The builder has made a bit of a mess of the beams whilst doing his work, what is the best way to clean, and what could I put on to protect afterwards - he suggest Osmo Hardwax Oil? Same for the flags in the fireplace - just beeswax? Or something else? I'm confusing myself reading far too much. Thanks,
- Thread starter TheSpid
- Start date
Dont know others thoughts but the Osmo polyx wax oil is great... but its an oil which does leave a bit of a smell and releases VOCs. I'm using beeswax only on my uncovered beams / new oak... will require a bit more upkeep I'm aware.
Flagstones there is a lot out there. There are some breathable / nanomaterial type cleaners / sealers which are meant to be good. A lot of people seem to use the Liberon stuff and some people will say stuff like boiled linseed oil or curdled milk or something. Personally I think a nice breathable bottle sealer might be the best option!!!
I seem to remember Lime.org (Ty Mawr) had stuff which would solve both your problems.
Flagstones there is a lot out there. There are some breathable / nanomaterial type cleaners / sealers which are meant to be good. A lot of people seem to use the Liberon stuff and some people will say stuff like boiled linseed oil or curdled milk or something. Personally I think a nice breathable bottle sealer might be the best option!!!
I seem to remember Lime.org (Ty Mawr) had stuff which would solve both your problems.
Don't put anything on old timbers. Clean them and leave them. Osmo Polyx is an oil/ varnish mix. Would you put varnish on old timbers? (The correct answer to that is no!! 
Putting any finish at all on old timbers, or even new oak framing, is just starting the whole coat-strip-and-re-coat cycle all over again. In 20 years time it will look terrible, whatever you put on it, and so you or someone else will put some more on, or something else on over it to hide it.....and before you know it there'll be half a dozen layers on, and some oaf standing in front of it with a sand blaster in his hand.
Putting any finish at all on old timbers, or even new oak framing, is just starting the whole coat-strip-and-re-coat cycle all over again. In 20 years time it will look terrible, whatever you put on it, and so you or someone else will put some more on, or something else on over it to hide it.....and before you know it there'll be half a dozen layers on, and some oaf standing in front of it with a sand blaster in his hand.MikeG said:Don't put anything on old timbers. Clean them and leave them. Osmo Polyx is an oil/ varnish mix. Would you put varnish on old timbers? (The correct answer to that is no!!
Thanks Mike - I was reading in my Period House restoration book about using beeswax and turps - especially for slightly friable bits where old woodworm has been. I mentioned that to my builder which is when he suggested the Osmo. Do you not think beeswax either? And just hot soapy water for cleaning?
Cubist
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Hi TheSpid,
First it depends on what finish was used on the beams before your builder got to work.
Second is that it depends on the nature of the mess/damage made/done by the builder. Safe to assume that he's slopped plaster and perhaps paint over them? Or something else, if so please enlighten us.
If the beams and posts were natural oak, which in my view is the ideal, the solution is technically easy but time consuming. If my assumption regarding the nature of the mess is correct I would proceed as soon as possible with the work as the paint and plaster may be easier to remove. The approach would be to use the blade of a plasterers metal float and a good wire brush. The float is used as both a guide and a means of protecting the plaster/paint at the edge of the beam or post, the wire brush is used to remove unwanted plaster and paint from the beam or post. Some plaster or paint will inevitably have found its way into small holes or fissures in the surface of the timber and the wire brush may fail to remove these - a small scraper or a small, slot head, screw driver will get these out. Be careful not to be too heavy handed with the wire brush as it can remove the softer parts of the wood leaving the kind of corrugated appearance one typically sees with very old external timbers or driftwood - N.B. This is why it is most often a bad idea to use a sand/media blaster which can also strip away the paint and plaster near the edges of the timbers.
