Hearth Kitchen

[Minerva]

Hello,

I have recently moved into a 1500's house with an inglenook fireplace, in which I would like to reinstate a functional hearth kitchen.

The inglenook is 3 metres wide, 1.5 metres deep and about 1.5 metres high with seats on both sides. It currently has a modern fire basket / canopy attached to a register plate.

The current canopy and register plate would prevent a rotisserie or variable height pot hanger, grill trivet fitting underneath.

Does anyone have experience or can recommend a good hearth chimney designer who might be able to assist with alterations that would allow a functioning hearth without doubling my energy bills and/or filling the house with smoke?

Thanks and regards

Nick

 

[MikeG]

You know you're asking for a bit of magic?! You can't open up such a massive hole to the outside and not expect your heating bills to go up.

 

[Flyfisher]

The classic dilemma - period realism but with modern comforts such as heating. Good luck with that :wink:

 

[88v8]

Hello and welcome.

This is a potentially wonderful idea.

So, you want to cook in the hearth.
Mmmm.

Regularly?
There is a risk that the novelty will soon wear off. There are reasons for the disappearance of the inglenook, you've hit on two of them, the howling gale and the smoke, plus the fuel consumption.
And it's a whole art. Unless you cook on there regularly you'll not become adept.
And, for an inglenook to work without smoking (too much) it has to be kept hot, that is to say the fire has to be kept in all the time. Which, depending on what's referred to as your 'lifestyle', may be tricky.
Your fire opening, 10ft wide, 5ft high, has the potential to smoke like billyoh. Hence the hood.
However, there is a way.

Practicalities: Some thoughts.

If you use it with an open flue, it will need sweeping. Let's suppose you use it regularly, it will need sweeping at least annually. That always makes a mess. Is this in your kitchen?

Is the parging in good nick? I think as a first step before you start spending money, you should get a smoke percolation test done. If the parging and pointing are unsound, you'll need to put in a flue liner. That would not necessarily scupper your plans but it will modify them. To be honest, I would have a liner put in and be done with it.

To make your plan possible, to get draw on the chimney with the flue fully open so you have the necessary height, you are going to need a fan.
Not a piddling little fan that sits on top of a twee little pot. A big fan.
Talk to these people
http://exodraft.co.uk/commercial-kitchens-and-restaurants/restaurant/
They will tell you what size fan you need, and what size liner. And whether their fan will cope with cooking over wood. The ash, the embers. Or are you thinking of a bogusosity, with bottled gas?

With the fan, you will still need a hood and register plate, but with a big fat fan providing a draught, the hood can be moved a few feet higher up.
Now, you will have the vertical space for your (not-electric fan-driven?) spit and grill. I think being realistic I would drive the spit electrically, with the motor just under the register plate, and a drive chain. Are you handy? Can you do things, adapt things? I hope so........

How much vertical space?
Well, in our inglenook the pot hanging rod was about 8ft up the flue, but the rod was wooden. An iron rod could be much lower. I think if you have 4ft that would be plenty.

Is there an insurance aspect? Mmmm. Never mind, with a professional supplier/installer you will also have credibility with your insurer.

Some thoughts. The final thought. The fan you will need to make this work could be noisy. Very noisy. Go and hear a comparable installation in action, and think how that will play to the Period ambience.
Then talk again to the fan people and see how it can be done more quietly. Not silently. Silently would need a really big fan, on top of the stack. Ain't going to happen.
And bear in mind you'll always have to run the fan, whether you're cooking or not. The fire won't draw without the fan.

And then, presumably the house is listed. At the very least, your CO may have something to say about the visuals of the flue termination on top of the stack. Provided you don't alter the inglenook, I don't see a problem with the interior.

Anyway, good project. Bring a wallet.

Ivor

PS if you are gong to be here regularly, alter your Profile to show your location. It helps with recommending local trades/suppliers.

 

[DJH]

Are you looking for something like this?...




or this..




have you a dog?

 

[88v8]

Dang! I forgot the dog.

I also forgot one rather important thing...

To quote myself... to get air out of the house - up the chimney - there needs to be air coming in. A lot of air.
So if the house is now sealed up with all 'draughts' eliminated, that's a problem. There needs to be good ventilation, ie draughts, around the windows and doors as would have been originally. Or if you don't fancy that, vents into the room, preferably into the back of the hearth. This may be accomplished with a diamond core drill, depending on access and wall thickness.

I also forgot clockwork spits.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Antique-Victorian-Brass-Salter-Warranted-Spit-Roast-Jack-Turner-No-56/391885525542?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D48784%26meid%3Dd9a79a7b544444179dfe29dae343577d%26pid%3D100011%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D8%26sd%3D161449015154&_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850

Better go before I remember something else I forgot.

Ivor

 

[DJH]

Some alternative jacks Ivor...








and if you have plenty of smoke..




Doug

 

[Pennyviz]

You might find this book of interest The Birth of the English Kitchen, 1600-1850 by Sara Pennell. She is contactable on Twitter as @HistorySara. She is pretty well informed, I know for example she advised Ham House in Richmond how to set up their kitchen garden, so may have some contacts/info?

 

[Kearn]

I'm intrigued, by this image -

DSCN0142.JPG

Mostly as I have something similar in the cellar and had assumed it was related to weighing, but I've yet to fully investigate, but now you've prompted me...!

 

[steveb]

have you a dog?

At first I saw the item on the rotisserie and assumed that was the aforementioned dog :roll:

 

[1610ness]

Have you thought about an Esse Ironheart?

 

[DJH]

I'm intrigued, by this image -

DSCN0142.JPG

It's described as a Bottle Jack With Broche Spit.

At first I saw the item on the rotisserie and assumed that was the aforementioned dog

 

[Kearn]

I'm intrigued, by this image -

DSCN0142.JPG

It's described as a Bottle Jack With Broche Spit.

I have had a trawl around the web to see what it was/how it was used. Odd shape really! About to head into the cellar to see what markings there are on mine and I have vague hopeful recollections of the winding key being attached...

 

[DJH]

It would be nice to see a picture of it when you find it...

Doug

 

[Kearn]

It would be nice to see a picture of it when you find it...

Doug

It could do with a bit of clean, as the ones I've seen online the brass comes up very well. Although, to be fair, I quite like the current condition.


It is later than 1825, given at this point "...his nephew George had taken over the company, which became known as George Salter & Co". Most online similar ones are stated as the second half of the 1800s.


Mine is an 'improved' version, number 30.

There also seem to be 'economical' and 'extra strong' and I've seen other numbers online including 25, 40, 56, 80 - no idea what the number means though as they all seem to be similar sizes, so potentially later edition or maybe longer turning times?

I have the key, but it will wind up but not turn, assume the mech may need some TLC. Unfortunately no trace of any of the hanging parts for attaching meat/fowl.

The NT have an identical one, but frustratingly limited info.
http://www.nationaltrustcollections.org.uk/object/1333501

 

[Pennyviz]

Found this in this months period living magazine p83 - original though, so don't know where you would get one.

Penny

 

[88v8]

Was looking in Mrs Beeton for a partridge recipe.
Ingredients: Partridge.

Cook for 30 mins in front of a bright fire.

Know your fire. Much skill involved here, methinks.

Ivor

 

[wobs]

have you a dog?


DSCN0139.JPG

We've just gone through a reading book with our 6 year old daughter which featured such a thing. I should show her this, so thank you for sharing.