Found the sole plate. Yay

[Andys]

Finally got round to removing the loose cement step-thing down the side of the house - a few taps with a hammer and off it came, revealing....
Oh joy, a big soggy sole-plate. Somehow I had convinced myself it would be some sort of brick and concrete affair, like the one at the front which is wood-grained concrete (an artistic touch from a previous owner) but no, this looks like the original timber that's just been walled up and matured in its own moisture for a few decades

We're already on the waiting-list for attention from a conservation carpenter, this may take a while longer :|

 

[malcolm]

My fat beetles say hi to their cousins. I'm guessing the screwdriver test didn't identify any surviving wood?

Your sole plate looks a bit close to the ground. In my place there is at least a plinth around 18 inches high (didn't help protect timber from the cement monster though). Are you able to lower the outside ground level to help keep any replacement sole plate dry?

 

[Flyfisher]

Oh dear Such a common though sad state of affairs.

I'm sure the perpetrators meant well - it's (almost) counter-intuitive to think that exposed wood benefits from protection from the weather, but the fact is that it would almost certainly have fared better if left exposed rather than being covered up with cement mortar preventing it being able to dry out.

We had an identical situation when removing the nice, neat, concrete 'plinth' that had been covering our sole plate. Conversely, other timbers that have been exposed for around 450 years, while a bit gnarly, remain rock-hard.

I also agree with malcolm that the ground level looks rather high. Ours was the same but fortunately I was able to lower it to expose two courses of bricks forming the original plinth supporting the sole plate.

The good news is that the actual sole plate problem is eminently repairable, but the ground level may be a more difficult issue.

 

[Andys]

My fat beetles say hi to their cousins. I'm guessing the screwdriver test didn't identify any surviving wood?

...oh yes, a cheery wave back from a couple of ours. I'm not emotionally ready for the screwdriver test yet, will try it in a few days when I've got used to the idea. I suspect I'll need a long screwdriver

the ground level looks rather high

Agreed, I'd like to lower the level by a brick course or two and it'll be exciting finding out what the sole plate is sitting on.
Any tips for removing a 1metre x 6metre concrete path? An angry man with a pneumatic drill might be in order for this job.

 

[Zebra]

You can hire big breakers. They're not very expensive. Get the biggest one you can though. Using one that's too small chips off a centimetre at a time whereas a big one will break it up into dinner plate sized chunks. Go on! You can take out all your frustration at the person who put the path there.

 

[formerly known as]

swing a pick and sledge hammer - good exercise!

 

[Andys]

swing a pick and sledge hammer

You are having a laff, though it would be a tempting opportunity to hire noisy equipment. I shall step away from tackling this one personally, still enjoying the novelty of being able to walk after the great 2013 damaged-back-and-sciatica debacle from doing the bathroom...

 

[Flyfisher]

My preferred approach for breaking up concrete paths is to use the heaviest equipment available.

It's surprisingly easy to break up slabs of concrete when they are lifted clear of the ground . . .

 

[Andys]

Wow, I want one.

 

[mike12]

During the last 100 yrs, in a mistaken attempt to protect the wood, the sole plate was covered by a thin coat of sand and cement render, later a thick sand and cement plinth was installed over the crumbling render. Both of these "skins" pulled away from the structure and allowed water entry.

The interior should be examined for damp and timber decay signs.

Pics of ground level at all elevations would help with any further advice.

A small breaker will be adequate for breaking up an average thickness concrete path. The path should then be dug out to, initially, about 150mm below the plate. Pic whats revealed and maybe post on here?

As mentioned above, what will be exposed below the sole plate is important.

The most important question is what to do about the damaged sole plate - replace completely? Or a partial replacement?
A dimensioned section view of the lower wall is needed before any work.

 

[Andys]

Good stuff, I'll post pictures when I've done a bit of digging!

 

[Keithj]

Good luck! (Hope you don't need it).

We had to replace ALL the sole plates here, in an enthralling six months of acroprops and moving round the house as "the lads" did the next bit.

The job was well done, and the house is fine. With one or two exceptions (but "all good news" isn't character building).

GREEN OAK...
We were told that, as a Listed Property, only green oak was allowed to be used for the repairs. At the time, I didn't appreciate the full implications of that. What it means is that the green oak will shrink, twist, shake, rock and roll and more as it dries out. This meant in turn that doors and windows that used to open and close no longer did so until the saw or surform was taken to them. Lime that abutted the oak now grows annual gaps that need filling (I've become pretty good at that, a new skill for a 71 year old).

If I were doing it again, I would ask for detailed justification as to why kiln-dried or well-aged oak could not be used.

Many years ago, a large oak tree in the then-churchyard was felled by a thunderstorm. An alert and knowedgeable member of the PCC suggested having the tree cut into useful sized lumps and stored against being needed. Since he offered to do so for free, the suggestion was approved. Getting on for 20 years later, the quinquennial inspection discovered serious rot in some of the timbers of the wooden steeple (the new architect climbed up there where the old one used binoculars). We had a bit of an argument with some diocesan folks, but eventually won with the argument to use our own "very native" oak. The chap doing the work remarked on the difficulty he had cutting the oak to the required size and shape, but five years later it hadn't shrunk, twisted, etc one tiny bit.

I'm a convert to matured, well-dried oak. I'm sure there are arguments for the other sort.

 

[malcolm]

Why do they specify green oak? Surely after some time it will become matured, dried oak anyway. Apart from ease of cutting why does it matter if drying occurs before the oak is installed in the building?

 

[Keithj]

I'm not sure of the reason why, but "green oak" was stipulated in the LBC for the repairs.

Maybe it's to do with the oak then shrinking and pulling the joints tight so that they don't let go again.

 

[DJH]

I recall that green oak was used for the repairs at Uppark House after the fire and a stainless steel restraining frame was fitted to prevent the roof timbers from distorting and was due to be removed when all movement had stopped.

Doug