Completely trashed Devon rubble stone cottage

[vicky whitworth]

Hello, this is my first post and I'm a novice at this. I'm after some advice on my tiny rubble stone Devon cottage. The Deeds date back to 1760 but the cottage was trashed in the 1980s (cement floors, cement internal paster, crappy windows, replacement lintels - the lot). Practically nothing is left of the original except the rubble stone walls. My question is about what to do on the external wall surfaces. The cottage is painted outside in modern exterior paint which is adhering to the stone like there's no tomorrow. Although I can't see the pointing through the paint it looks like it's been cement re-pointed with that raised, ribbon pointing in places (it's all pretty rough, pointing covering the stone - not what you'd call craftsmanship). The rubble stone used is likely to be a combination of churt and a softer limestone.
I would like to remove the horrid modern paint, take out the ribbon pointing, re-point in lime, and then limewash the whole lot.

How the hell do I get the paint off and the pointing out? I've tried a chisel and hammer and after an afternoon's work had done about an inch!

I don't want to cause any damage but I need to give the place back some of it's life and free it from its cement jacket.

Any advice gratefully received. Thanks.

 

[MdB]

Welcome to the forum Vicky and I'm sorry to hear about the house. I can't help on removal on the paint and render I am afraid. Hopefully others will, just don't attempt to use an angle grinder as you are likely to do more damage than you cure.

 

[bower1]

Not sure where you are in Devon, but after I bought my house in North Devon (2 years ago), I spoke to Mike Wye, who generally seems to have a good reputation. He gave me a 'verbal survey' for about £70 (which was just a cost for his time/travelling) saying what he thought needed to be done, and how to go about it.

http://www.mikewye.co.uk

Its also a good place to buy lime (I'm planning on going this afternoon!)

 

[Nemesis]

Gosh it sounds awful - I have acres of hard cement to remove also.

I agree - try Mike Wye, and join SPAB.

 

[kevmiles1]

Hi Vicky
As a lime specialist, it is hard to tell you the easiest way to sort out your problems with your house without seeing it, as every house has different problems.
Your best route forward before you continue struggling is to get a specialist to take a look, he can advise you on the best way to progress. most normally just charge for petrol and a few hours of their time depending on how far they ahve to travel. There are many specialists in Devon your local planning department will give you a list of ones who they now have carried out work to a high standard in your area or alternatively i can give you the names and contact details of a few if you wish (Mye Wye is certainly one). Good luck with it

 

[vicky whitworth]

Many thanks guys for the advice, and it's nice to know I'm not alone. I am going to take the advice and get a specialist to look at it. I've heard good things about Mike Wye so I'll head off in that direction.

Inside the cottage I'm planning on getting the modern plaster off the walls but leaving the concrete floors (as I just can't take the mess - it's a tiny cottage and we have to live in it while work is being done). My theory is that if I can get the walls breathing again (by removing the impervious layers inside and out) then that's better than just leaving it as it is. Amazingly for all its sealing up we don't have any damp as far as we can tell (yet?).

I've found lots of information about restoring original features (what a horrid word!) but I can't find anything about what to do when everything has been modernised - how far do you go trying to remove the horrors?

 

[MdB]

Speak to Mike Wye, he is a very nice bloke (if a little busy) and get him to come around to take a look. He may well suggest that leaving the cement on the outside is the best thing to do in the short term as more damage will be caused taking it off than leaving it on. The same may also apply to the internal render though obviously its not an ideal solution. Mike will be able to tell you what to do but more importantly he will be able to tell you why a particular course of action is best.

Let us know how you get on.

 

[bower1]

I wouldn't rush into anything. You want to work on the most urgent problems first.

I don't think cement floors will cause too many problems except for damp in the walls, so see if the walls will dry out first. We've got concrete floors and modern paint on the outside (not done be me!) and when we bought the house the walls were VERY damp. After fitting heating the walls dried out, and now no damp at all. So no need to do anything about the floor or the paint.

 

[Nemesis]

I'd look long term to getting the piant off, and the cement.

Neither wil be allowing the building to function properly, and don't look very soft and sympathetic to period buildings.

http://periodproperty.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8905

Although the book deals with Wales, a great deal of what it says apply anywhere.

I would also advise buying some of the SPAB publications, joining SPAB, and going along to regional meetings and talking to others who will have great deal of hands on experience.


http://www.spab.org.uk

 

[L1zzy]

Hi I haven't logged in for awhile and was just catching up so you may by now have done everything?!! But I too am custodian of a cottage which has had its heart ripped out of it. I spent last summer using a 'Scutch hammer' to remove all the emulsion paint that had been used to paint the exterior. This paint had in many places 'blown' from the rubblestone so its was really pretty easy just very messy to do. I used to do a section at a time each evening after work. So a Scutch hammer is a very useful tool. I have two sections to do this year and then its done, But I can tell you it was worth every bit of mess as it looks so much nicer now limewashed, Cement ribbon pointing - thats a tougher deal and my approach would be to only redo teh joints as and when teh mortar comes away. Its a huge job to repoint everything and teh danger is you lose heart doing this day after day when there may be other tasks that you would be better expending your energy on. Good luck

 

[MdB]

For those like me who didn't know what a Scutch hammer, its one of these:

 

[Nemesis]

Not recommended unless last resort though... removal of blown material yes, used gently, but...

 

[Flyfisher]

Is that hammer missing the actual scutching 'bits'?

I have a scutching chisel and it has a replaceable toothed 'bit' that fits into a slot at the end of the chisel. Looks like the hammer has a similar slot for something. Or am I thinking of something else?

 

[Penners]

I dunno, but this conversation is bringing tears to my eyes... :x

 

[MdB]

Is that hammer missing the actual scutching 'bits'?

I have a scutching chisel and it has a replaceable toothed 'bit' that fits into a slot at the end of the chisel. Looks like the hammer has a similar slot for something. Or am I thinking of something else?

I think you are right. Searching a little more found this:

together with this

combined:

It would go straight through my stonework as its so soft. Fortunately most of the paint I want to remove is peeling off by itself so should be easy to remove.

 

[Flyfisher]

Yep, that's exactly the little 'bit' I meant.

BTW, I last used my scutching chisel for channelling brick and cement mortar walls when I re-wired a kitchen in a 1950's house about 15 years ago. I entirely agree with the previous sentiments that it's a rather 'fierce' tool for removing external paintwork!

In fact, from direct experience of how good it was for channeling out hard brickwork, I find it hard to believe it could remove paint without doing significant damage to the underlying material.

 

[MdB]

If your wall is made out of granite then it is probably the sort of thing you need.

 

[rebeccac]

You have my sincere sympathy We've spent weeks hacking cement off our beautiful Limestone house in Italy both inside and out and its the worse job possible.

we live on the border of Devon /Cornwall and it makes me feel really sad to see these lovely old cottages 'improved' so they have no soul.If you can get back something of your cottages soul it will be a very worthwhile task!

good luck.

 

[worms]

I find it hard to believe it could remove paint without doing significant damage to the underlying material

If your wall is made out of granite then it is probably the sort of thing you need

It also depends how hard you wield it! I tried the "pick" end of a geologists' hammer to do a similar job on part of a rubble stone gable wall here. It was too slow to persevere with but the tapping action was good for loosening the many layers of old paint. I reckon a proper scutch hammer would have worked better and faster, but only a light tapping action is required!

One warning though, some of the stones that I cleared in this way still appear damp , despite many layers of limewash, and have grown moss over the winter. While sections of the wall where I wasn't as thorough in the removal of the old paint look much more even, with a better limewash finish.