Date stone query

[FamilyWiggs]

We live in what we believe is a 16thC farmhouse in North Wales, which we are slowly restoring.

Carved in the wood over the front door is the following:

D * LL

The * is actually a three-pronged trident type character.

I wondered if this was Roman numerals for 1600 - ie 500 * 50 50.

But:

a) why not just put "MDC" (or just "DC" instead?
b) The village we live in is called "Llanfynydd" - so maybe the LL relates to the location?

Does anyone have any thoughts on this that will help us decipher it?

Thanks, Robin.

 

[Nemesis]

It could also refer to occupants of the building, and/or an anniversary date. These can be puzzling and at times misleading, I agreee! I have a 17th century stone incorporated in the 19th century extension of our house, it took a great deal of research to find its history.

http://www.angmeringvillage.co.uk/history/datestones.htm

http://kirkbymalham.info/KMI/kirkbymalham/datestone.html

 

[Penners]

I wondered if this was Roman numerals for 1600 - ie 500 * 50 50.

That does seem a rather tortuous interpretation. The "LL" of the village name seems a much more obvious connection. Maybe the "D" was the builder's name.

 

[Nemesis]

Dai Llewellyn?

Mostly it was an owner who was commemorated in some way.

 

[Penners]

Dai Llewellyn

Of course that must be it. There are very few Welshmen who aren't called that. :wink:

 

[Nemesis]

Simple.

Would be good to see a picture though...

 

[MdB]

D * LL

The * is actually a three-pronged trident type character.

Ah that would be home of the first steam powered calculation device. The family / company is a little bigger now.

 

[FamilyWiggs]

Thanks for the input...

Will try and get a pic up tomorrow.

 

[Penners]

Would be good to see a picture though...

 

[Nemesis]

Ooh, you are such a wag, Penners.

 

[Cloudscape]

The * is actually a three-pronged trident type character.

This symbol is curious, and something fitting the description occurs in the fourth image down on the page for which Nemesis posted a link.

http://www.angmeringvillage.co.uk/history/datestones.htm

I can't help feeling it's a marriage symbol. I also wonder if it's a kind of fertility symbol - a seedling growing from a small beginning. Taking the horticural theme further :? I have a feeling the symbol might relate to the new plant created by grafting the scion and rootstock - in the case of a marriage, the grafting of one bloodline onto another.

Of course, I'm making this up as I go along. I just know I've seen the symbols somewhere before and it's bugging me. :?

 

[Nemesis]

Well doubt it's a mason's mark, they tended to be in stone!

http://www.trp.dundee.ac.uk/research/glossary/mason.html

http://www.rosslyntemplars.org.uk/masons'_mark_(1).htm

http://shoreham.adur.org.uk/masons_marks.htm

http://www.envf.port.ac.uk/kacanal/html/bbd13.htm

Probably not a witch mark either, but you never know:


http://www.apotropaios.co.uk/goatchurch_cavern_marks.htm

http://www.apotropaios.co.uk/ritual_marks.htm


"Ritual Marks on Historic Timber", Weald and Downland Museum Magazine, Spring Ed, 22–28
Timothy Easton, 1999

"Ritual Marks on Historic Timber" Third Stone: Archaeology, Folklore and Myth 38. 11–17
Timothy Easton, 2000.



(could be ancient graffiti of course...)