Timber spouting

johnandrew · Sep 28, 2009

Does anyone know how to go about getting some solid (ie, not planks joined together) timber guttering made in a decent hardwood? We have lots of tanalised softwood gutters available up here in Yorkshire but people look at me a bit odd if I ask about hardwood guttering.

I have seen Biff's webpage on wooden guttering and have see a few threads on here, but no mention of where I might get them.

Thanks

John

Cloudscape · Sep 28, 2009

I went looking through Google, mainly because I don't think I've ever seen (or noticed) wooden guttering.

I found this (in Yorkshire) - a company that seems to offer wooden guttering:

http://www.doddsroofing.co.uk/Guttering_Roofing_Yorkshire.htm

biffvernon · Sep 28, 2009

You get some interesting results if you search for "wood gutters" in Google Images, but as most of the results are from the USA it won't be what you want.

johnandrew · Sep 28, 2009

Thanks Guys

I asked Dodd's but they said I am too far away to make it feasible for them to do it. I suppose they may be able to tell me where to buy some.

I have seen the Blue Ox page which is rather good. Shame they aren't a bit nearer.

I am currently trying to get a dimensioned profile for a timber merchant down in Birmingham. I want the stuff like the photo on Biff's web page but cannot find that profile in softwood locally to get a sample from.

John

JoceAndChris · Sep 29, 2009

Ooh good luck, I'll be interested to hear how you get on so keep us posted!

This won't be of great help to you, but looking back at the paperwork for the house I see that our chestnut guttering was supplied and fitted by one RC Chambers of Stamford in 1985, and cost £3750. He copied the Georgian oak guttering that was here, but in very sorry state - I still have a number of bits of it lying about the place.

The previous owner would have done the lead work which sits on it himself. Chambers advertised himself as a carpenter, joiner and glass supplier, and his business is no longer going, but I wonder if you were to approach carpenters with a proven experience in period properties, with photos, drawings and measurements of what you require, how they would respond to your project.

Feltwell · Sep 29, 2009

JoceAndChris said:
our chestnut guttering was supplied and fitted by one RC Chambers of Stamford in 1985, and cost £3750.

Blimey - I thought cast iron was expensive enough. You're lucky the previous owner didn't just put modern plastic up.

JoceAndChris · Sep 29, 2009

Feltwell said:
You're lucky the previous owner didn't just put modern plastic up.

I know! I really do appreciate that he didn't, and all the other wonderful work of his own hands too. It's just such a pity he didn't understand about cement, and breathability.

I should have given the measurements - a rough calculation is about 42 metres of chestnut guttering here. I wonder how the prices compare to 1985. I find it amazing he was prepared to pay this high bill, but then I think that and a little bit of stonemasonry was the only non-DIY work he paid for in 26 years.

It's a pity the chestnut guttering isn't really working - but that's something to do with the wrongness of the roof, and shouldn't put johnandrew off having lovely hardwood guttering.

Penners · Sep 29, 2009

JoceAndChris said:
our chestnut guttering was supplied and fitted by one RC Chambers of Stamford in 1985, and cost £3750.

At that price, I hope it came with a house attached.

Flyfisher · Sep 29, 2009

That's £7250 in today's money (according to: http://www.whatsthecost.com/cpi.aspx).
Let's hope it was a quality job and won't need renewing in a hurry.

JoceAndChris · Sep 29, 2009

What a fascinating link.

You've made me really doubt this bill now. It does seem very high, particularly as I know the ingrained frugality of this man.

I'll check the paperwork tomorrow, make sure it doesn't have a little note attached to say the price includes a hidden passageway down to a secret chapel or something.

johnandrew · Sep 29, 2009

I spoke to a timber merchant today who recommended iroko as the most appropriate wood! He gave me a (very large) ball park figure of £2000 + VAT + delivery for 40m. He wasn't really taking account of any detailed moulding I might require. He suprised me, though, when he said that oak would be more expensive.

