Have we discussed the new Eco+ scheme?

[jmo]

https://hoa.org.uk/2022/11/eco-scheme/

I've just had a new boiler fitted so heating issues etc are on my mind at the moment. My house would probably qualify due to low energy efficiency but am very wary of these schemes though!

 

[paulc]

I can see the cowboys lining up their wagons & horses in preparation for the launch of this scheme. If it is anything like the Green Home grant thing, the qualifying criteria will restrict it to just the worst performing homes. But the government has been quoted as saying they want to deliver "affordable" measures as quickly as possible to a high volume of households - I read that as a licence for Bodgit & Wrekit Builders to fleece homeowners for shoddy work. If spray foam insulation make it on to the list of approved measures, it will confirm my suspicions.

 

[wobs]

I can see the cowboys lining up their wagons & horses in preparation for the launch of this scheme. If it is anything like the Green Home grant thing, the qualifying criteria will restrict it to just the worst performing homes. But the government has been quoted as saying they want to deliver "affordable" measures as quickly as possible to a high volume of households - I read that as a licence for Bodgit & Wrekit Builders to fleece homeowners for shoddy work. If spray foam insulation make it on to the list of approved measures, it will confirm my suspicions.

From link:

Fears over spray foam insulation​

It’s likely that spray foam insulation will be covered by this scheme. For years, spray foam roof insulation has been on a government list of approved measures and homeowners have been able to access government grants to reduce the cost of installing it in their homes.

But there have been several reports in the news of late about cowboy installers. And we are just as concerned by a less-widely known impact of spray foam on people’s ability to get a mortgage or access equity release – even when using reputable firms.

Homeowners with spray foam insulation in their lofts can find themselves being financially penalised when it came to selling their homes: they either pay over the odds to remove the spray foam or remain stuck with homes they will find difficult to remortgage or sell.

HomeOwners Alliance Chief Executive Paula Higgins says, “Before spray foam makes it on to the ECO+ scheme list, the government needs to sort this mess out. Homeowners can’t be expected to pay for government-backed energy efficient measures only to have to pay twice over again to get it removed when they come to sell or remortgage. While lenders, manufacturers and surveyors work out a solution homeowners should steer clear and the government needs to step in.”

Find our more in our guide on Spray foam roof insulation

 

[Lacan07]

I can see the cowboys lining up their wagons & horses in preparation for the launch of this scheme. If it is anything like the Green Home grant thing, the qualifying criteria will restrict it to just the worst performing homes. But the government has been quoted as saying they want to deliver "affordable" measures as quickly as possible to a high volume of households - I read that as a licence for Bodgit & Wrekit Builders to fleece homeowners for shoddy work. If spray foam insulation make it on to the list of approved measures, it will confirm my suspicions.

Exactly. Its well known that the 'approved' installers would often hike their prices especially for these schemes giving the homeowner little discount. The government would do well to empower those residents who want to do their own retro-fitting. Loft insulation is relatively cheap and easy and free insulation from the Government would provide an incentive.

 

[Willsa]

They will destroy period properties with this energy agenda.

I had a surveyor in from the council. A fantastically knowledgeable person, much more so than any builder I've had the misfortune of meeting. BUT!
My substandard concrete floor (in a Victorian terrace) on their watch can only be replaced by another concrete floor. The new concrete would be insulated and thicker, which would mean raising the floor levels. Raising the floor levels would mean removing (destroying! ) my beautiful sash bay because the glazing would be too close to the new floor.
They weren't sure if the fireplaces would remain!
The Victorian door architraves would be removed. Again, due to the floor level changes.
My stained glass external door frame would be another victim - the leaded glass is not energy efficient, so UPVC it shall be!
And I'd be paying for all of that destruction via a loan...

Someone is lining their own pockets as usual. Follow the money (and the contracts awarded) and you shall see.

 

[TudorCottage]

The only thing that could be done to improve the heating efficiency of our cottage is internal wood fibre insulation.
Remove existing plaster, fix wood fibre and then replaster and finish with a lime skim top coat.
A massive job and I can’t see that being on the list of hand outs and I’d want to choose those undertaking the work. So don’t think that’s happening any time soon.

Had a conversation with a surveyor recently who said I might have serious trouble selling my place in years to come as the ‘boxes’ you have to tick when selling will get much stricter on energy efficiency rendering old places like ours unsellable.

I pointed out that it being grade 2 listed I can’t even give it a coat of paint without seeking permission but in years to come it will be condemned to destruction because it’s a bit drafty!!

 

[jmo]

The only thing that could be done to improve the heating efficiency of our cottage is internal wood fibre insulation.
Remove existing plaster, fix wood fibre and then replaster and finish with a lime skim top coat.
A massive job and I can’t see that being on the list of hand outs and I’d want to choose those undertaking the work. So don’t think that’s happening any time soon.

Had a conversation with a surveyor recently who said I might have serious trouble selling my place in years to come as the ‘boxes’ you have to tick when selling will get much stricter on energy efficiency rendering old places like ours unsellable.

I pointed out that it being grade 2 listed I can’t even give it a coat of paint without seeking permission but in years to come it will be condemned to destruction because it’s a bit drafty!!

Unsellable as buyers wouldn't be interested? Or is it about what they think future regs would be?

