Fire extinguishers/ Grade 2 listed thatched

[jocelyn plummer]

We are studying Policy conditions for buildings insurance for our thatched (still 'soon to be') cottage.

One clause states that there is to be 'at least one fully working 2 gallon fire extinguisher on each level of the home'.

This seems to be quite a big piece of kit? The cottage is really tiny, and I am wondering how and where they are going to be attached inside a listed building! ?
Also, of course a fire blanket and 2kg dry powder extinguisher in the kitchen, which is fully fitted 12ft x 5ft, no room -- anywhere!

Of course I have absolutely no problem with the principles of the recommendations but--------

Any useful comments?

 

[MdB]

Make sure that you sort something out. If you have the misfortune of losing your home to fire, the last thing you want is for the insurance company not to pay out due to you not following their small print.

 

[Nemesis]

2 gallons isn't really so large, about the size of a watering can, and the dry powder one will fit in a cupboard.

Most important is to find out the effective way to use them.

 

[Carol]

See if you can organise some fire extinguisher training! It's great fun and was the best 'in-service for teachers' course I've ever done, hope I never have to use it in earnest. Maybe a local fire station could offer that as a service for period property owners.

 

[Nemesis]

Local motor clubs too at times do training sessions.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Nemesis, thank you for giving me an idea of the extinguisher size. That should be possible to fit in somewhere.

Fortunately my other 'alf has a good understanding of fire fighting as a result of being 'in the Navy'.

Strangely, I felt that our, not thatched, Holy Land House was far more vulnerable to fire with its very very dry timbers . I was particularly conscious of the attic which was well stacked with boxes.

 

[Penners]

A standard 2-gallon (9 litre) water fire extinguisher is very roughly 2 feet high - not really a major inconvenience. You can get brackets to hang them on the wall if that makes life easier.

And, as MdB says, failing to have them is just not worth the risk of having a claim refused.

 

[Nemesis]

You could always crochet a nice cover...

The dry powder ones are really quite compact, will fit in a cupboard, as indeed will a fire blanket.

There's a rather more attractive selection here:

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/sis/_W0QQ_kwZpyreneQ20brassQ20handQ20heldQ20fireQ20extinguisherQ20Q20Q20antiqueQ20Q2fcol

Although the insurers possibly won't accept them, I was once camping when an adjacent tent caught fire. Several of us used our modern dry powder exinguishers to little avail, and in the end a friend, whose tent was also at risk, removed (very reluctantly...) his beautiful accessory hand-pumped Pyrene from his TR3 and and discharged that, which worked a treat!


You will of course need one of these:



[Open Image] [Hosted by PhotoGalaxy.com]


And recommended is one of these:



[Open Image] [Hosted by PhotoGalaxy.com]

 

[Penners]

Oh, don't start. My wife and daughter both go slack-jawed at the sight of a fireman. I'm sure they're going to resort to arson one of these days.

Cue a series of extremely questionable puns on the word "arson".

 

[Nemesis]

I just go misty-eyed at the thought of the time I had TWO fire appliances at my house, and a whole load of hunky firemen in the bedroom... unfortunately, although I was experiencing the hots, it was not the right sort. What an opportunity wasted... me, brass bed, gorgeous firemen (in those days they were all men...). No one's *rse on the bed.

Sigh.

Can't praise them enough, actually. Wonderful.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

cooorrrrr! Nemesis, have you been rummaging through Penner's old school photos ?

Anyway, thanks for all the advice -- again!

I wish the Conveyancing would shift along a little. Vendor has had trouble answering the questions so the paper work keeps being shunted back and forth.

 

[Lime]

I think everyone should have fire extinguishers and a plan of escape agreed between the family.
Every night I make sure corridors and escape routes are not blocked or cluttered prior to going to bed.
I have 12a smoke alarms (both ioniser and optical detector) dotted around the house as well as 7 large CO² fire extinguishers in various places, fire escape rope, fire blankets and emergency lighting.
I always build or alter the house with fire prevention and spread in mind.
I have been in a fire so perhaps I'm just biased.

 

[jocelyn plummer]

Lime, it sounds as though our little cottage would fit into one room of your house! Still,the shock of fire is never forgotten, so you are very wise to be very careful.

 

[Flyfisher]

I've found the extinguisher prices at http://www.fireprotectiononline.co.uk/ to be quite reasonable. You can also get 5% off by registering on their website.

Regarding the insurance requirement to have an extinguisher, it will also probably mean that the extinguishers will have to be regularly checked to remain 'valid'. It might be worth checking how often this needs to be done, or is required by the insurance company. The website I mentioned says that at their prices it's cheaper to by a new extinguisher than to refill or service an existing one - I've no idea if that's true, but it does suggest that regular inspection is the norm. I know it's a requirement for commercial premises.