From what I've read sweet chesnut and elm are considered good choices for guttering.

biffvernon · Sep 29, 2009

I hope you don't go to that timber merchant again. Yes, sweet chestnut is durable, like oak, and elm performs particularly well in wet places.

DaveBrigg · Sep 29, 2009

biffvernon said:
I hope you don't go to that timber merchant again. Yes, sweet chestnut is durable, like oak, and elm performs particularly well in wet places.

So rainwater goods don't have to be sourced from a rainforest then?

Moo · Sep 30, 2009

This is in anticipation of the A-Z reaching I for Inflation:

Flyfisher said:
according to: http://www.whatsthecost.com/cpi.aspx ......

....the house we bought for £12,000.00 in 1971 is equivalent to £108,225.41 in 2009.

But a similar house in the same road was on the market a couple of years ago for £750,000.
If only we'd let rather than sold it.

(Assuming a yearly inflation rate of 2% from 2006 onwards)

JoceAndChris · Sep 30, 2009

That's so interesting Moo, and just confirms what is reported about young people being poorer than their parents. House prices have gone completely crazily out of kilter with inflation, even with the recent recession.

Just checked the paperwork for the guttering, and it's really true. The first letter,( which reads like something the hapless James Spinlove may have written in the delightful "Honeywood File" ) contains this:

"As discussed it is practically impossible to estimate a figure for the refixing of the box gutter to the lead work, as the details of the fixing cannot be obtained until the roof is stripped. We have therefore obtained a P.C. sum.
Estimate to: Timberwork to the roof. P.C. sum sum of: 3750.00 "

The invoice that arrives three months later is exactly that figure. What does P.C. mean?

johnandrew - do excuse us nattering away in your thread. What did your £2000 quotation include? Just the supply of wood - not fixing? It does seem an awful lot if so. The sweet chestnut here is still without fault, it's good stuff! I seem to remember reading in a thread somewhere that English oak is not easy to come by, whereas iroko is relatively cheap and readily available.

Flyfisher · Sep 30, 2009

Yes, I agree that house price inflation is not really comparable with the RPI. And Joce's point about young people today is so true; not only have house prices gone mad but many now have the prospect of £20-30k of university costs to repay as well. Still, I don't suppose they have 10-12% mortgages as we did.

I don't now what P.C. stands for but I know what it means (I think). It's used to denote an amount that has been allowed for but that the figure could change depending on what is found during the works. If that makes any sense.

MdB · Sep 30, 2009

JoceAndChris said:
... whereas iroko is relatively cheap and readily available.

http://www.oakworktops.com/pages.asp?page=24
(OK so this is from a very biased source)

johnandrew · Sep 30, 2009

A tiny step forward...

I sent a profile off to a timber merchant down south who seemed very helpful. They came back to me today and said they don't have the tooling to make the section I want from a single piece of timber but could produce it in three sections with tongue and groove ready to be glued together. He also expressed concern about stresses developing if scooping out a big section from a solid timber.

However, he did say that the people who have the tooling to do this sort of things would be patternmakers.

So, I'm now off down that route.

Moo · Sep 30, 2009

johnandrew said:
...ready to be glued together.

See A-Z: Adhesives

johnandrew · Sep 30, 2009

JoceAndChris said:
I should have given the measurements - a rough calculation is about 42 metres of chestnut guttering here. I wonder how the prices compare to 1985. I find it amazing he was prepared to pay this high bill, but then I think that and a little bit of stonemasonry was the only non-DIY work he paid for in 26 years.

JoceAndChris: Is your guttering machined from a solid chunk or made from planks? How long is the longest section?

I have made contact with a patternmaker who says he can do the machining for about £900. I now have to decided which timber to use. Ideally I would like elm but it seems I can only get that in lengths of about 2.5-3m meaning there will 2-3 joints per 10m run. Sweet chestnut seems to come in similar lengths but I think oak is available in longer lengths. Maybe western red cedar would work?

What seems clear is that it won't be cheap. £900 for the machining, £1500 for the timber, £??? for the installation.

Timber spouting

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