If the timbers were previously treated with a varnish or heavy wax you may have an easier time as the unwanted plaster and paint is unlikely to have made a solid bond throughout. Here, the best solution in my view would be to remove as much as possible using the edge of a narrow paint scraper while again using the plasterers float as a guide and to prevent/limit any unwanted damage to the walls/ceiling. Use a craft knife to cut through the paint and plaster along the paint line/timber edge to avoid the risk of removing any wanted paint/plaster from the wall/ceiling. Make sure also though that the blade edge of the scraper is fairly dull and you keep a shallow angle of attack to prevent the scraper from taking any of the varnish/wax finish or digging into the timber. Next use a cloth made damp in soapy water to remove any remaining unwanted plaster or paint - a little elbow grease can be needed here. Afterwards, be careful to wipe down the areas you have cleaned with a cloth made damp with clean water to neutralise anything unpleasant in the detergent. With a wax finish you can also use a little methylated spirit on a cloth to spread some of the reaming wax around to cover lighter patches where you have taken too much.
If the original finish was oil, proceed as per the natural oak solution above but be aware that you may need to apply a little oil to match the colour finish - or alternatively wire brush the entire exposed surface of the timbers to get a uniform colour finish.
The worst of all timber treatments in my view is wax suspended in either water or oil :evil: . Once the water or oil has evaporated this stuff leaves wax behind and it can be nigh on impossible to get a uniform colour finish unless you wire brush every exposed surface.
Hope this helps and that the builders mess was limited to just sloppy plaster/paint work.
By the way - I have had to do this on both the interior and exterior of our place. It can be a tedious and time consuming task but well worth it in the end. Thinking about it though, its eight years since we bought this old place, and I'm not sure I've got all of the unwanted paint, plaster or render yet; b£$£%r.
Cheers,
Cubist
First it depends on what finish was used on the beams before your builder got to work.
Second is that it depends on the nature of the mess/damage made/done by the builder. Safe to assume that he's slopped plaster and perhaps paint over them? Or something else, if so please enlighten us.
If the beams and posts were natural oak, which in my view is the ideal, the solution is technically easy but time consuming. If my assumption regarding the nature of the mess is correct I would proceed as soon as possible with the work as the paint and plaster may be easier to remove. The approach would be to use the blade of a plasterers metal float and a good wire brush. The float is used as both a guide and a means of protecting the plaster/paint at the edge of the beam or post, the wire brush is used to remove unwanted plaster and paint from the beam or post. Some plaster or paint will inevitably have found its way into small holes or fissures in the surface of the timber and the wire brush may fail to remove these - a small scraper or a small, slot head, screw driver will get these out. Be careful not to be too heavy handed with the wire brush as it can remove the softer parts of the wood leaving the kind of corrugated appearance one typically sees with very old external timbers or driftwood - N.B. This is why it is most often a bad idea to use a sand/media blaster which can also strip away the paint and plaster near the edges of the timbers.
If the timbers were previously treated with a varnish or heavy wax you may have an easier time as the unwanted plaster and paint is unlikely to have made a solid bond throughout. Here, the best solution in my view would be to remove as much as possible using the edge of a narrow paint scraper while again using the plasterers float as a guide and to prevent/limit any unwanted damage to the walls/ceiling. Use a craft knife to cut through the paint and plaster along the paint line/timber edge to avoid the risk of removing any wanted paint/plaster from the wall/ceiling. Make sure also though that the blade edge of the scraper is fairly dull and you keep a shallow angle of attack to prevent the scraper from taking any of the varnish/wax finish or digging into the timber. Next use a cloth made damp in soapy water to remove any remaining unwanted plaster or paint - a little elbow grease can be needed here. Afterwards, be careful to wipe down the areas you have cleaned with a cloth made damp with clean water to neutralise anything unpleasant in the detergent. With a wax finish you can also use a little methylated spirit on a cloth to spread some of the reaming wax around to cover lighter patches where you have taken too much.
If the original finish was oil, proceed as per the natural oak solution above but be aware that you may need to apply a little oil to match the colour finish - or alternatively wire brush the entire exposed surface of the timbers to get a uniform colour finish.
The worst of all timber treatments in my view is wax suspended in either water or oil :evil: . Once the water or oil has evaporated this stuff leaves wax behind and it can be nigh on impossible to get a uniform colour finish unless you wire brush every exposed surface.
Hope this helps and that the builders mess was limited to just sloppy plaster/paint work.
By the way - I have had to do this on both the interior and exterior of our place. It can be a tedious and time consuming task but well worth it in the end. Thinking about it though, its eight years since we bought this old place, and I'm not sure I've got all of the unwanted paint, plaster or render yet; b£$£%r.
