A career in conservation?

[Manny]

I've recently become disillusioned and unhappy with my current position. For a long time my passion has been for conservation of older buildings... and of course my pet project (read: bottomless money pit!) of my own listed property.

I came to the conclusion that I'd rather quite like to work for the council. Perhaps as a Conservation Officer, but I'm not really sure what the requirements are, or what that would pay.

So, what hope is there for a reasonably senior private sector quantity surveyor in the world of conservation? Has anyone undergone a similar change of career? Does anyone read enough relevant publications to have a feel for the level of demand for employees? Does anyone want to give me a job!?

 

[Nemesis]

I rather suspect that you might become even more disillusioned if you became a CO...

There's some basic info here:

http://www.prospects.ac.uk/cms/ShowPage/Home_page/Explore_types_of_jobs/Types_of_Job/p!eipaL?state=showocc&idno=117

However, I think you might find that not all local authorities employ a CO, and many will tell you, weeping into their beers, of it being a hard and lonely job...

 

[stickybeak]

.

 

[Gareth Hughes]

I've recently become disillusioned and unhappy with my current position. For a long time my passion has been for conservation of older buildings... and of course my pet project (read: bottomless money pit!) of my own listed property.

I came to the conclusion that I'd rather quite like to work for the council. Perhaps as a Conservation Officer, but I'm not really sure what the requirements are, or what that would pay.

So, what hope is there for a reasonably senior private sector quantity surveyor in the world of conservation? Has anyone undergone a similar change of career? Does anyone read enough relevant publications to have a feel for the level of demand for employees? Does anyone want to give me a job!?

No, don't do it. Life as a Norfolk CO only looks great when viewed through the bottom of a (large) glass...

 

[Nemesis]

You don't seem to be alone in that view...

 

[Pford75]

>Rant on<

Oh come on....not the old sob story about how hard it is to be a CO :wink:

I can think of hundreds of jobs with longer hours, more stress and less pay. If you can't stand the heat........

Working for local gov't, the pension is a damn site better than most....the hours are not exactly unreasonable and you get to go home to your family most nights.

>Rant off<

 

[Nemesis]

I think you would find that it's not a job many CO's would recommend. I know as I do know a few.

A pension isn't eveything, job satisfaction is. And actually local gov pensions aren't the honeypot many seem to think.

Maybe you don't get home at nights but get paid well enough to compensate? And maybe you don't feel marginalised in your work by others who should take notice of you but don't? Conservation is about at the bottom of the heap as far as most planning depts go. and with many of the public thinking your decisons are wrong? Even when they are legally correct... and then you have councillors on development committees...

It's the last career I would consider! Many are doing a heroic job however. Skilled and highly qualified people who care.

You really haven't a clue I feel.

 

[Pford75]

My comments were slightly tongue in cheek...but since you mention it...if someone isn't happy in their job....then they should leave....CO or any other job. I have no sympathy for people (in any walk of life) who moan and whinge about their lot, but do nothing about it. If it's not bad enough to warrant leaving, then quit moaning....just spare me the sob stories.

Local gov't pensions are a damn sight better than the 000's of private sector workers who have ended up with nothing as a result of bankruptices etc. I agree they are hardly the gold-plated money-pots the tabloids would like to believe but they aren't bad (I have 3 close family members in local and central gov't so I have the data to back this up)

Conservation may be "at the bottom of the heap" as far as planning depts. go, but it's still better than double-glazing sales, working at McDonalds, being posted in Iraq, labouring on a farm etc. etc.

My point is not to suggest that the life of a CO is a bed of roses....but to suggest that it is "the last career I would consider", would seem to indicate that you haven't considered many other careers.

I would have thougt that we should be encouraging, not discouraging anyone who shows an interest in pursuing a career in conservation. Sure, point out the challenges....but it's hardly the toughest job in the world. I'm sure most CO's are highly skilled....in fact I posted on another topic following a meeting with my own CO this very morning. He clearly knows a lot about his subject and is passionate about it as well....I applaud anyone who does that job....but let's get some perspective....it's still largely a white-collar, 9-5 job with reasonable pay and benefits and little likelihood of being fired at any moment.