 

[Cubist]

Unsellable as buyers wouldn't be interested? Or is it about what they think future regs would be?

I think its as much, if not more, the fault of the back-office bureaucrats one finds in the underwriters offices of our insurers. 'Box tickers' - another of my daily grumps.

 

[TudorCottage]

Unsellable as buyers wouldn't be interested? Or is it about what they think future regs would be?

Probably a bit of both.

Mortgage companies will get the jitters lending on these old properties, meaning you’ll have to have cash buyers. Followed by even more regulation that might even put them off.

I can’t see it being that drastic anytime soon, but once the bureaucrats get involved, who knows

 

[jmo]

crikey!

 

[fernicarry]

There's already a minimum EPC for private rentals (or is that just Scotland?) so reduces the pool of potential buyers somewhat. I'm sure buyers will start to take more notice of EPC ratings if they aren't already which will feed into valuations. And eventually there will be (dis)incentives to force us all to a minimum rating. Maybe it'll be like car tax where there is an extra loading for the more 'polluting' added on to council tax or stamp duty.

The elephant in the ointment of course is that the EPC system isn't even vaguely fit for purpose. Far too broad strokes to evaluate individual buildings to any degree of accuracy and any well thought out and well executed measures you might take on your own initiative are unlikely to be recognised. That will put us completely in the hands of the 'approved' contractors. If you've had them in to perform their acts of vandalism aka improvements then you will be rewarded with some points to put on your EPC rating which might just bump you up a band and allow you to cash out before the screws tighten any further.

 

[TudorCottage]

You never know. Old houses might be exempt from all the bureaucracy like Classic Cars.

A friend of mine owns a Classic Land Rover and I’m sure it’s exempt from car tax and an mot, despite the fact it probably emits more pollution than 50 new cars combined.

 

[Lacan07]

Whilst I wouldn't put anything past the power of the Green zealots at the moment I do think they'll find it difficult to start demonising solid brick wall houses just yet. Its coming though I'm sure, probably under the guise of the EPC. I know a few people on another forum who would happily call for the demolition of all Grade II listed buildings. The trouble is there's just too much old stock in a country that hasn't been building enough new stock for decades. The other reason I don't think it will fly just yet is there are plenty of liberal elites occupying very expensive, swanky old stock.

 

[paulc]

The BBC - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-60289396 - Is reporting that people will be receiving grants of up to £1500 to help insulate their homes. That will just about cover loft and cavity wall insulation, but do nothing to tackle other areas of heat loss.
Make a big noise about the billions being made available, knock off the low hanging fruits, and then claim to have made a real impact. Weasel words to trade for votes.

 

[Willsa]

I wish they would heavily subsidise single- to double glazed timber window changes for owner-occupiers in conservation areas.

There's a large conservation area near where I live. Beautiful residential Victorian housing stock. People just bung in plastic left, right and centre in desperation. Sort of understandable when one of those bay windows can cost 10k....
It's awful to see the decay, it's awful to see the UPVC.

But hey, here's some money to upgrade your roof insulation (and just stick some old tights into the window gaps )! Sorted.

 

[Lacan07]

The BBC - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-60289396 - Is reporting that people will be receiving grants of up to £1500 to help insulate their homes. That will just about cover loft and cavity wall insulation, but do nothing to tackle other areas of heat loss.
Make a big noise about the billions being made available, knock off the low hanging fruits, and then claim to have made a real impact. Weasel words to trade for votes.

I'm guessing it will be selected installers only. I'd love £1500 in my pocket to insulate my bare lofts, sheeps wool isn't cheap!

 

[paulc]

I'm guessing it will be selected installers only. I'd love £1500 in my pocket to insulate my bare lofts, sheeps wool isn't cheap!

Any particular reason you need to use sheeps wool ?
Fibreglass, by its very nature, is breathable and is cheap.

Another BBC snippet - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-63841485 - If the councillor's predictions are correct, we have another Green Homes farce to look forward to.

 

[Jblakes]

I can see this being another major feckup and for people living in period properties, you most likely have to put modern insulation in or sod off.

We had somebody round (we didn't quality in the end) to look at internal insulation, they said they can stick some paint stuff on the outside walls. They didn't care we life in a conservation ares and our house is limestone built. They also tried to sell me gypsum boards with insulation behind even though I told them, thats what we had in the bedroom and it caused condensation.

Regards James

 

[Lacan07]

Any particular reason you need to use sheeps wool ?
Fibreglass, by its very nature, is breathable and is cheap.

Another BBC snippet - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-63841485 - If the councillor's predictions are correct, we have another Green Homes farce to look forward to.

That councillor has described exactly what happens - panicked roll out, overwhelmed installers (raise their fees), and then it goes quiet.

Yes, I've heard fibreglass is breathable, like Rockwall, so why are people against it in old houses? I lose track of these things, doesn't it collapse when wet?

 

[Willsa]

I'm guessing it will be selected installers only. I'd love £1500 in my pocket to insulate my bare lofts, sheeps wool isn't cheap!

Wow, bare lofts must be a rare sight!

I wouldn't mind someone clearing out my loft - would be nice to give a once-over with the Henry before I have to take the hall ceiling down!