Cheers,
Cubist
TheSpid said:
I tape all mine up prior to plastering, using duck tape. Masking tape doesn't do the job. I think it is oxalic acid which you can use to clean up the tanin-reaction with, but I haven't checked so don't rely on that. It's much better to tape up, though, than have to splash acid around afterwards.
88v8
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I taped all mine. and the lintels and window boards (smug face) with masking tape before plastering. Conventional tape which sticks well but is not very robust, then over the top of it Gorilla tape which is low tack but quite strong. Didn't think to try duct tape.
Any tape left in place too long will become a problem as the glue becomes gloopy. A couple of weeks, tops. After that, you're into scraping and white spirit to get the glue off.
Hard to get plaster (or paint) out of oak. The grain can be quite open and it sinks in. I spent god knows how many hours getting the paint off an oak window and carved fireplace years ago.
Anyway... a variety of brass-bristled brushes will do the least harm. Tricky to get into the corners and angles though. There, you may need some coarse sandpaper, or a paint scrpaer. The belts of a belt sander, cut up, are pretty stiff.
Thing with builders, few of them are interested in protecting your house. You either have to stand over them or do that yourself, and then check they aren't damaging the protection. After a while, they get blasé and stop being careful.
When you've got the mess off, Mike makes a good point about coatings.
I've been using wax on rustic oak. Sand to get the real roughness off, not by any means looking to get it smooth, just not rough. Sometimes no sandpaper, just the brass bristled brush. Then one coat of wax, Briwax (sorry Toby) or Liberon, applied with a cloth or a polish-putting-on brush,** left half an hour then buffed with a brush. Use an old toothbrush to get intro the angles and corners. One coat of wax, never touch it again.
But, there's always a but, if you get wax on the wall/ceiling, you won't able to paint or paper. So you have to mask it, using low-tack masking tape, or use a George. Edit; I see George has morphed into a lump of plastic. What's now known as a paint shield.
One coat of wax. A satisfying glow.
Ivor
**historical note for younger readers: shoes used to be made of leather, which needs poiishing. To polish, apply wax with a brush, leave a few minutes then brush off. Unlike modern shoes, leather shoes last for years, and leather soles and heels can be repaired, so when the heels or soles wear, unlike your plimsolls - sorry, trainers - they do not become landfill.
Any tape left in place too long will become a problem as the glue becomes gloopy. A couple of weeks, tops. After that, you're into scraping and white spirit to get the glue off.
Hard to get plaster (or paint) out of oak. The grain can be quite open and it sinks in. I spent god knows how many hours getting the paint off an oak window and carved fireplace years ago.
Anyway... a variety of brass-bristled brushes will do the least harm. Tricky to get into the corners and angles though. There, you may need some coarse sandpaper, or a paint scrpaer. The belts of a belt sander, cut up, are pretty stiff.
Thing with builders, few of them are interested in protecting your house. You either have to stand over them or do that yourself, and then check they aren't damaging the protection. After a while, they get blasé and stop being careful.
When you've got the mess off, Mike makes a good point about coatings.
I've been using wax on rustic oak. Sand to get the real roughness off, not by any means looking to get it smooth, just not rough. Sometimes no sandpaper, just the brass bristled brush. Then one coat of wax, Briwax (sorry Toby) or Liberon, applied with a cloth or a polish-putting-on brush,** left half an hour then buffed with a brush. Use an old toothbrush to get intro the angles and corners. One coat of wax, never touch it again.
But, there's always a but, if you get wax on the wall/ceiling, you won't able to paint or paper. So you have to mask it, using low-tack masking tape, or use a George. Edit; I see George has morphed into a lump of plastic. What's now known as a paint shield.
One coat of wax. A satisfying glow.
Ivor
**historical note for younger readers: shoes used to be made of leather, which needs poiishing. To polish, apply wax with a brush, leave a few minutes then brush off. Unlike modern shoes, leather shoes last for years, and leather soles and heels can be repaired, so when the heels or soles wear, unlike your plimsolls - sorry, trainers - they do not become landfill.