 

[Nemesis]

It's possibly a better job than many you mention, but I really wouldn't equate the skills and qualifications required to work at a burger bar with those required to be a skilled CO.

I'm in the fortunate position of having my career behind me. I don't have to make any decisons regarding that.

As far as pensions are concerned, it's rather a sad thing to do a job simply because of the possibility of a certain level of pension.
I have many friends who work in conservation, in a variety of roles. It very much a thankless task in the main.

At the moment (and this has been raised at Commons Select Committee level) being a CO not a job I would recommend anyone to consider, sadly. I do know a number of those who have left through sheer disillusionment. They are people passionate about conservation. Yes we need more, and we need them to be valued. It in so many cases doesn't happen. To change a career and retrain for something which may not be the job someone thought it was it rather a risky move.

I wonder what you think a CO does?

 

[Pford75]

Manny - hopefully this will be helpful


The work
Countryside/conservation officers are involved in the management, protection and improvement of the local environment. The work is varied, and can cover the following areas.

Landscape conservation, which may include:

putting into practise schemes to conserve existing features, restore degraded landscapes or create new landscapes
environmental impact assessments and field surveys
promoting national and local initiatives
advising farmers, landowners and developers.
Nature conservation, which may include:
putting into practise schemes for the management, protection and creation of habitats
developing and putting into practise local action plans as part of the UK Biodiversity Action Plan
advising farmers, landowners, and the public.
Access to the countryside, which may include:
promoting rights of way through publications and guided walks
ensuring designated routes are adequately maintained and marked
developing areas to attract visitors
dealing with issues such as applications to divert rights of way
developing access routes, such as cycle paths and routes suitable for pushchair and wheelchair users.
Community involvement, interpretation and education, which may include:
organising/supporting activities and projects to encourage community participation
organising, training and supporting volunteers and/or paid staff
promoting conservation issues through talks, displays, workshops and literature
encouraging schools to take part in 'environmental interpretation' – pond-dipping, tree identification walks etc.
The work also involves:

keeping detailed records
analysing data
writing information leaflets and press releases
preparing applications for funding
assessing applications for funding from other organisations.

Hours and Environment
Countryside/conservation officers usually work 37.5 hours a week. This often includes making early starts or attending evening meetings. It may be necessary to work some weekends and public holidays. Temporary and seasonal work is often available.

Although the work is office-based, officers may spend a lot of time working outside in all weathers. They spend time travelling to meetings and to sites, so they usually need a driving licence.


Skills and Interests
To work as a countryside/conservation officer you should:

have interest and enthusiasm for the countryside and conservation issues
be confident and assertive
be able to work on your own initiative and as part of a team
be capable of making technical and scientific issues clear to a variety of people, both verbally and in writing
be able to communicate effectively with individuals and with groups, through talks, presentations and meetings
be tactful and diplomatic
have good IT skills.

Entry

You will usually need a degree or BTEC/SQA HND/foundation degree in a subject such as:

countryside/environmental management
conservation and environment
environmental sciences
ecology
geography.
If you already have a degree which is not in a relevant subject It could be an advantage to do a related postgraduate qualification.

For entry to a degree you will usually need:

at least five GCSEs (A-C)/S grades (1-3); and
two A levels/three H grades, or equivalent qualifications such as AVCE/GSVQ Level III.
For entry to a BTEC/SQA HND/foundation degree you usually need:

three GCSEs (A-C)/S grades (1-3); and
one A levels/two H grades, or the equivalent.
An Access to Higher Education qualification may also be accepted for entry to certain courses.

Please check with colleges or universities for exact entry requirements.

For most posts you will need practical work experience as well as qualifications. You may be able to get this is by volunteering with organisations such as:

the Wildlife Trusts
the Woodland Trust
the National Trust
British Trust for Conservation Volunteers
Groundwork.
You should contact them for information about local opportunities. Details are in the Further Information section. Some of these organisations offer training for their volunteers.

