Ceiling repair possible

[Danthepole]

Hello. I’m a new member to the forum and am currently undertaking a renovation project in Morecambe Lancashire.
I wanted to ask any lime plasters out there if they thought this ceiling could be repaired to a usable, but not flawless standard?
It‘s the top floor of the property, with a cold loft space above and where a stud partition has been removed down the centre of the room.

 

[Kearn]

Absolutely. Remaining plaster needs cutting back to sound and 45deg angle on the edges so new lime goes slightly under. Laths all look decent assuming still attached, if not, easy to re-fix with stainless screws.

Plastering above head is a pig of a job though!

 

[Danthepole]

Thank for the reply Kearn.
Is there anything other than moisture to consolidate the cut back edges to help the bond between old and new?

 

[Lacan07]

Hello. I’m a new member to the forum and am currently undertaking a renovation project in Morecambe Lancashire.
I wanted to ask any lime plasters out there if they thought this ceiling could be repaired to a usable, but not flawless standard?
It‘s the top floor of the property, with a cold loft space above and where a stud partition has been removed down the centre of the room.

View attachment 12296

View attachment 12297

View attachment 12298

View attachment 12299

View attachment 12300

View attachment 12301

Yeah, that's repairable.

 

[Kearn]

Thank for the reply Kearn.
Is there anything other than moisture to consolidate the cut back edges to help the bond between old and new?

Ah, misread plasterer in that you were looking for one to do the job, if you’re having a go, there’s a lot more to it…!

I’ll be honest, I’m yet to have a go above head, aside from tall walls. Principle the same, execution different - Laths need damping down a good hour or two before hand, (same for the edges) that’s once all flimsy ones have been replaced. You’ll want a well haired / hemp mix that will hang on and resist cracking - the hard part, is you don’t trowel on and overwork, you kind of flop it on with one firm motion, to force the mix through the laths to form the nibs behind and hold on. Once the mix has almost been flung against the lath, any trowelling needs to be minimal to avoid drawing the mix back out from behind the lath and losing the key. Equally you need a decent finish, and it looks like maybe only a single coat or a scratch plus very fine finish coat?

Cutting into the edges needs to be pushed under slightly on the angle, to get the physical let (moisture too) then left a bit proud to allow for some shrinkage. Unless of course a finish coat is going over, then that happens here with post plastering management.

 

[Stevers]

Not knowing any better, all of my lath and plaster ceiling repairs have been carried out using Thistle One Coat. I always wetted down and usually applied dilute PVA Bond. None of those repairs have ever come unstuck, though the gaps between our lathes are more generous. Probably worth trying out your proposed repair techiques on some test patches first.

 

[Lacan07]

Ah, misread plasterer in that you were looking for one to do the job, if you’re having a go, there’s a lot more to it…!

I’ll be honest, I’m yet to have a go above head, aside from tall walls. Principle the same, execution different - Laths need damping down a good hour or two before hand, (same for the edges) that’s once all flimsy ones have been replaced. You’ll want a well haired / hemp mix that will hang on and resist cracking - the hard part, is you don’t trowel on and overwork, you kind of flop it on with one firm motion, to force the mix through the laths to form the nibs behind and hold on. Once the mix has almost been flung against the lath, any trowelling needs to be minimal to avoid drawing the mix back out from behind the lath and losing the key. Equally you need a decent finish, and it looks like maybe only a single coat or a scratch plus very fine finish coat?

Cutting into the edges needs to be pushed under slightly on the angle, to get the physical let (moisture too) then left a bit proud to allow for some shrinkage. Unless of course a finish coat is going over, then that happens here with post plastering management.

Good advice above.

An alternative route perhaps, I repaired some ceilings with an NHL insulating plaster called Lime Green Ultra. The Lime centre in Winchester make their own cheaper version. Its super lightweight so easily applied to a ceiling (big curls around the lath) and the insulation binder acts like hair in a traditional mix. Then finish with putty based fine coat.

 

[a twig]

I’ve done a few lath ceilings with haired lime plaster, it’s hard work but definitely doable.

Kearn’s advice is pretty spot on - I’d add one bit of advice - don’t overload your trowel, and potentially you would want the mix slightly more dry than when you are doing walls to minimise the amount that doesn’t grip and falls on your face.

Really pay attention to where you are blending the edges of the repair into the existing plaster, you can’t rescue it by sanding it back to get a smooth finish in the way you can with modern plaster. First ceiling I did in two halves and did not do this, so I ended up with a noticeable “seam” down the middle of the room where the two halves met.

For convenience I’d recommend getting tubs / bags of pre-mixed haired mortar from somewhere like Ty Mawr, makes it a lot less painful

 

[noj]

And wear safety glasses at ALL times! Particularly those moments when you just go back to press a little bit that seems to need it...

Little bits of lime in the eye are really not nice.

I tend to wear a cap too since I'm a bit sparse in the hair department. Just end up with little lime burns where I touch the side of my face taking the glasses off.

 

[Danthepole]

Yeah, that's repairable.

Yeah, that's repairable.

 

[Danthepole]

Thank you all.
I’m near Eden hot mix lime and will probably get some premixed from there. One less thing to worry about getting right.

I’ve wall repairs too. In my mind the ceiling ones should be done first?

And I’ll definitely be wearing goggles, hat and have a eye wash near by.

 

[Danthepole]

Not knowing any better, all of my lath and plaster ceiling repairs have been carried out using Thistle One Coat. I always wetted down and usually applied dilute PVA Bond. None of those repairs have ever come unstuck, though the gaps between our lathes are more generous. Probably worth trying out your proposed repair techiques on some test patches first.

I’ve a small repair in a corner and will use this as a trial.

 

[noj]

I'd be inclined to do the wall repairs first. They're easier and will give you experience of the mix and how it behaves before working overhead

 

[Danthepole]

I'd be inclined to do the wall repairs first. They're easier and will give you experience of the mix and how it behaves before working overhead

Sounds good to me.
I know it’ll be a steep learning curve, but I’m looking forward to it.

 

[Kearn]

I'd be inclined to do the wall repairs first. They're easier and will give you experience of the mix and how it behaves before working overhead

Absolutely start here. It will take a while to feel the right consistency of mix and you can practice more easily with less consequences on a wall.

 

[Kearn]

Thank you all.
I’m near Eden hot mix lime and will probably get some premixed from there. One less thing to worry about getting right.

I’ve wall repairs too. In my mind the ceiling ones should be done first?

And I’ll definitely be wearing goggles, hat and have a eye wash near by.

Be prepared for the shower attack!! Probably less chance here, but if you end up with lime dust on your skin removing / cleaning up old lime, you won’t really notice until it gets wet in the shower

Worth a cheap see through boiler suit to cover skin…!