How to restore a Modernist Bathroom?

[Nigel Watts]

Modern minmal looks terrible when it starts to fall apart. Any ideas how to deal with this bathroom (c. seven years old?):

Bath is sitting on a plinth made of pine and mdf tiled in glass mosaic, which is coming apart

(Expensive) Vola mixter tap agiast a bacground of flaking mosaic

gap between bath and wall opening up and mosaic lifting

Floor mosaics lifting

This bathroom is tucked into a tiny space above the stairwell, with a slightly flexible floor. The design and layout are very good in my opinion (done by an architect friend, whom I would not want to sue). Expensive materials were used (Vola taps, Italian glass mosaic tiles, French limestone and etched mirror glass). The problem is that it has fallen apart in so short a time.

I guess I am going to have to rebuild the bath plinth. Much of the construction is in mdf. I suspect marine ply should have been used. Can tiles for the floor be stuck down with soemthing stronger, eg epoxy, to withstand the flexing?

Any ideas gratefully received.

 

[JoceAndChris]

Poor you! That's terrible, after just 7 years! Any idea what glue was used? Were there any damp problems when it first went in? Does this room get good ventilation?

It must have been really stunning when first done - and I'm sure will be again. Have you got all the missing tiles, or can you get repalcements?

 

[Penners]

Looks like a lot of re-tiling needed there, Nigel. Lucky you!

I agree that MDF is very unsuitable for a bath panel - marine ply or something like Aquapanel (http://www.knaufdrywall.co.uk/aquapanel/index.html) would be much more durable for that application.

Tiles on a flexible floor are always troublesome. Even if you manage to get them stuck down successfully, you're still going to have the problem of cracking grout. If it were me, I think I would either lift them all and then reinforce with a high quality marine ply, well screwed down to stiffen up the floor, before retiling. Or I would forget the tiles and use a vinyl or waterproof laminate floor.

 

[Nigel Watts]

Thanks Penners - most helpful. The picture on the website could have been of my wife's shower room (another problem in need of sorting).

How important is access to the plumbling under the bath? One drawback of this plinth design is that there is no access whatever short of demolition and I can't work out how to create one without changing the minimal design significantly.

Joce - no pre-extisting damp - it is right at the top of the house under the eaves. It certainly gets lots of condensation. I dont know what the tiles were stuck down with - normal tile cement I expect. I have tried to keep all the ones which fell off. Canute-like I initally tried to stick them back as they did so.

 

[JoceAndChris]

Dear oh dear. I think condensation gets in and loosens glue.

The bathroom here has had hardly any condensation in the 25 years it's been installed- no shower - not much incentive to wash in dirty rainwater. The tiles are stuck firm. Since installing the shower, the condensation has increased dramatically, and the speeding up of damage is worrying.

You will just have to glue them all back on and give up washing. :|

 

[Nigel Watts]

I like the look of this. Heavy duty or what!

http://www.antel-uk.co.uk/tds/epoxy-grout-adhesive.html

 

[Moo]

What sort of adhesive and grout were used, Nigel?
When I did the bathroom (with over-bath shower) and the separate shower room in son's house I used products that stated on the packaging that they were suitable for showers and swimming pools. The walls were lined with marine ply which I gave a coat of some waterproofing stuff, just to be on the safe side. So far, after several years of hearty young men showering obsessively (as the young do, these days) I've not heard of any of them dropping off. Mind you, they weren't mosaic because I tried that once and couldn't get them straight.


ps - I'm sure I've heard of a tile adhesive and/or grout that has a certain amount of flexibility, for use on suspended floors.

 

[Nigel Watts]

Moo

I didnt do the work myself so I dont know. The mosaic tiles came in large squares with their top surfaces stuck to brown paper, presumably with some reversible water-based adhesive. After laying, the paper was removed before grouting.

I thought I might try to reproduce this by sticking the loose tiles to some lined paper first then laying them in blocks or strips. Otherwise it will be very fiddly and messy, especially I am using some seriously toxic epoxy.

Nigel

 

[Moo]

Ah - if only the mosaics I used had had a paper support on the front. Mine were cheapo ones mounted on a sort of netting that went floppy when it came into contact with the cement. I think your idea of making your own paper carrier is an excellent one - perhaps I could cope with our shower room walls if I did that.

 

[MdB]

Waterproof tile adhesive / grout only means that it doesn't fall to pieces when wet. It will still allow through moisture to the substrate.

My solution to the bath panel issue was as follows:

1) Start with an absolutely solid floor which won't move relative to the wall went the bath is full of water / person. This wasn't a problem for us as ours is in the modern constructed part of the house.

2) Make a frame for the bath which supports from underneath around the edge as well as the middle. The idea is to stop the bath moving with weight changes.

3) Make a bath panel from exterior grade plywood and give it a bit of extra protection with a layer of watered down pva on the tiled side only.

4) Fix the panel to the frame using a method that enables it to be removed. I made a weird arrangement out of some oak wedges which is difficult to explain but my mate simply used magnets which sounds like a far better solution.

5) Tile and grout the panel but leave the outside joint all the way around. The frame should support the bath such that the edge won't flex and put weight onto the tiles.

This is what our bath looks like currently:

Unfortunately, this picture shows up really quite well how bad my tiling is. I blame the cheap tiles I used
Note that there is a gap at the top, bottom and left hand edge of the panel.

6) Fill the gap all around the panel with a layer of silicon which hopefully will look a lot like grout.

If you need access to underneath the bath, all you should need to do is cut around the silicon and then remove the panel. A bit of a pain but better than no access at all.

 

[Nigel Watts]

Great suggestions! Thanks a lot.

 

[Moo]

I blame the cheap tiles I used

bad workman ... tools ... can't remember, but it's buried somewhere in my mental sludge. Must give it a stir some time.