Electric in the bathroom question.

[DaveBrigg]

I was foolishly left to decide on locations for the upstairs electrical sockets, so while the TV and video in the playroom are perfectly sited, with capacity for a playstation too, there is nowhere to plug in the hoover when cleaning the bathroom. I know that there are quiet strict regulations regarding electrical sockets in bathrooms, but is there any way that one can be added? The bathroom is long and narrow, with all the wet stuff at one end. The isolation switch for the shower is wall mounted, inside a large wooden cupboard that used to hold the hot water tank, about 1.5 metres away from the sink. (It is also above the height of the sink, and over 3 metres from the shower). Is there any way that I would be able to swap the isolation switch for one that also had a socket, as we have in the kitchen for the cooker?
Thanks.

 

[Pford75]

This is from the 17th Edition of the IEE Wiring Regulations.





Zone 0
The interior of the bath or shower which can hold water.
Zone 1
The area directly above zone 0 limited vertically to 2.25m above the bottom of the bath or shower.
Also 1.2m horizontally from the centre of a shower outlet to the height of the outlet or 2.25m whichever is the higher.
Zone 2
The area beyond zones 0 and 1, 0.6m horizontally and up to 2.25m vertically. Zone 2 also included any recessed window with a sill next to the bath.

All electrical circuits within bathrooms must be protected by Residual Current Devices (RCD) not excedding 30mA. This applies all electical equipment whether it is controlled a switch in the bathroom or remotely switched.

Standard electrical wall fittings (such as wall sockets, flexible cord outlets and fused switches etc) are not IP rated so cannot be installed within zones 0, 1 or 2.
No standard socket outlets are allowed anywhere in the bathroom. The only exception to this is the type specially designed and approved under the appropriate British Standard for electric razors

The isolation switch for the shower is wall mounted

Strictly the isolation switch should be a pull cord if located inside the bathroom (even inside a cupboard). The alternative is to have the isolation switch above the door outside of the bathroom.

 

[Lime]

In large bathrooms it is possible to have sockets outside zone 3 and still be covered by the IEEE (IET) regs but I would never advise it to be done.
The simple reason is that appliances have leads, some quite long, and people who use electric equipment often don't think (or know) about the dangers... they see a socket and use it.
locked in a bathroom who would know what they get up to?
Anyone who has young adults in the house should know what I'm talking about.
I caught my son a few months ago having a bath cooling himself with an electric fan (pinched from downstairs) plugged into an extension run under the bathroom door. .!!!.. which I saw and unplugged, quickly followed by howls of protest.

Cupboards in bathrooms are often used to house switches for the water heater etc. and they comply with the regulations.
Speaking personally, any likelyhood of contact with electricity when wet is to be avoided so like Pford75 I have ceiling pull switches for all electrical fittings.




http://www2.theiet.org/Publish/WireRegs/WiringMatters/Documents/Issue14_1/2004_14_autumn_wiring_matters_section_601_revisited.pdf

 

[Pford75]

The guidelines in Lime's link are from 2004 and the bathroom zones and wiring guidelines were revised earlier this year. They are very clear about 2 things:

1. No sockets allowed anywhere in a bathroom (even outside of zone 2)

2. No wall mounted switches allowed anywhere in a bathroom (must either be outside or pull cord)

What are you doing reart P certification? Electrics in a bathroom are (IMHO) 'notifiable' works and really should be undertaken by a qualified electrician. If you choose to do the work yourself, you will still need Part P certification from your LA.

 

[Moo]

Why does the socket have to be in the bathroom? I know you said it's long and narrow, but surely it's not so long that the vacuum cleaner flex couldn't reach from a socket in the corridor/landing outside?

 

[Lime]

quoting directly from the IET pdf 2008 17th edition link below

What’s new?
Changes to the zonal system, RCD
protection on all bathroom circuits,
230v socket outlets permitted 3 m
horizontally from the boundary of
zone 1; supplementary equipotential
bonding may be omitted subject to the
Regulations being met.