It may be possible to get paid employment at a lower level and work your way up. For example, please see the Countryside Ranger/Warden profile.


Training

When you are employed as a conservation officer you can add to your skills and knowledge by taking courses such as those offered by the Field Studies Council and the British Trust for Conservation Volunteers. You can find details are on the organisations' websites. Please see Further Information.

You can work towards NVQs/SVQs in Environmental Conservation at levels 2 and 3.

Some employers support staff in undertaking continuous professional development (CPD), such as studying for a postgraduate qualification, which is often a requirement for senior posts.

It will be useful to join professional bodies such as the Institute of Ecology and Environmental Management (IEEM) as this will give you professional recognition and opportunities for CPD and networking. Please see the Further Information section for contact details.


Opportunities

There are opportunities with:

local government
government agencies such as English Nature
charitable trusts such as the National Trust and the Woodland Trust
environmental consultancies.
There is a lot of competition for jobs.

With experience and further qualifications it may be possible to progress to become senior officer or countryside manager.

There may be opportunities to work overseas for national government and conservation organisations. Some officers move into lecturing, teaching or journalism.


Annual Income
Figures are intended as a guideline only.

Starting salaries are likely to be around £16,000 a year.
Experienced officers may earn over £30,000.
[/b]

 

[Pford75]

Try this link for sources of vacancies

http://www.prospects.ac.uk/cms/Show...f_Job/p!eipaL?state=showocc&idno=117&pageno=6

 

[Pford75]

From a brief trawl of the web, it would seem that new CO's earn somewhere in the region of £16k (which is not bad for an HND/HNC graduate - my last two companies have employed degree graduates on similar salaries, without the other local gov't perks and working considerably longer hours, with no overtime).

It would also seem that a senior conservation officer can earn between £36k-£40k. Not sure what constitutes 'senior' in terms of number of years experience...not exactly a pittance. Adding in the other perks of LA employment and the availability of overtime (which no private sector worker at this level would get) and it doesn't look quite so bad.

Furthermore, there are plenty of testimonials from happy & satisified CO's available on the web, who enjoy their job, recognise that there are challenges (aren't there in every job?) and love the opportunity to work with something they are passionate about (historic buildings).

 

[Nemesis]

Well fine - but I urge caution.

I'm afraid the stuff you posted re the work of CO's is a bit muddled in reality - there are many forms of conservation, but best not mix them all up together. What you posted has not a lot to do with historic building conservation. Very different indeed.

I presume that you are heavily involved in conservation, and know a large number of CO's and others employed by conservation organisations. I can't say I have come across those hordes of testimonials on the web, I saw a few 'case studies' via the link I posted above. It has rather more relevant information, although it's very generalised.

I do know I've just edited the newsletter for a national conservation organisation which tells a different tale from the mouths of many CO's who aren't finding their jobs too rewarding. Yes they are passionate about historic building conservation, but sadly they are lone voices in their local authorities. Of course a considerable number of local authorities do not employ a CO.

Mostly nowadays they have rather more than an HND - I wouldn't consider thinking of applying without at least an advanced diploma or MSc in historic conservation (and then some experience such as case worker for an amenity society). Many have rather more qualifications than that.

The high salaries you quote are not those enjoyed by more than handful with senior positions. The reality also is that jobs are hard to come by and following retraining (the above MSc or similar) a stint as a volunteer or a low (although quite skilled and pressured) paid role in a conservation organisation tends to be the route in.

So many things to consider before thinking of a career change.

 

[Nemesis]

I note that according to the website quoted above, a quantity surveyor earns:

Range of typical starting salaries: £17,000 - £27,000 (salary data collected Sep 06). Obtaining chartered status will increase both your job and salary options.
Range of typical salaries at senior level may be £30,000 - £55,000 (salary data collected Sep 06). Principal partners in private practice may earn substantially more.
Contractors pay at a slightly higher rate and £20,000 is not an uncommon starting salary. Shift and site allowances are often paid on top of the basic salary. Company packages may include a car, pension and healthcare.
Salary increases reflect the gaining of qualifications and responsibilities undertaken.

