Dry Lining and Insulation

[dlison]

I have a solid brick construction house that's just been completed gutted(back to brick everywhere). Previously internal finishes suffered from lots of damp.

My plan is to internally dry line and insulate all the exterior walls both to improve heat loss and prevent damp. So to give an example, the living room gable wall will be dry lined with 3x2" timber, insulated, and then a vapour barrier used before being plasterboarded.

My question relates to the type of insulation that would be most suitable and offer the best value for money?

Also, the chimney breasts previously suffered from condensation and cold spots. The chimney is on an internal wall. If I were to dry line it the same as above, would this also need a vapour barrier?

 

[Penners]

I think I would use insulated plasterboard and reduce the thickness of the battens to 1", in order to avoid gobbling up too much floor space. You can get the material in a variety of insulation thicknesses - obviously you'll want to use the thickest you can with too much floor space loss.

http://www.insulation.kingspan.com/uk/pdf/k18.pdf

 

[AMc]

Welcome!

Did you get to the cause of the damp?
If you simply dry line the walls without dealing with the root cause (raised external ground levels, cement render, leaking gutters etc.) then you will probably be back to bare walls in a couple of years as all the "dry lining" does it isolate the internal finish from the external wall. If the wall remains damp it will rot from within.

We dry lined by building a stud work lattice with (roof) tile batten at 300mm centres then insulated between the batten with 25mm of Ecotherm and then overlaid the whole lot with plasterboard backed with 60mm of foam backed insulation BUT there was no damp evident at all.
If you have an ongoing damp problem then you'll need to look at breathable a.k.a. vapour permeable insulation and wall finishes.

You might want to start with a cup of tea and the carefully hidden damp FAQ thread here
http://www.periodproperty.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6777#p71494

 

[dlison]

I think I would use insulated plasterboard and reduce the thickness of the battens to 1", in order to avoid gobbling up too much floor space. You can get the material in a variety of insulation thicknesses - obviously you'll want to use the thickest you can with too much floor space loss.

http://www.insulation.kingspan.com/uk/pdf/k18.pdf

I looked into this but came to the following conclusion.

Using 1" battens would mean they have to be fixed direct to the walls more often, the walls are very very uneven so it would take more time to pack the battens out to be level. Plus, once you add 20mm-30mm of k18 you're more or less at the same thickness as as 3x2" with insulation between the studs. Erecting 3x2" stud walls in front of the masonry walls would be a lot faster as it doesn't require you tie into the wall so much. The price of K18 seems a lot too.

Welcome!

Did you get to the cause of the damp?
If you simply dry line the walls without dealing with the root cause (raised external ground levels, cement render, leaking gutters etc.) then you will probably be back to bare walls in a couple of years as all the "dry lining" does it isolate the internal finish from the external wall. If the wall remains damp it will rot from within.

It's a combination of things but in the living room for example, the house is on the roadside and the road/pavement is above internal floor level at points. Plus, there's rising damp all around, there's an internal wall dividing the living room from the kitchen that isn't exposed to external elements and is pulling up damp from the sub floor.

I won't be fixing the timber directly to the wall, there will be DPM in between and it will be treated so I don't worry too much about it rotting.

 

[Penners]

the walls are very very uneven so it would take more time to pack the battens out to be level. Plus, once you add 20mm-30mm of k18 you're more or less at the same thickness as as 3x2" with insulation between the studs.

Ah - you didn't mention that! In which case I agree that an 'independent' studwork wall is the better plan - assuming you have the room to do it. Despite your plan for a DPM, I would still use pressure-treated studs for the job.

 

[MatthewC]

I have a solid brick construction house ...

Is that with cement mortar or lime mortar? If cement, then I think you're on the wrong forum! If it's lime then you really should retain the breathability of the walls, and drylining, plasterboard and vapour barriers will only add to your problems. As AMc said, you really must get the the root of the cause(s) of dampness, and tackle that first.

How old is your house? Photos would be helpful. My blog details the issues I had with my house, which took several months to dry out after I sorted the roof and gutters.

Matthew
http://houseintheenchantedforest.blogspot.com/

 

[dlison]

lime mortar...

I'm really interested to hear how you 'get to the bottom' of having part of your living room underground due to the road outside? Those bricks are always going to be damp.

Interior lime plastering is too much of a $tretch financially and doesn't insulate the house.

 

[Penners]

I have a solid brick construction house ...

Is that with cement mortar or lime mortar? If cement, then I think you're on the wrong forum

Eh?!

Matthew, are you suggesting that people whose houses incorporate cement mortar in some form or another shouldn't be on this forum?

I think a lot of us would disagree quite profoundly with that.

 

[MatthewC]

I have a solid brick construction house ...

Is that with cement mortar or lime mortar? If cement, then I think you're on the wrong forum

Eh?!

Matthew, are you suggesting that people whose houses incorporate cement mortar in some form or another shouldn't be on this forum?

I think a lot of us would disagree quite profoundly with that.

No, I'm not, and I also disagree profoundly with it. Stop stirring; you know what I mean. There are many fora(?) which cater for people who live in modern houses made with bricks, blocks, cement, gypsum etc, and without that information it looked seriously as though the question was mis-directed. :|

 

[Pford75]

There are a lot of 'period' properties which were built with cement. It doesn't have to be Tudor/Georgian to be considered 'period'. Aren't Edwardian pebbledash/roughcast buildings also 'period'?

Saw that Thomas Edison built single piece, cast concrete houses..... :shock:
http://flyingmoose.org/truthfic/edison.htm

 

[Zebra]

I don't have any answers, but dlison, please do post any further thoughts or progress. I have similar situation, rising damp on internal walls, ground level higher outside, and I am wondering exactly the same thing - how to insulate, which materials to use.... So I'm bookmarking this thread, please keep in touch!!

 

[Penners]

Stop stirring; you know what I mean.

No, I didn't know what you meant, other than what your post appeared to say - that this is the wrong forum for people whose houses are built with cement. I felt that it was quite wrong to risk giving this impression to a forum newcomer.

Kindly don't accuse me of stirring when I'm trying to clarify the inclusiveness of this forum.

 

[Roger H]

Interior lime plastering is too much of a $tretch financially and doesn't insulate the house.

You could use an insulated lime render - Eden Lime do one with a mix of hemp, perlite and lime. Maintains breathability while providing necessary insulation.

 

[BlueC]

Stop stirring; you know what I mean.

No, I didn't know what you meant, other than what your post appeared to say - that this is the wrong forum for people whose houses are built with cement. I felt that it was quite wrong to risk giving this impression to a forum newcomer.

FWIW, as a newcomer here and researching a similar issue that was the impression it gave me too - like I am in the wrong place because our victorian property is brick and cement construction.

 

[Penners]

BlueC

I'm sure I speak on behalf of everyone on this forum when I tell you that we all welcome anyone and everyone who has an interest in period properties. Whether or not you live in one; whether or not you're interested in the repair and maintenance of such buildings; whether your home is made of stone, brick, timber, lime, concrete, clay, reed, straw, fibreglass or whatever!

So come on in!

 

[skier-hughes]

Absolutely, everyone welcome, blimey I'm allowed in once a week!!!

 

[Penners]

Once a week?! Who told you that?

The last I heard, the committee was debating whether to give you a visa for three days per year or four.

 

[skier-hughes]

In which case I'm going to make the most of today and post loads of posts about posts.