one I'll be using in the bathroom chimney. I'm going to print a big notice to put in the stove reminding me of the fact, too. I guess if the bag did get sucked up and stuck, the chimney sweep would be able to remove it anyway, as I would always get a flue swept after a period of non-use. However, AMc says, if it's a snug fit it shouldn't really go anywhere.

Thanks again!

 

[philpjuk100]

Yes fires require large quantities of air and draw this under doors,through gaps around windows,between floorboards etc.The draughts can be a pain but are needed,do you remember the "baxi" type fires that drew air from under wooden floors? I once fed a fire in a solid floored bungalow using a piece of plastic drain pipe in the kitchen behind the units,taking air from the roofspace,through the wall and then attaching it to a short length of steel pipe on the hearth.It needed a "butterfly" in the steel pipe to control it.It stopped the fire smoking after I had sealed the windows and doors.phil.

 

[CatherineB]

do you remember the "baxi" type fires that drew air from under wooden floors?

Not to go OT or anything, but...

1) We have a baxi something-or-other gas-fired back boiler to heat (supposedly) the top floor of our house
2) The one remaining fireplace in the houseis , I was told, vented under the floorboards - I guess this is what they were talking about, although they never lit it but had an electric fire there instead.

So, not so much of the "do you remember?"!!!
I wonder if that fireplace is usable after all; I'd assumed not...

 

[Flyfisher]

We had a Baxi open fire installed when we had a previous house extended about 15 years ago. As the floor was concrete, pipes were set into the floor and led to external airbricks to supply the fire with an air supply. I guess this is a sort of 'balanced flue' arrangement. I believe the idea is that less warm air from the house is drawn up the chimney. Hard to tell in practice, but the fire itself worked wonderfully well.

 

[CatherineB]

So, do you need to have the chimney swept in the same way you would for an ordinary fireplace?

 

[Tom]

Hmm....just a thought....

If I drilled through the back of the stack to the outside and had some sort of contraption to stop rats getting in/warmth getting out etc., would that mean I could have a warm face AND back, as the air needed would be drawn from behind the stove?