I do know a former conservation professional who is retraining...


Local gov pension schemes - they don't come free. Employees have to contribute.

And before you leap at the thought of overtime - check that it is paid... a salary is usually just that.

 

[Nemesis]

As one CO who is registered on this site puts it on his profile:

Occupation: Architect, Conservation officer.

Not really akin to a burger bar vendor in skills level.


In order to qualify as an architect in the United Kingdom, it is necessary to complete qualifications that are recognised by both the Royal Institute of British Architects (RIBA) and the Architects Registration Board (ARB).

The standard entry route into the architecture profession takes a minimum of seven years. You must complete:

a first degree in architecture, known as RIBA part one - typically taking three or four years;
twelve months of supervised and recorded practical experience, referred to as stage one professional experience - this is commonly taken in architects' practices, but may be in any sector of the building industry, including construction and design;
two years of further study for a diploma or a secondary degree in architecture, known as RIBA part two;
twelve months' supervised and recorded work experience known as stage two professional experience - this must be in an architect's office under the supervision of a qualified architect;
the RIBA part three examination in professional practice and management, which the student can take on completion of the above (once this is completed you can register as an architect with the ARB and apply to become a chartered member of RIBA).
Entry is not possible with an HND only and entry without a degree is unlikely. There is, however, an alternative route to qualification, which does not involve full or part-time study at a school of architecture. The RIBA Examination in Architecture for office-based candidates is a RIBA-validated, ARB-prescribed programme delivered by Oxford Brookes University on behalf of RIBA. If you have worked for a minimum of six years in practice, you will be able to join the part one programme; if you already have part one and three years' experience, it is possible to register for part two.

 

[Gareth Hughes]

As one CO who is registered on this site puts it on his profile:

Occupation: Architect, Conservation officer.

Not really akin to a burger bar vendor in skills level.


In order to qualify as an architect in the United Kingdom, it is necessary to complete qualifications that are recognised by both the Royal Institute of British Architects (RIBA) and the Architects Registration Board (ARB).

The standard entry route into the architecture profession takes a minimum of seven years. You must complete:

a first degree in architecture, known as RIBA part one - typically taking three or four years;
twelve months of supervised and recorded practical experience, referred to as stage one professional experience - this is commonly taken in architects' practices, but may be in any sector of the building industry, including construction and design;
two years of further study for a diploma or a secondary degree in architecture, known as RIBA part two;
twelve months' supervised and recorded work experience known as stage two professional experience - this must be in an architect's office under the supervision of a qualified architect;
the RIBA part three examination in professional practice and management, which the student can take on completion of the above (once this is completed you can register as an architect with the ARB and apply to become a chartered member of RIBA).
Entry is not possible with an HND only and entry without a degree is unlikely. There is, however, an alternative route to qualification, which does not involve full or part-time study at a school of architecture. The RIBA Examination in Architecture for office-based candidates is a RIBA-validated, ARB-prescribed programme delivered by Oxford Brookes University on behalf of RIBA. If you have worked for a minimum of six years in practice, you will be able to join the part one programme; if you already have part one and three years' experience, it is possible to register for part two.

Though I live and work in an area which is rather odd salary-wise, and I'm probably paid more as a CO than I would be just down the road as a salaried architect with the same length of experience.

 

[Nemesis]

So the drinks are on you then Gareth? (My pension only stretches to a half of bitter at the pub on a Friday night...)

 

[babs]

A pension isn't eveything, job satisfaction is.

As per previous quote - have to agree fully. Just handed in notice after wkng 3 whole months! Boring financial services industry......extremely well paid.....but bored.

Going to work as travel consultant......completely different from all previous employment, but gotta be better than current situation.

Enjoy you job and I can tell you it makes a huge difference to how you feel!

ok - just thought id have my voice heard.........nothing to input into original topic of conversation though...

 

[glayzell]

If you think being a CO is hard work, try being a social worker.....

 

[Nemesis]

Close your eyes and consider the pension. If you live to collect it...