The requirement for an extinguisher is an interesting one, given that all advice is not to fight any fire unless it is safe to do so. As Lime rightly points out, an escape plan, with contingency, is by far the most important thing. So it's quite likely that extinguishers would never be used anyway - or perhaps that would also invalidate the claim?!

 

[jocelyn plummer]

yes, I found that site this pm. At least an extinguisher will not break the banK. I did notice a comment at the end saying that it is cheaper to replace them after 5 years, and I wondered about the additional costs having them checked.

With the greatest of respect to anyone who has suffered a serious fire, I did wonder about the efficacy of extinguishers, 'one per floor'.. you cannot order where your fire might start, nor the time of day -- the extinguisher/s might be totally inaccessible due to the fire, therefore unused. One could argue that one is merely paying lip service to the small print and that prevention is better than cure .

I can see the logic of a fireblanket in the kitchen, just in case.

My Son had a small fire in the flat above his shop a few years ago. He was staying with us, just up the road, at the time. No amount of fire extinguishers would have prevented that fire from spreading since he was not in residence to use them. The Police rang to tell us. Something unseen had been smouldering for quite a while and then combusted. Fortunately not too serious.I seem to remember that it was something to do with a vacuum cleaner hose falling onto an appliance that was cooling down after use.

reading the article 'Living With Thatch' reveals some interesting facts and figures about thatch fires. Highlights the chimney as a potential weak spot. So lining and checking the pointing is an avenue that we will go down, and take all the usual precautions. we are also going to seek the advice of the Fire Service safety check, and then see what the other 2 policies throw at us. Plenty of time to decide.

 

[Moo]

...the efficacy of extinguishers, 'one per floor'.. you cannot order where your fire might start, nor the time of day -- the extinguisher/s might be totally inaccessible due to the fire, therefore unused.

Perhaps, in an ideal world, one would have one in each room, plus some more in traffic areas. If the idea caught on someone would be sure to start marketing a range of tasteful covers to lessen their visual impact.

 

[Lime]

With the greatest of respect to anyone who has suffered a serious fire, I did wonder about the efficacy of extinguishers, 'one per floor'.. you cannot order where your fire might start, nor the time of day -- the extinguisher/s might be totally inaccessible due to the fire, therefore unused. One could argue that one is merely paying lip service to the small print and that prevention is better than cure .

I agree with your points.
Also the type of fire extinguisher is always a compromise; water based, gas, powder or other liquid.

IME the fires that start in houses ~ that are seen early enough to be put out ~ need to be quenched as quickly as possible.
The water based extinguishers are often worse than just peeing on the flames and they conduct electricity.
I have tried out a lot of domestic fire extinguishers and most are absolutely useless.
You need big fire extinguishers to put out a fire.
If you are really serious about buying fire extinguishers try them out!
Don't wait for a fire to find out they don't do the job you thought they'd do.
(A bucket of water isn't a bad extinguisher if correctly thrown.)

My choice of carbon dioxide extinguishers was because they are very powerful and quick, can be weighed to check loss and don't deteriorate anything like most other types do.

...water based ones corrode, powder ones loose their gas, liquids become stiff and clog.
Carbon dioxide cylinders are very substantial (they have to be to contain the gas as a liquid) and are built for the very long-term.

 

[Penners]

cooorrrrr! Nemesis, have you been rummaging through Penner's old school photos ?

I wish the Conveyancing would shift along a little.

Excuse me! That photo was taken only last year. (Unfortunately not of me)

"Shift along"? Are you suggesting that the solicitors should hurry??! :roll:

 

[FamilyWiggs]

reading the article 'Living With Thatch' reveals some interesting facts and figures about thatch fires. Highlights the chimney as a potential weak spot. So lining and checking the pointing is an avenue that we will go down, and take all the usual precautions.

Isn't the greater risk of chimneys and thatch the fact that sparks/embers exit the chimney and land on the thatch? In whichcase, you'd have thought sort of "filter" that allows some to still draw through but stops conders would have been developed.

Have a very nasty feeling now reading this thread. I'm away from the family tonight, and feel we are unprepared for a fire - in terms of plans, extinguishers and sufficient smoke alarms, etc.

Can anyone recommend the best smoke alarms to install. I have rewired and didn't think of mains smoke alarms, so will need to be battery.

How many & where? Also what about CO2 alarms - we have an externally accessed oil boiler in a boiler room under the bathroom.

 

[MdB]

... Also what about CO2 alarms ...

<nitpick mode on> You want a CO alarm not a CO2 alarm (carbon monoxide not carbon dioxide) - both will kill you if there is enough of it but it is the CO which is the most dangerous as it stops your blood transporting oxygen. It's produced during combustion when there isn't enough oxygen near to the flame. <nitpick mode off>