Link 2008 re. 17th edition
http://www2.theiet.org/Publish/WireRegs/WiringMatters/Documents/Issue26/2008_26_spring_wiring_matters_the_17th_edition_launched_bathrooms.pdf

So it is clear that in certain circumstances plug sockets ARE allowed in a bathroom and not as has been asserted previously.

 

[shelli]

Hi Dave - DO you have carpet in the bathroom ?

 

[DaveBrigg]

Thanks for all the comments. From what was said about no eletrical sockets being allowed, added to the comments about youngsters and electrical devices (we have two boys) I think it is a non-starter, even if it would have been in the 'safe' area of the diagram. A shame, because it would have avoided chopping more holes in the plasterwork. Looks like it will have to be a socket just the other side of the door, or replace the vacuum cleaner cable with one that's a lot longer.
In the picture below, the cupboard in question is halfway up the nearest blue panelling (it used to hold the water tank and pipework) The sink is behind this, just out of the picture. As you can see, we have carpet halfway, then a step where joists were added to take the weight of the bath off the ash lime floor, and the cracked beam in the room below.

 

[AMc]

As chief hoover operator in our house I always use a 10m extension lead. I find that plugging, unplugging makes a long boring job take longer. It's surprising how much faster (it feels) when you only have to stop once or twice per floor. Just remember to unroll it all so as the cassette type can overheat if left coiled up.

I also use a 30m massive extension on the lawn mower to save tramping grass in and out of the house as I work around the front, side and back.

 

[shelli]

I can see wet footprint on that carpet - why not just replace the carpet with hard flooring - thus eliminating both poss of sodden carpet and electrickery problem

 

[Penners]

Even if the regulations permitted it, I would never have a standard socket outlet in a bathroom. It's just too dangerous.

Moo suggested that you have one just outside the bathroom door - that sounds sensible.

 

[Penners]

why not just replace the carpet with hard flooring - thus eliminating both poss of sodden carpet and electrickery problem

We have vinyl tiles on our bathroom floor but we still vacuum it.

*Sigh* - I'm just so houseproud....

 

[FamilyWiggs]

By the way, what is a hoover?

 

[biffvernon]

What happens to those trendy folk who put a bath in their bedroom?

(Daft idea, I know.)

 

[DaveBrigg]

The carpet was a remnant donated by our friendly carpet fitter, who I think took pity on us just after we moved in. It's stayed ever since as we contemplated the issue of bathroom flooring, which has cropped up several times on this forum already, with no easy solution. The boards are new tongue and groove, so I imagine fairly watertight, barring a major leak. The carpet is just bog standard, and so not ideal for wet conditions, but it is kinder to bare feet. We haven't really looked at vinyl tiles, but may investigate, otherwise it could be paint. I seem to recall from earlier discussions that normal wood treatment, such as linseed oil or osmo wax are not appropriate.

 

[Flyfisher]

What happens to those trendy folk who put a bath in their bedroom?

I presume that's where the zones in Pford75's diagram become relevant.

I was toying with the idea but didn't realise it was considered trendy - you've put me off now.

 

[Lime]

Even if the regulations permitted it, I would never have a standard socket outlet in a bathroom. It's just too dangerous.

Moo suggested that you have one just outside the bathroom door - that sounds sensible.

It is permitted.
One of the changes that the new regulations have made is that it is now clearly stated that plug sockets are allowed 3 metres or more away from the shower cubical or bath edge.

 

[Anys9]

And what happens when you follow continental ways and put the washing machine in a large storage area off a bathroom? It used to be the roof area of the stables. There are double doors leading to it, and our registered electrician said it was perfectly alright, and fixed it up for us.

 

[Anys9]

The washing machine will be 3 metres plus away from the shower.

 

[DaveBrigg]

Presumably three metres is greater than the normal cable length on a hairdryer, fan, TV, sandwich toaster, circular saw or whatever other electrical devices people take with them to the bathroom.